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The Divinity of Christ

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Daisies4me

Active Member
Repox said:
I prefer the first few books of the Old Testament (Torah). I believe Isaiah is one of God's holy books. The more original the holy book the more authentic it is. I don't believe God approves of so many revisions or amendments to His Commandments or edicts. I don't trust humans to supplement or reinterpret God's holy word.
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(quote)

Hi repox
so that would be the pentateuch, right?

what about the Septuagint?

Do you think that God would make His Written Word made known to all people on earth, in their own native tongue?

thanks,

(quote)
 
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Daisies4me

Active Member
Muffled said:
I believe if you had understood what you examined then you should have seen that Jesus is God in the flesh.

I believe one may not hang a theology on one scripture. Of course Jesus is precisely God's son but He is not primarily or solitarily God's son.

I believe you should since you qualify but I believe what the Bible says whether my pastor thinks so or not. Why do you think there are so monay people who get the same message from reading the Bible? Do you think they are all misled?
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(quote)

Hi Muffled

I agree that "all scripture is inspired of God and beneficial...." --2 Timothy 3:16

I do find many scriptures that prove that Jesus is not God Almighty, but is the Son and was sent forth by God , who is his Father. I could post a plethora of scriptures that plainly state these things, if you like.
And I believe what the Bible says, not what so-called 'preachers', "pastors", "reverends" "popes", "bishops", or whatever title men who seek power over others claim for themselves.

The vast majority of them are all in error, some may be sincere, but, imho, most seek money, power, influence, and 'glory from men'.

In order to be a true footstep follower of the Christ, (1 Peter 2:21) I believe the person must first humble his or her self , and be teachable, and be willing to suffer just as Christ did when the false religious leaders sought to silence him and keep others from listening to what he said, and putting faith in him, because they would then lose their position of power, if they let that happen. Good example of why so many false teachers and false doctrines spread throughout the earth today.
see John 11:45-48. , John 12:48-50, John 17:1-3, 6-8, 21-26.

Is the entire congregation that followed Jesus "one" with both Jesus and God? And yet, they are not Divine, are they? No, they are simply UNITED in worship of the Only true God , as Jesus called the heaven Father at John 17:3, when he was praying to that ONE.
Does this make sense to you? I hope so. Thanks for allowing me to answer your questions with Biblical references.
So, as you see, I am a student of the Bible, and go by what is stated therein. I also recommend that all people should prove to themselves by the Scriptures, not traditions of men or uninspired writings, so on that, I think we can agree.

take care

(quote)
 
Repox

Repox

Truth Seeker
Daisies4me said:
(quote)

Hi repox
so that would be the pentateuch, right?

what about the Septuagint?

Do you think that God would make His Written Word made known to all people on earth, in their own native tongue?

thanks,

(quote)
Click to expand...
I suppose it would be the Pentateuch.

I think God began with his chosen people. It was a special attempt to establish his holy order on earth. Thus far, it hasn't worked out. Contrary what many believe, I don't think God has a good attitude about humankind. Paradise, which was at the time of the dinosaurs, failed. Humans are collateral damage from the fall of paradise. If it doesn't work out with his chosen people, it is unlikely God will make other attempts. I don't believe anyone believes this perspective, so I have nothing much to say.

It all boils down to one issue, which is obedience. God requires obedience to His will. I had a dream about the OT. A voice said, "They didn't obey my commandments, not one single commandment." That covers it all.
 
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Daisies4me

Active Member
Repox said:
I suppose it would be the Pentateuch.

I think God began with his chosen people. It was a special attempt to establish his holy order on earth. Thus far, it hasn't worked out. Contrary what many believe, I don't think God has a good attitude about humankind. Paradise, which was at the time of the dinosaurs, failed. Humans are collateral damage from the fall of paradise. If it doesn't work out with his chosen people, it is unlikely God will make other attempts. I don't believe anyone believes this perspective, so I have nothing much to say.

It all boils down to one issue, which is obedience. God requires obedience to His will. I had a dream about the OT. A voice said, "They didn't obey my commandments, not one single commandment." That covers it all.
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(quote)

hi Repox

I agree that the issue is obedience, or lack thereof.....Ecclesiastes 12:13 tells us this.

Way back before Almighty God made a Covenant with the descendants of Jacob (Israel), there were people on earth who obeyed God and had His favor, but Adam and Eve, the first human pair, did not obey God, which got us in the mess we see today. you see, Adam willfully and deliberately chose to disobey and then as a criminal he tried to hide. when brought to trial by God, he attempted to justify himself and pass the buck on others, rather than showing sorrow or regret or asking for forgiveness. So because of the act of defiance and disobedience by the perfect human man, Adam, the forefather of all of mankind, Adam was cast out of the paradise, into an unsubdued death that was cursed to p roduce thorns and thistles , there to sweat out an existence harvesting the bitter fruit of sin and awaiting death. He was allowed to exist so as to produce offspring, who, even though born in sin, could still worship the creator, and wait until the promised Savior would come, who would make possible the resurrection from the dead of all victims of the Adamic sin, at the appointed time. Which is why humans get sick and die, and have, since the beginning of procreation by Adam. So there was no 'chosen people' at that time.

Abraham, for example, was not an Israelite, but was a Hebrew. His original name Abram, was changed by to to Abraham, which means "father of a multitude", remember? After Abraham left Haran in 1943 BCE, and crossed the euphrates River, at that time, the Abrahamic Covenant between Almighty God and Abraham went into effect. This was some 430 years prior to the making of the Law Covenant with Israel.

So as I understand it, while the majority of mankind is disobedient by choice, and the rest will sin due to imperfection, but the promise from God to restore the paradise on a global basis, after the destruction of evil (as in the time of the flood, but for the last time, a final cleansing) Psalms 37:29 will become a reality.

Does this sound logical to you?
Thanks for listening

(quote)
 
Repox

Repox

Truth Seeker
Daisies4me said:
(quote)

hi Repox

I agree that the issue is obedience, or lack thereof.....Ecclesiastes 12:13 tells us this.

Way back before Almighty God made a Covenant with the descendants of Jacob (Israel), there were people on earth who obeyed God and had His favor, but Adam and Eve, the first human pair, did not obey God, which got us in the mess we see today. you see, Adam willfully and deliberately chose to disobey and then as a criminal he tried to hide. when brought to trial by God, he attempted to justify himself and pass the buck on others, rather than showing sorrow or regret or asking for forgiveness. So because of the act of defiance and disobedience by the perfect human man, Adam, the forefather of all of mankind, Adam was cast out of the paradise, into an unsubdued death that was cursed to p roduce thorns and thistles , there to sweat out an existence harvesting the bitter fruit of sin and awaiting death. He was allowed to exist so as to produce offspring, who, even though born in sin, could still worship the creator, and wait until the promised Savior would come, who would make possible the resurrection from the dead of all victims of the Adamic sin, at the appointed time. Which is why humans get sick and die, and have, since the beginning of procreation by Adam. So there was no 'chosen people' at that time.

Abraham, for example, was not an Israelite, but was a Hebrew. His original name Abram, was changed by to to Abraham, which means "father of a multitude", remember? After Abraham left Haran in 1943 BCE, and crossed the euphrates River, at that time, the Abrahamic Covenant between Almighty God and Abraham went into effect. This was some 430 years prior to the making of the Law Covenant with Israel.

So as I understand it, while the majority of mankind is disobedient by choice, and the rest will sin due to imperfection, but the promise from God to restore the paradise on a global basis, after the destruction of evil (as in the time of the flood, but for the last time, a final cleansing) Psalms 37:29 will become a reality.

Does this sound logical to you?
Thanks for listening

(quote)
Click to expand...
Yes, it sounds logical. God tested a few as precedent for humankind. I just don't think it has worked out as intended. It has to do with free will. God can offer salvation, but humans have to willfully accept God and His commandments. As for a second paradise, it is offered in Revelation for those who obey God.
 
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Vaderecta

Vaderecta

Active Member
adrian009 said:
We have contradictory statements in the Gospels about the reality of Christ. For example:

- Jesus is God

- Jesus is the 'Son of God'

- Jesus is the 'son of man'.

What is the best way of understanding the spiritual reality of Christ?

Could these principles be applicable to other faiths?
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Of from or like a god - presupposes the question of "Is there a god?" That question at least seems interesting but your question appears to me like you know the answer to that question and now you want to start asking the hard questions. So look we know there is a god now lets disregard 1000s of religions and focus on Christ. Look we know god is real therefore christ! Don't come at me with some mayan, aztec or any non-christ belief. I am Alex Jo...Adrian and I'm only asking the hard questions! Assuming god is real and all other religions that don't involve christ are wrong and maybe just maybe my flavor of Christ like beliefs is right is he a Son of Man? Or a Son of God?

You are not a product of god but of evolution. If you accept that then dwelling on what brought about the simple single celled creature that became a human needs no explanation so based on human life. It is so human focused and misses like 99.9% of the questions one might have. This is an old universe and your god works only for you in your state or country and for a fraction of humanity in this part of the galaxy because well thats what we can sell to these people! They don't know and can't know about the rest of the universe so our tale is based on them, for them and by them.

So Jesus is just a story. Like Thor or Odin. Maybe there was a person who walked around and these tales are based on. (Few of the tales in the bible are around Jesus but lets just talk about the ones that are) So we agree there might have been a human named Jesus but now with knowledge of Surgery, Germs our doctor fairy tales are based on technology and not mysticism. That might have been a good story for their times but it was their version of Sci-Fi.

Jesus is a very powerful idea.
 
Muffled

Muffled

Jesus in me
Repox said:
It is not my fault that hardly anyone does research. Whatever ancient church leaders said has become the "word of God." You know of course there are thousands of religions, holy books, etc. What is truth. I have proposed my case based on scholarly research, you prefer to accept questionable references. You should read church history. There were many gospels until church leaders decided what was "holy." How do you determine who is holy? There are about 38,000 religions in the US. Which one is correct, or holy?
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I believe Jesus is the Truth because He said so. The Sikhs call god Sat which means truth but that certainly is an attribution.

I believe scholars can be as absurd as anyone. If a person is not led by the Holy Spirit any nonsense is possible. I go by what the Holy Spirit tells me so I am going to get the truth.

I am not sure that holy is what they were looking for but whether books authentically came from God.

I believe God is holy and none other.

I believe there are thousands of denominations of one religion and the answer is that none of them are correct. Certainly other religions lack correctness also since it is the nature of man to misinterpret writings.
 
Muffled

Muffled

Jesus in me
Repox said:
There is no son of God. Jesus was God, and God is a duality. That means there is no Trinity. If God is eternal, how could he have a son. It would mean God is not eternal, or stopped being eternal when he had a son. What nonsense!
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Jesus is the Son of God. It is right there in the Bible. And the Holy Spirit testifies that He is the Son of God.

I believe the Bible is quite clear that God is one.

I believe your premise is false so that is why your conclusion is false.

I believe an eternity gives God the opportunity to have an unlimited number of Sons if He wishes.

I believe that is a non-sequitur. The conclusion does not follow from the premise.

I believe my logic makes a lot sense but yours does not.
 
Repox

Repox

Truth Seeker
Muffled said:
Jesus is the Son of God. It is right there in the Bible. And the Holy Spirit testifies that He is the Son of God.

I believe the Bible is quite clear that God is one.

I believe your premise is false so that is why your conclusion is false.

I believe an eternity gives God the opportunity to have an unlimited number of Sons if He wishes.

I believe that is a non-sequitur. The conclusion does not follow from the premise.

I believe my logic makes a lot sense but yours does not.
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If you read the OT you will not find the son of God mentioned. The Holy Spirit has been the main reason for so many different opinions about the Bible, it is not an exact science, ha. ha. The problem is there is so much opportunity for abuse. It is my Holy Spirit versus your HS, no one knows who is right.
 
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Daisies4me

Active Member
Muffled said:
Thank you, I believe I do.

I believe you do know what the word "called" means don't you?
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(quote)
Hi Muffled

I hope this finds you well.

I do know that the word 'called' means, in many ways,.. for example, "call me for dinner" or, "call my name", etc. Or, they called me for a job interview...lots of ways to use the word in a sentence, to be sure.

As pertaining to the Biblical reference to the Son of God, in the scripture at Luke 1; 26-33, whose name was said to be called "Jesus", along with being called the 'Son of the Most HIgh'--- according to the Angel of God, knowing what those words mean, -- how would you interpret that, say, for example...if the reverse was stated there for example, what if is said Jesus would 'not be called'....?

take care

(quote)
 
D

Daisies4me

Active Member
Repox said:
If you read the OT you will not find the son of God mentioned. The Holy Spirit has been the main reason for so many different opinions about the Bible, it is not an exact science, ha. ha. The problem is there is so much opportunity for abuse. It is my Holy Spirit versus your HS, no one knows who is right.
Click to expand...

(quote)
Hi Repox
I hope this finds you well.

The prophet Daniel lived more than 500 years before the birth of Jesus. Nevertheless, Jehovah revealed to Daniel information that would make it possible to pinpoint the time when Jesus would be anointed, or appointed, as the Messiah, or Christ.

Daniel was told: “You should know and understand that from the issuing of the word to restore and to rebuild Jerusalem until Messiah the Leader, there will be 7 weeks, also 62 weeks.”—Daniel 9:25.

What are your thought about of the 'Messiah' foretold by Daniel?

may you have peace

(quote)
 
Repox

Repox

Truth Seeker
Daisies4me said:
(quote)
Hi Repox
I hope this finds you well.

The prophet Daniel lived more than 500 years before the birth of Jesus. Nevertheless, Jehovah revealed to Daniel information that would make it possible to pinpoint the time when Jesus would be anointed, or appointed, as the Messiah, or Christ.

Daniel was told: “You should know and understand that from the issuing of the word to restore and to rebuild Jerusalem until Messiah the Leader, there will be 7 weeks, also 62 weeks.”—Daniel 9:25.

What are your thought about of the 'Messiah' foretold by Daniel?

may you have peace

(quote)
Click to expand...
I believe the Messiah would be God, the Lord of Israel. God came to give testimony to His chosen people. I also believe Rev. 11 about the two witnesses is about Jesus, the two witnesses represents the duality of God. Thanks for your interest.
 
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