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The Bible made a mess of Christianity

Spiderman

Veteran Member
Matthew 5:17
"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets;

As I said, they went against God's word....where did Jesus say the Mosaic law didn't have to be followed?
Matthew 5:18
New International Version
For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished.

My point exactly! It's a load of confusion!
 

Kenny

Face to face with my Father
Premium Member
Matthew 5:17
"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets;

As I said, they went against God's word....where did Jesus say the Mosaic law didn't have to be followed?
He didn't ablolish it, He fulfilled it so as to start a new covenant:

Luke 22:20
Likewise also the cup after supper, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood, which is shed for you.

The Law is still good for understanding that we need a Savior
 

socharlie

Active Member
Matthew 5:17
"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets;

As I said, they went against God's word....where did Jesus say the Mosaic law didn't have to be followed?
Law and Prophets are Sections of Torah, Jesus meant that consciousness of Moses (Matt 5:20) needed to be modified - transform from points in the book into part of human essence, part of consciousness, human nature.
 

David T

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
Context is everything. Those books were referring to those books....may I ask who added or took away from those books?
LOL pope you may not be as nuts as you wish you were!!! To much city and not enough wilderness for some is a recipe for madness. I have yet to walk a trail and there is a homeless mentally ill person sitting by the side of the trail panhandling . Apparently they know enough that foot traffic increases donations. Or any of them walking by saying "what a great day for a hike, man the air is awesome smell those trees!" my only conclusion is it all appears to be a city, over domestication, issue only. It got the nietztches Fredrick and Carl for sure.
 

Spiderman

Veteran Member
He didn't ablolish it, He fulfilled it so as to start a new covenant:

Luke 22:20
Likewise also the cup after supper, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood, which is shed for you.

The Law is still good for understanding that we need a Savior
He commanded the early church to do the opposite of Mosaic law...yet you say he abolished nothing or that God would never command people to do the opposite of what he formerly commanded... I like you, but you are simply wrong :)

This isn't the only example of when God commanded people to do the opposite of what he earlier commanded
 

Enoch07

It's all a sick freaking joke.
Premium Member
I was in a psych ward with a guy that ripped his eyes out because scripture told him to.

Sounds like the "biblical scholars" who think snakes can speak. People can come up with some weird stuff that was not intended.

Here is a "dangerous book". Which caused people to kill.

The Catcher in the Rye in popular culture - Wikipedia

Or it could be that some people are just not stable or mature enough to handle some material.
 

SinSaber

Member
Christians became a lot more divided and splintered into thousands of denominations after the printing press when everyone could have their own personal copy of the Bible.

The Bible has verses that say the opposite of what other verses say, leading people to opposite beliefs.

There has to be an authority outside of scripture to settle those disputes.

I was in a psych ward with a guy that ripped his eyes out because scripture told him to.

Scripture can be dangerous.

The early Church had councils to settle such disputes.

The first Christians were not Bible Christians.

The Bible is a confusing book that was never meant to be the sole rule of sacred Theology. Nothing in the Bible says to test everything to see if it lines up with scripture. The opposite is actually proven true (Acts 15).

If the Church councils aren't guided by the holy Spirit, I see there is a hopeless division that will never be healed. Certainly knowing scripture does not solve the problem.

And Son of Sam was told to kill people by a dog. Dogs are really dangerous
 

Grandliseur

Well-Known Member
I was in a psych ward with a guy that ripped his eyes out because scripture told him to.

Scripture can be dangerous.
Ahh, then all words, even language should be abolished, and that is not what you would want or what can be done. Mental illness cannot be avoided. Unfortunately!

It is also unfortunate that a great many want to control others in regard to areas they should leave up to each. This desire to control things not part of scripture brings all kinds of confrontation, envy, and whatnot.
The first Christians were not Bible Christians.
Correct, yet incorrect:
That had much of what we have today. If you want to examine the internal evidence for this claim, please read this link:
link: Truth Seeker - The New Testament
 

Spiderman

Veteran Member
Ahh, then all words, even language should be abolished, and that is not what you would want or what can be done. Mental illness cannot be avoided. Unfortunately!

It is also unfortunate that a great many want to control others in regard to areas they should leave up to each. This desire to control things not part of scripture brings all kinds of confrontation, envy, and whatnot.

Correct, yet incorrect:
That had much of what we have today. If you want to examine the internal evidence for this claim, please read this link:
link: Truth Seeker - The New Testament
The first Christians didn't even have a new testament Canon. The Apostles didn't hand out scriptures to everyone.

I said nothing about abolishing anything.

And mental illness can be avoided if God heals people. He chooses not to because he wants people to be sick
 

Grandliseur

Well-Known Member
The first Christians didn't even have a new testament Canon. The Apostles didn't hand out scriptures to everyone.

I said nothing about abolishing anything.

And mental illness can be avoided if God heals people. He chooses not to because he wants people to be sick
My wife is suffering from age related problems, mental stuff. She is still lucid, but . . .

Life is filled with truly undesirable problems. As I said, you make love to your mistress of misery! :) (it seems) and, I think my problems being a hell of torment, fire and brimstone. :D

Long time ago, as a child, I knew a loving husband of someone whose wife got enraged at him for giving her yellow flowers. How sad the condition many of us are in. I think him a kind of saint to stay married to this woman for so many decades, until his death. But, he lost his faith because of it.
 

Spiderman

Veteran Member
My wife is suffering from age related problems, mental stuff. She is still lucid, but . . .

Life is filled with truly undesirable problems. As I said, you make love to your mistress of misery! :) (it seems) and, I think my problems being a hell of torment, fire and brimstone. :D

Long time ago, as a child, I knew a loving husband of someone whose wife got enraged at him for giving her yellow flowers. How sad the condition many of us are in. I think him a kind of saint to stay married to this woman for so many decades, until his death. But, he lost his faith because of it.
I'm very sorry to hear that.... I'm praying desperately for God to give me the gift of healing... your wife is at Calvary carrying her cross and atoning for the world's sins in Union with the cross of Christ. So are you Imo...depend on him for his strength!
 

Grandliseur

Well-Known Member
I'm very sorry to hear that.... I'm praying desperately for God to give me the gift of healing... your wife is at Calvary carrying her cross and atoning for the world's sins in Union with the cross of Christ. So are you Imo...depend on him for his strength!
I'm going to quote you a scripture or two, in case you might like them:
1 Pet 4:
1 Since therefore Christ suffered in the flesh, arm yourselves with the same way of thinking, for whoever has suffered in the flesh has ceased from sin, 2 so as to live for the rest of the time in the flesh no longer for human passions but for the will of God.​
When suffering in the flesh for our sins, we realize that our only way forward is to rely not on self, but on God who gives strength. Thus, an awareness of what sins we committed, permits us to in most cases avoid future indulgence in this, living now no longer to satisfy our lust, but living to satisfy God.

12 Beloved, do not be surprised at the fiery trial when it comes upon you to test you, as though something strange were happening to you. 13 But rejoice insofar as you share Christ's sufferings, that you may also rejoice and be glad when his glory is revealed. 14 If you are insulted for the name of Christ, you are blessed, because the Spirit of glory and of God rests upon you. 15 But let none of you suffer as a murderer or a thief or an evildoer or as a meddler. 16 Yet if anyone suffers as a Christian, let him not be ashamed, but let him glorify God in that name. 17 For it is time for judgment to begin at the household of God; and if it begins with us, what will be the outcome for those who do not obey the gospel of God? 18 And
“If the righteous is scarcely saved,
what will become of the ungodly and the sinner?”​
Same chapter.
In this the theme of suffering is treated. Thus when our relief comes, even though Paradise might not be the kind of Paradise we would like it to be, we shall rejoice since our suffering is at an end.

Here then, daily prayer, and prayer for comfort, to help us with our daily problems and pain - helps us to survive the daily grind.
 

Grandliseur

Well-Known Member
I'm very sorry to hear that.... I'm praying desperately for God to give me the gift of healing... your wife is at Calvary carrying her cross and atoning for the world's sins in Union with the cross of Christ. So are you Imo...depend on him for his strength!
I'm going to quote you a scripture or two, in case you might like them:
1 Pet 4:
1 Since therefore Christ suffered in the flesh, arm yourselves with the same way of thinking, for whoever has suffered in the flesh has ceased from sin, 2 so as to live for the rest of the time in the flesh no longer for human passions but for the will of God.​
When suffering in the flesh for our sins, we realize that our only way forward is to rely not on self, but on God who gives strength. Thus, an awareness of what sins we committed, permits us to in most cases avoid future indulgence in this, living now no longer to satisfy our lust, but living to satisfy God.

12 Beloved, do not be surprised at the fiery trial when it comes upon you to test you, as though something strange were happening to you. 13 But rejoice insofar as you share Christ's sufferings, that you may also rejoice and be glad when his glory is revealed. 14 If you are insulted for the name of Christ, you are blessed, because the Spirit of glory and of God rests upon you. 15 But let none of you suffer as a murderer or a thief or an evildoer or as a meddler. 16 Yet if anyone suffers as a Christian, let him not be ashamed, but let him glorify God in that name. 17 For it is time for judgment to begin at the household of God; and if it begins with us, what will be the outcome for those who do not obey the gospel of God? 18 And
“If the righteous is scarcely saved,
what will become of the ungodly and the sinner?”​
Same chapter.
In this the theme of suffering is treated. Thus when our relief comes, even though Paradise might not be the kind of Paradise we would like it to be, we shall rejoice since our suffering is at an end.

Here then, daily prayer, and prayer for comfort, to help us with our daily problems and pain - helps us to survive the daily grind.
 

Twilight Hue

Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
I'm not a Christian (obviously) but the Bible is a great sacred text. Like everything under the sun, it has it's goods and bads, understandably.

It's people themselves that make a mess of things and use their own interpretations to be destructive or impose on others. Which is sadly one of the big downfalls of the idea of religious beliefs :(

I think the contents of any literature whether or not it is scriptural, spiritual,or whatever can make a mess in its own right. ;0)

But I do agree it's ultimately people whether they write down things or not, be it in any scripture or other text, it's always going to be sourced back to humans and humans alone.
 

Jumi

Well-Known Member
Also, to reiterate, praise God for the printing press. There isn't that much a difference in the denominations any more.
There is a lot, and many denominations seem to have changed. The one I was raised in(though I wasn't a believer) is now very different than it was say in early 1990s.
 

Tmac

Active Member
Christians became a lot more divided and splintered into thousands of denominations after the printing press when everyone could have their own personal copy of the Bible.

The Bible has verses that say the opposite of what other verses say, leading people to opposite beliefs.

There has to be an authority outside of scripture to settle those disputes.

I was in a psych ward with a guy that ripped his eyes out because scripture told him to.

Scripture can be dangerous.

The early Church had councils to settle such disputes.

The first Christians were not Bible Christians.

The Bible is a confusing book that was never meant to be the sole rule of sacred Theology. Nothing in the Bible says to test everything to see if it lines up with scripture. The opposite is actually proven true (Acts 15).

If the Church councils aren't guided by the holy Spirit, I see there is a hopeless division that will never be healed. Certainly knowing scripture does not solve the problem.

I think when you can figure out the differences between knowing scripture and knowing when to quote scripture you'll be on the road you're looking for, you remind me of the guy in scripture call Legion, only a modern day version. Cool.
 
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