Ignorantia Juris non Excusat

OR "ignorance of the law excuses not," which is a legal principle holding that a person who is unaware of a law may not escape liability for violating that law merely because he was unaware of it.

Without splitting hairs among the beliefs of the various Christian denominations, in main, Christian theology says that those who disobey god's law and do not ask for his forgiveness will end up in hell, or at least be denied entry into heaven. But what about those who are unaware of god's law and its escape clause? Does Ignorantia Juris non Excusat apply to them, or are they given a bye?


Why or why not?

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I used to assume that people who hold such beliefs usually also assume that human beings have some sort of instinctive awareness of what is wrong.

Without such an awareness, we fall into pretty difficult theological terrain.

Either way, the logical conclusion would have to be that wisdom is a more valuable religious virtue than obedience.

Skwim said:

OR "ignorance of the law excuses not," which is a legal principle holding that a person who is unaware of a law may not escape liability for violating that law merely because he was unaware of it.

Without splitting hairs among the beliefs of the various Christian denominations, in main Christian theology says that those who disobey god's law and do not ask for his forgiveness will end up in hell, or at least be denied entry into heaven. But what about those who are unaware of god's law and its escape clause? Does Ignorantia Juris non Excusat apply to them, or are they given a bye?


Why or why not?

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My understanding is that everyone will get a chance to learn in the millennium, before they are judged. Which is the one thousand year period in between human extinction and heaven being established on earth.

Enoch07 said:

My understanding is that everyone will get a chance to learn in the millennium, before they are judged. Which is the one thousand year period in between human extinction and heaven being established on earth.

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So what are the souls of the dead doing until this millennium begins? And, if one is aware he can repent during the millennium why be concerned with asking for forgiveness while alive? Why not just "live it up" and cash in one's repentance chip when judgement time comes?

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Mister Silver said:

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That raises a good point. If missionaries are trying to save souls, doesn't their work do more of the opposite in this regard? Why didn't early christians just burn all of the scripture to save the rest of mankind from damnation?

Skwim said:

So what are the souls of the dead doing until this millennium begins? And, if one is aware he can repent during the millennium why be concerned with asking for forgiveness while alive? Why not just "live it up" and cash in one's repentance chip when judgement time comes?

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They are waiting for everyone else to get there, so thay everyone can be taught together. This place is described in several diffrent ways, Limbo being the most common. Its not exactly heaven, and it's not hell. Its is heaven adjacent. Since heaven exist outside of time its not much of a wait. So while a guy that died 5,000 years ago just arrived in heaven, I will be arriving just a few seconds after him when I die in XX years from now, and someone who dies 5,000 years after me would arrive in "heaven" a few seconds after me.

As for why repent now instead of later? To make life better for some. Repenting now made my quality of life better. I wouldn't say for sure it would make everyone's life better, Though I would like to think so, but it does for some. Also if someone knew they could repent later, and lived it up now, that's kind of taking advantage of the situation. I would guess that will not be taken lightly.

Father Heathen said:

That raises a good point. If missionaries are trying to save souls, doesn't their work do more of the opposite in this regard? Why didn't early christians just burn all of the scripture to save the rest of mankind from damnation?

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That would interfere with Eskimos free will. It would limit their ability to learn about Christ should they want to.

Enoch07 said:

That would interfere with Eskimos free will. It would limit their ability to learn about Christ should they want to.

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I mean, technically you're the one interfering with their free-will if you're introducing something new. But I think the point is that before you've said anything he was guaranteed to not be damned to eternal hell and now that you've opened your mouth, there's a 50-50 chance he will be.

Someone shows me two doors and gives me three options:

1. Leave with nothing ventured nothing gained.
2. Choose the right door and win a trillion dollars.
3. Choose the wrong door and be tortured to death.

Personally, I'm pretty sure I'd choose option one, because frankly, I wouldn't want to risk it. That's if someone gave me the choice about myself. But to potentially take someone's life into my hands? To remove from them the safe option 1? I wouldn't dare.

Enoch07 said:

They are waiting for everyone else to get there, so thay everyone can be taught together. This place is described in several diffrent ways, Limbo being the most common. Its not exactly heaven, and it's not hell. Its is heaven adjacent. Since heaven exist outside of time its not much of a wait. So while a guy that died 5,000 years ago just arrived in heaven, I will be arriving just a few seconds after him when I die in XX years from now, and someone who dies 5,000 years after me would arrive in "heaven" a few seconds after me.

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And just where can all this information can be found? If the Bible, chapter and verse would be appropriate.

As for why repent now instead of later? To make life better for some. Repenting now made my quality of life better. I wouldn't say for sure it would make everyone's life better, Though I would like to think so, but it does for some.

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Which still leaves it an open option with no consequences. And, of course, a lot of people will prefer to indulge themselves and forget about any repenting, which for them means a better quality of life.

Also if someone knew they could repent later, and lived it up now, that's kind of taking advantage of the situation. I would guess that will not be taken lightly.

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Why wouldn't it be taken lightly? Everyone takes advantage of situations that attract them when there's no untoward consequences.

In your theology then, it seems repenting is an insignificant gesture, and unless one is a complete dunderhead hell is never a possibility, So it doesn't matter one wit if a person believes in Christ while alive or not. Interesting kind of Christianity.

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Enoch07 said:

That would interfere with Eskimos free will.

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How?

It would limit their ability to learn about Christ should they want to.

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Then how about teaching them about Hitler, heavy metal music, and the Republican National Committee, should they want to learn?

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Tumah said:

I mean, technically you're the one interfering with their free-will if you're introducing something new. But I think the point is that before you've said anything he was guaranteed to not be damned to eternal hell and now that you've opened your mouth, there's a 50-50 chance he will be.

Someone shows me two doors and gives me three options:

1. Leave with nothing ventured nothing gained.
2. Choose the right door and win a trillion dollars.
3. Choose the wrong door and be tortured to death.

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There is no option 1. Only the other 2 options for everyone regardless. Even without knowing the fact that they will get a chance to learn they still get that chance to learn. That is why everyone is judged at the end of the millenia.

Skwim said:

And just where can all this information can be found? If the Bible, chapter and verse would be appropriate.


Which still leaves it an open option with no consequences. And, of course, a lot of people will prefer to indulge themselves and forget about any repenting, which for them means a better quality of life.


Why wouldn't it be taken lightly? Everyone takes advantage of situations that attract them when there's no untoward consequences.

In your theology then, it seems repenting is an insignificant gesture, and unless one is a complete dunderhead hell is never a possibility, So it doesn't matter one wit if a person believes in Christ while alive or not. Interesting kind of Christianity..

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Most of it is in Revelations. I don't have time to get exact verses atm b/c of real life stuff going on.

Are you Skwim going to indulge yourself in theft, rape, and murder now that you have this knowledge of the millenia? I suspect not, because your have morals. Should someone take advantage of its shows a lack of morals wouldn't you agree?

Repenting is not insignificant. Hell is still possible for unrepentant people.

Skwim said:

How?

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Because you would take away their ability to learn about Christianity if they so chose.

Skwim said:

Then how about teaching them about Hitler, heavy metal music, and the Republican National Committee, should they want to learn?

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That info is available to them should the search it out. But not if you deleted that info from existence.

Enoch07 said:

That would interfere with Eskimos free will. It would limit their ability to learn about Christ should they want to.

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So then all secrets are a sin or whatever since they somehow interfere with people's freewill, correct? And how could someone want to learn about something if they're not even aware that it's a thing? Again, if being condemned to hell requires being aware of- yet rejecting - the gospel, then burning the scriptures and allowing them to be forgotten would save everyone. Spreading the "good news" doesn't save souls since they were already saved due to their ignorance, instead it jeopardizes souls.

Father Heathen said:

So then all secrets are a sin or whatever since they somehow interfere with people's freewill, correct? And how could someone want to learn about something if they're not even aware that it's a thing? Again, if being condemned to hell requires being aware of- yet rejecting - the gospel, then burning the scriptures and allowing them to be forgotten would save everyone. Spreading the "good news" doesn't save souls since they were already saved due to their ignorance, instead it jeopardizes souls.

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Sorry but it wouldn't.

If you burnt all scripture as you propose

Everyone would still have to learn the scripture during the millenia. They also still have to repent and mean it.

Skwim said:

Without splitting hairs among the beliefs of the various Christian denominations, in main, Christian theology says that those who disobey god's law and do not ask for his forgiveness will end up in hell, or at least be denied entry into heaven.
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Did you fish this out of a Mary Poppins bag?