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The financial burden of social obligation

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber
How many holidays do you think can be considered Capitalist holidays?
Quite a few, actually. Halloween, Valentines day, Fourth of July, and Labor day are some others that have become more about just buying junk. We're probably only one "good sales hype" away from Easter becoming a full blown "buying junk" holiday.
 

sayak83

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
When I was a kid, in the small village where I grew up there were only a few traditions. In February/March it was Carnival (kids normally made they own customs with mom’s help and the ones better off bought a plastic mask with an elastic strap), in April there was Easter, there was Christmas with gifts exchanged between family and closer friends and a meal the 24th of December and individual birthdays which back then included a small party at home with a homemade cake. That was it and it was already burdensome enough for some.

But the commercial world wasn’t making enough money for their taste so they revamped everything and imported a few more. Now there is valentine’s day, Halloween, black Friday, etc. Some are even celebrating Thanksgiving, which has nothing to do with the European culture.

People are being bombarded with advertisements for all sorts of events and all that costs a lot of money, money we are told we need to spend if we want to have a good time, money we are told we need to spend if we want to show people our love, as if love had anything to do with how much money you spend on stuff.

Traditions have become a financial burden and in a world full of debt, that’s the last thing people need. But people are so concerned about what others think that they are willing to go into more debt to fulfill they social obligations.

The guy I work with just moved and he had to spend a lot of money recently to buy the things he needed for his apartment. He was just telling me that he hates Christmas and he doesn’t know how he’s going to make it this year. I suggested he could tell his family and friends that this year he can’t exchange gifts and he’ll just have dinner with them. He didn’t like my idea. What would they think of him??? It’s Christmas – people expect gifts.

I’m glad I stopped all that nonsense years ago and today I only buy gifts for people I genuinely care about if I want and when I can afford them. Personally, I much prefer to be surprised than to get a gift just because it’s whatever date and people feel they have an obligation to get me something.

We live in a buy, buy, buy culture and people are relentlessly pressured to spend money they don’t have in stuff nobody needs, to keep a certain image. How sad is it that we keep talking about being ourselves but in practice, make sure you follow the crowd because if you don’t do exactly like everyone else you might lose the “cool” status, people might not like you so much anymore.

Wouldn’t it be better to spend time with the people we love? There are so many nice things people can do together that don’t feel like a social obligation and don’t cost a fortune.

I think kids would appreciate more time and attention from their parents instead of a new phone to replace the one they got last year, which BTW still works just fine.
Recycle gifts, like the Hobbits of the shire. :p
But seriously, why do people expect gifts at Christmas? Did not know about this. Usually only the kids get the gifts don't they? As well giving to the poor of course.
 
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Skwim

Veteran Member
My s.o and I are quite involved in a local non-profit community theater (I'm on its board of trustees) and every Christmas they have a catered dinner followed by an auction of professionally decorated Christmas trees, wreaths and a few smaller items---gotta say, they are absolutely beautiful. This year the dinners, which are not particularly lavish servings, are $75 a plate, with the auctioned trees starting off at around $400-$550. Last Christmas the lowest bid wreath went for $325. The highest bid tree was $2,600+. (and these are all live trees, and wreaths so there's no saving them for next Christmas). Granted this is a charitable affair designed to raise money for the theater (last year the event raised $30,000+) but I feel the whole thing is far too pricey. If I go home for under $400 I'll be happy, and if I can get by with just the $150 tab for the dinner I'll be grinning ear to ear. My s.o. just loves these things, and raising her hand. The financial burden of social obligation Bah, humbug.
T.
 
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Jeremiah Ames

Well-Known Member
When I was a kid, in the small village where I grew up there were only a few traditions. In February/March it was Carnival (kids normally made they own customs with mom’s help and the ones better off bought a plastic mask with an elastic strap), in April there was Easter, there was Christmas with gifts exchanged between family and closer friends and a meal the 24th of December and individual birthdays which back then included a small party at home with a homemade cake. That was it and it was already burdensome enough for some.

But the commercial world wasn’t making enough money for their taste so they revamped everything and imported a few more. Now there is valentine’s day, Halloween, black Friday, etc. Some are even celebrating Thanksgiving, which has nothing to do with the European culture.

People are being bombarded with advertisements for all sorts of events and all that costs a lot of money, money we are told we need to spend if we want to have a good time, money we are told we need to spend if we want to show people our love, as if love had anything to do with how much money you spend on stuff.

Traditions have become a financial burden and in a world full of debt, that’s the last thing people need. But people are so concerned about what others think that they are willing to go into more debt to fulfill they social obligations.

The guy I work with just moved and he had to spend a lot of money recently to buy the things he needed for his apartment. He was just telling me that he hates Christmas and he doesn’t know how he’s going to make it this year. I suggested he could tell his family and friends that this year he can’t exchange gifts and he’ll just have dinner with them. He didn’t like my idea. What would they think of him??? It’s Christmas – people expect gifts.

I’m glad I stopped all that nonsense years ago and today I only buy gifts for people I genuinely care about if I want and when I can afford them. Personally, I much prefer to be surprised than to get a gift just because it’s whatever date and people feel they have an obligation to get me something.

We live in a buy, buy, buy culture and people are relentlessly pressured to spend money they don’t have in stuff nobody needs, to keep a certain image. How sad is it that we keep talking about being ourselves but in practice, make sure you follow the crowd because if you don’t do exactly like everyone else you might lose the “cool” status, people might not like you so much anymore.

Wouldn’t it be better to spend time with the people we love? There are so many nice things people can do together that don’t feel like a social obligation and don’t cost a fortune.

I think kids would appreciate more time and attention from their parents instead of a new phone to replace the one they got last year, which BTW still works just fine.

I don’t celebrate Christmas, Halloween, or Easter. They’re just times of the year the kids like. We send a few things to the grandkids in early December, they think it’s for Christmas, so they’re happy and we don’t have to celebrate something we don’t believe in.
Btw, Vee, I didn’t think JW’s celebrated these holidays?
 

siti

Well-Known Member
I was the "Scrooge" of my family from the time (more than 3 decades ago) that I began to despise the month and a half of 2 hour drags against the tide of mindless Christmas shoppers to get home from work every day. I rejected it altogether for a decade during my JW years and I have just never bothered to pick it up again. I'm pretty sure Jesus would not have approved and even for social functions such as weddings etc. in our family we try to follow what Jesus (reportedly) said in Luke 14:12-14. But to do that without embarrassing people you have to make the poor (etc.) your friends first - not just token acquaintances that we meet at the soup kitchen once a month or "whensoever" its "our turn" to "do them good". (Mark 14:7). We don't have to go to great expense to impress them and they know we are not perfunctorily performing "good works" but genuinely enjoying their company and sharing whatever we have whether it happens to be one "talent" worth or ten.

The commercial world gets zip from us on any of the traditional holidays except what it can expect from us on any other day. I reckon if we all did that they could save millions on seasonal ads and pass the savings on to the customer - and then maybe there'd be a few less 'poor' to be concerned about at Christmas - don't you think?
 

siti

Well-Known Member
Mr. Van already promised me bacon this year. You'd better come through!
You wouldn't settle for a half-eaten sausage roll stolen from another thread I don't suppose...

3500.jpg


Jesus was a sausage roll...
 

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber
This thread is a painful reminder my family, for whatever reason, goes to see a movie on Christmas, and I absolutely detest supporting anything that makes people of non-essential positions working on a holiday that is supposed to be family.
I'd much rather burn the movie theater down than give it money on that day, and slap all patrons upside the head until bruised, and possibly bleeding from the ear.
 

SabahTheLoner

Master of the Art of Couch Potato Cuddles
I often feel like most of my family’s holidays are empty just because it’s tradition to do what everyone grew up with and the meaning is sucked away by the commercialist “well, it’s what everyone does.” Of course I don’t really tell them that because that’s likely to cause some arguments I don’t want to get into.
 

Poisonshady313

Well-Known Member
This thread is a painful reminder my family, for whatever reason, goes to see a movie on Christmas, and I absolutely detest supporting anything that makes people of non-essential positions working on a holiday that is supposed to be family.
I'd much rather burn the movie theater down than give it money on that day, and slap all patrons upside the head until bruised, and possibly bleeding from the ear.
Slap the patrons, sure, but don't hate on the theater. They're open 366 days a year, no matter what.

As a Jewish guy who worked at a movie theater, I was happy to say "look guys... give me off for Thanksgiving, and I'll work as long as you want me to on Christmas eve and Christmas."
 

Hockeycowboy

Witness for Jehovah
Premium Member
Indeed. In the same vein as what you describe: I know people who spend several hours a week at churches where the kids get whisked away to Sunday School and the parents feel serious social pressure to donate as much as a tenth of their income!

Shocking, I know, but I agree with you: they shouldn't bow to social pressure. Instead, they should save their money and spend their Sunday morning as quality time with their families.

It’s a shame, how some church leaders ‘fleece their flock “! I worked with a guy, whose church required him and his wife to submit their 1040 IRS form, divulging their income!

Contributions should be voluntary, not an obligation....even passing the plate, with others watching, isn’t appropriate IMO: it can cause embarrassment.
 

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber
Slap the patrons, sure, but don't hate on the theater. They're open 366 days a year, no matter what.
It's non-essential, and they shouldn't be. Doctors, police, fire fighters, those are the sorts who should be working on Holidays. Fast food, movies, and retail we'll be ok without just for a day.
 

Poisonshady313

Well-Known Member
It's non-essential, and they shouldn't be. Doctors, police, fire fighters, those are the sorts who should be working on Holidays. Fast food, movies, and retail we'll be ok without just for a day.
Theme parks like Disney also stay open 365 days a year. They're fairly non-essential.
Even Broadway has a couple of shows on Dec 25th

If they tell you up front that you'll be expected to work holidays, you can choose to take the job or not.

Businesses that are entertainment oriented would be foolish not to open on days when the rest of the world is off of work.
 

Poisonshady313

Well-Known Member
In so many cases, no, you really can't choose to take the job or not.
Perhaps... I'm just not sure how many of those cases are relevant. Nobody is forced to take a job at a movie theater. And, at least in my town, it didn't seem to be anyone's last resort, either.

I got a job there because the cop who worked security at the theater on the weekends knows my family and said to me, when I was in high school, "hey, if you're looking for a job I could put in a good word at the movie theater". They shouldn't have even hired me because I wasn't 18 yet... and wouldn't have if it weren't for that recommendation.

Nothing about that situation made this job my only choice at that point in my life. They told me I'd work weekends and holidays. I said "ok".

Holiday pay meant my paycheck that week was going to look awesome. And as long as I didn't have to work too hard shoveling my car out of the driveway, I was happy to be there.
 

suncowiam

Well-Known Member
Quite a few, actually. Halloween, Valentines day, Fourth of July, and Labor day are some others that have become more about just buying junk. We're probably only one "good sales hype" away from Easter becoming a full blown "buying junk" holiday.

LOL. That's exactly my point. We live in a capitalist society so many other holidays have a very capitalist tone to them.

It is what it is. I just mute it out instead of letting it bother me.
 

suncowiam

Well-Known Member
This thread is a painful reminder my family, for whatever reason, goes to see a movie on Christmas, and I absolutely detest supporting anything that makes people of non-essential positions working on a holiday that is supposed to be family.
I'd much rather burn the movie theater down than give it money on that day, and slap all patrons upside the head until bruised, and possibly bleeding from the ear.

Holy cow... Take a big breath.

I'm going to put up Christmas decorations this weekend. Can't wait! When I immigrated here, I remember my parents bought a Bing Crosby Christmas Record. We were so poor and we're recent immigrants with no clue of American tradition. To this day, I'm not sure why they bought it but I played it to death because it was about joy, spirit, and fun.
 

metis

aged ecumenical anthropologist
This thread is a painful reminder my family, for whatever reason, goes to see a movie on Christmas, and I absolutely detest supporting anything that makes people of non-essential positions working on a holiday that is supposed to be family.
I fully agree, and much the same goes with our refusal to shop on Thanksgiving or any other holiday. We live in a heavily Christian area, so we also try to avoid doing any shopping on Sunday, much like we don't ship in our closest Jewish area on Shabbat. .
 

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber
I fully agree, and much the same goes with our refusal to shop on Thanksgiving or any other holiday.
It makes me wonder why when people list the reasons why our family units are breaking apart and failing, no one brings up that we put profit over family so much that we make people work on holidays instead of letting them spend time with their family.
One example that I will probably never forget, when I was working at a gas station, this lady complaining that they actually make us work on the Holiday (I think it was Thanksgiving) as she was piling stuff up on the counter to buy. Yes, it was pretty lame that I got stuck the day, but if she felt the same she shouldn't have been justifying why I was there.
 

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber
Holy cow... Take a big breath.

I'm going to put up Christmas decorations this weekend. Can't wait! When I immigrated here, I remember my parents bought a Bing Crosby Christmas Record. We were so poor and we're recent immigrants with no clue of American tradition. To this day, I'm not sure why they bought it but I played it to death because it was about joy, spirit, and fun.
I don't mind that (myself, I grew up hearing Bert Kaempfert's Christmas album while mom prepared Thanksgiving meal). What I hate is the extreme commercialism, the expectations to buy so much junk, and that people be forced to work on Holidays, and even Black Friday as it's nothing but a mad house of stress and anxiety. When people are getting hurt, and some of them killed--for nothing more than a sale--we really need to think and ask ourselves what in the hell are we doing?
 
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