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You Cannot Know Christ.

Harrison

Member
I disagree. It's demonstrated everywhere both in word and in deed.

Matthew 20:28
Even as the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many.

John 3:16
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Matthew 11:5
The blind receive their sight, and the lame walk, the lepers are cleansed, and the deaf hear, the dead are raised up, and the poor have the gospel preached to them.
When the US government pays for medical care, sends troops in for death in battle, and provides social supports for disadvantaged people, is that "grace?"

Remember, none of the Scripture you so confidently quoted spoke of actual Grace.

BTW, Jesus did come to be ministered unto. He had "No place to lay his head," meaning He had to be given accommodations. Read Luke 8 where He was ministered to by wimmin. Learn to recognize facts and contradictions before you presume to teach.
 

Kenny

Face to face with my Father
Premium Member
When the US government pays for medical care, sends troops in for death in battle, and provides social supports for disadvantaged people, is that "grace?"

Remember, none of the Scripture you so confidently quoted spoke of actual Grace.

It depends on what you understand grace to be. Maybe you and I have two different definitions.
BTW, Jesus did come to be ministered unto. He had "No place to lay his head," meaning He had to be given accommodations.
True... but what does that have to do with what we are talking about?
Read Luke 8 where He was ministered to by wimmin. Learn to recognize facts and contradictions before you presume to teach.
This statement is disjointed. Is this called teaching? ;)
 

Harrison

Member
It depends on what you understand grace to be. Maybe you and I have two different definitions.

True... but what does that have to do with what we are talking about?

This statement is disjointed. Is this called teaching? ;)
It is so good for you to come to me with these type of comments and arguments.

No, "it" does not depend on what "I" think Grace is. My view of grace does not direct the appearance and narrative of Grace in Scripture.

Do you understand that? Probably not. There are many, many tender hearts like yourself who think and speak as do emo/Millennials, where standard English word definitions are not a skill set.
 

sayak83

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
1 John 2:3, "Hereby do we know that we know him [Christ], if we keep His commandments."

No person today can keep the Commandments of Christ. The best they can come up with is meekly to state to follow His Commands they "try their best." But, Jesus never even used the word "try." He never said it. That is because either a person does follow His Commandments, or they do not follow them. There is no compromise.

From 1 John 2:3 conveniently cited above just in case someone does not quite feel like looking it up, as if now in 2017 it takes too much time and effort to do so, we clearly can see the only means by which an individual can know Jesus. However, that principle now becomes a problem. No person can obey all of Jesus' Commandments. We know this because no person can even recite from memory all of His Commandments.

Yes, some people try to say there are only two Commandments really given by Jesus, The First and The Second. But, in fact, no person can love all of their neighbors as they love themself. Or even any one of their neighbors. As well, no person can love other Christians as Jesus loves them, according to His New Command in John 13:34. Nobody can literally replicate Jesus' Love.

Since none of the statements above can be refuted, we can for certain now be certain nobody knows Jesus. Only a very few superficial things from Scripture can be known about Him. If you are still trying to disagree, then answer this question:

"What Do You Know Of Jesus Beyond What Is Disclosed In Scripture About Him?"
If what you say is true, then what follows?
 

Fool

ALL in all
Premium Member
It is so good for you to come to me with these type of comments and arguments.

No, "it" does not depend on what "I" think Grace is. My view of grace does not direct the appearance and narrative of Grace in Scripture.

Do you understand that? Probably not. There are many, many tender hearts like yourself who think and speak as do emo/Millennials, where standard English word definitions are not a skill set.


i am the image of that I AM. a reflection of god and the Infinite I. where is the temple you will build for me? where is the place of my sabbath?



it rests with him who is contrite of spirit and trembles at the thought. can you help me?


12 No one has ever seen God; but if we love one another, God lives in us and his love is made complete in us.


watch because you do not know at what hour I AM coming..................

"Therefore keep watch because you do not know when the owner of the house will come back--whether in the evening, or at midnight, or when the rooster crows, or at dawn.

Who then is the owner of the temple? you? him? them? I AM..........................

I say to you watch

Revelation 6:12
I watched as he opened the sixth seal. There was a great earthquake. The sun turned black like sackcloth made of goat hair, the whole moon turned blood red,

the outer lights faded away like a scroll being rolled up and the light dawned within. And love saw that it was good, the first day. creation.

1:21:23-end "When it comes to the matters of God and Love, I cannot tell the difference"

God is Love. Love is Divine. Love is the greatest mystery.

I and the Father are ONE and on that day


John 14:20
On that day you will realize that I am my Father, and you are me, and I am you.
 
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A Vestigial Mote

Well-Known Member
as an atheist you don't adhere to humanism?
I'm talking literally loving your neighbor as you love yourself. If that were your reality, you'd find yourself doing everything you could to insure their happiness and comfort... like you try to do for yourself. As stated previously... pay their mortgage and utilities, take care of their home and their lawn, make them breakfast, lunch and dinner, do their dishes. At the end of the day, once you had done for them and yourself, you'd have nothing left. And then you'd look to your left and realize you had ANOTHER neighbor.
 

Fool

ALL in all
Premium Member
I'm talking literally loving your neighbor as you love yourself. If that were your reality, you'd find yourself doing everything you could to insure their happiness and comfort... like you try to do for yourself. As stated previously... pay their mortgage and utilities, take care of their home and their lawn, make them breakfast, lunch and dinner, do their dishes. At the end of the day, once you had done for them and yourself, you'd have nothing left. And then you'd look to your left and realize you had ANOTHER neighbor.

loving other as self doesn't go beyond necessity, or a need. that would be promoting selfishness whether for self, or for other. helping another is helping with needs they can't produce for themselves because they are either in crisis, or either physically incapable. anything above that is creating codependency. we are called to teach others how to be self-sufficient, not co-dependent; especially if we follow the golden rule.

the golden rule doesn't advocate neglect of self at the idolatry of another. it's a balance. the road to hell is paved with good intentions.

straight and narrow is the way to life, neither to the left, nor the right.


 
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Whitestone

Member
I know Jesus by His Holy Resurrected Spirit Come into my flesh Temple Body, where He now dwells for Eternity, revealing all things to me out of His Word, overcoming my temptations, and showing me How He Loves all people, and giving me to Feel and Share His Love of others... a pure Heavenly Agape Love causing me to pray for men's repentance and turn of hearts. Loving one another... This is His Commandment, and it is not grevious nor difficult.

1Jn_2:4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
1Jn_5:3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.
(1Jn 3:22) And whatsoever we ask, we receive of him, because we keep his commandments, and do those things that are pleasing in his sight.
(1Jn 3:23) And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment.
(1Jn 3:24) And he that keepeth his commandments dwelleth in him, and he in him. And hereby we know that he abideth in us, by the Spirit which he hath given us.
 
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Harrison

Member
If what you say is true, then what follows?
Yes, for some people that question might be a logical response to the OP. And, I do apreciate your inquiry. In reality, I have neither the authority of definitive knowledge nor the directive authority over your mind to impact your future.

In view of what the original OP is meant to convey, I make the following suggestions:

1.) It is wholly inapproriate for anyone to claim they "know Jesus" or "have the Mind of Christ" when they are unable to speak the Words of Jesus or materially duplicate His Works. See John 14:12 and 1 John 2:6.

2.) It is a false effort to merely agree with statements in Scripture and thereby try to say those statements in Scripture are then operative in one's life.

3.) It is heresy to come up with humanly contrived rationale for one's supposed belief in Scripture, when it is God Himself who specifies the correct motivations for belief.

4.) One should seriously consider the vast differences in human mindset, world views, and cosmology between those who wrote The NT material and those today who claim to be able to grasp it and expound upon it.

5.) Some of the Arrogant Biblical Academicians, Babbling Preachers, Mindless Evangelists, Milque Toast Pewsitters, and White Knuckled Theology Pundits should now be alert to their own false claims of superior knowledge about Christ.
 

Harrison

Member
i am the image of that I AM. a reflection of god and the Infinite I. where is the temple you will build for me? where is the place of my sabbath?



it rests with him who is contrite of spirit and trembles at the thought. can you help me?


12 No one has ever seen God; but if we love one another, God lives in us and his love is made complete in us.


watch because you do not know at what hour I AM coming..................

"Therefore keep watch because you do not know when the owner of the house will come back--whether in the evening, or at midnight, or when the rooster crows, or at dawn.

Who then is the owner of the temple? you? him? them? I AM..........................

I say to you watch

Revelation 6:12
I watched as he opened the sixth seal. There was a great earthquake. The sun turned black like sackcloth made of goat hair, the whole moon turned blood red,

the outer lights faded away like a scroll being rolled up and the light dawned within. And love saw that it was good, the first day. creation.

1:21:23-end "When it comes to the matters of God and Love, I cannot tell the difference"

God is Love. Love is Divine. Love is the greatest mystery.

I and the Father are ONE and on that day


John 14:20
On that day you will realize that I am my Father, and you are me, and I am you.
I see you do not know where the Temple in Ezekiel's Prophecy is. Remember, Ezekiel literally measured its physical dimensions.

Lol. Keep having fun with your trip through spiritual La-La Land if that is the best you desire.
 

Harrison

Member
I know Jesus by His Holy Resurrected Spirit Come into my flesh Temple Body, where He now dwells for Eternity, revealing all things to me out of His Word, overcoming my temptations, and showing me How He Loves all people, and giving me to Feel and Share His Love of others... a pure Heavenly Agape Love causing me to pray for men's repentance and turn of hearts. Loving one another... This is His Commandment, and it is not grevious nor difficult.

1Jn_2:4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
1Jn_5:3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.
(1Jn 3:22) And whatsoever we ask, we receive of him, because we keep his commandments, and do those things that are pleasing in his sight.
(1Jn 3:23) And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment.
(1Jn 3:24) And he that keepeth his commandments dwelleth in him, and he in him. And hereby we know that he abideth in us, by the Spirit which he hath given us.
"Revealing all things to me out of His Word."

I doubt it. There are thousands of "things" within His Word you do not know. Lol. This is funnier than TV.
 

Whitestone

Member
(1Co 2:9) But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him.
(1Co 2:10) But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.

(1Co 2:12) Now we have received... the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.
(1Co 2:13) Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Spirit teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
(1Co 2:14) But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
(1Co 2:15) But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man.
(1Co 2:16) For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ.

Ask the right questions in the right spirit and I would be happy to show you Christ's answer out of His Word my friend.
 

1213

Well-Known Member
We can know it is not possible for any Christian to "Love their neighbor as themself" because they are never observed doing so.

By that logic, evolution didn’t happen, because we didn’t see it happening.

Do you love all of your neighbors as yourself? Do you pay their rent, mortgage, utilities, insurance, transportation costs, clothing costs, food bill, entertainment costs, travel costs, retirement funding, furniture needs, grooming expenses, pet maintenance, home maintenance, any legal fees, medical costs?

I don’t think love your neighbor means that person pays everything for them. For most people it would be impossible, because they have only money for their own things. In my opinion love others means one takes care of himself, so that others don’t have to do it for the person.
 

Nakosis

Non-Binary Physicalist
Premium Member
I am Pretty sure they weren't navigating nature by book. Soooooo, if they werent navigating nature by any book I would recommend trying that. I know unsettling and certainly not modern.

Folks seldom understand the actual nature of the past. They seem to think the information we have now was available back then.

People create a past reality in their head which fits the people in the past to acting according to information we have in the present.

People assume themselves capable of separating truth from fiction. I think most everyone does but it's usually not the case.
 

Kenny

Face to face with my Father
Premium Member
It is so good for you to come to me with these type of comments and arguments.

No, "it" does not depend on what "I" think Grace is. My view of grace does not direct the appearance and narrative of Grace in Scripture.

Do you understand that? Probably not. There are many, many tender hearts like yourself who think and speak as do emo/Millennials, where standard English word definitions are not a skill set.

Your thoughts remain.... disjointed.
 
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