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Muslims, I Find This Really Offensive
- Thread starter Rival
- Start date
Did Muhammad (p) ever read the Qur'an even once in the whole of his life as we find it today?
Shadow Wolf
Certified People sTabber
Can it be said that anyone either fully embraces or rejects everything? One of the things that keeps philosophy going is someone taking a part of what they like about what some other said, expanding on that idea, and discarding the ideas from the same author they don't like.
It's really only an issue when you refuse to accept when you are doing this, and cannot rationally justify the acceptance of part and rejection of others. As for religion, so much of the world, even some Muslim states, are so far removed from a "truly strict and literal" interpretation of their scriptures that they should just leave the past in the past and embrace ideas that are suited for global unity rather than sectarian, national, economic, and other forms of supremacy and dominance. I don't think "religion," as it can be generally interpreted and understood, will ever go away from our species, but I do think we aren't too far away from a global secular shift and the emergence of new non-dogmatic religious/spiritual ideas and the rise of atheism and agnosticism, and even those who are too busy doing other things to be concerned with god. And I do feel we'll have radical Islam and far-Right Conservative Christians to thank for this, because it won't be too much longer before people have absolutely had it with the **** coming from both of them.
ukok102nak
Active Member
~;> indeed
for those native people knew how to farm while using their native tounge
sometime some people tend to worship their language
see what happened to the old babylon
by the way
what is the the language that humans will use
after this so called
new earth and new heaven
as it is written
:read:
Revelation of John 21:1
I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth have passed away, and the sea is no more.
hope to see you there soon
:ty:
godbless
unto all always
meghanwaterlillies
Well-Known Member
no nimrod no nwo no midrash no no no no~;> indeed
for those native people knew how to farm while using their native tounge
sometime some people tend to worship their language
see what happened to the old babylon
by the way
what is the the language that humans will use
after this so called
new earth and new heaven
as it is written
:read:
Revelation of John 21:1
I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth have passed away, and the sea is no more.
hope to see you there soon
:ty:
godbless
unto all always
meghanwaterlillies
Well-Known Member
I never
~;> indeed
for those native people knew how to farm while using their native tounge
sometime some people tend to worship their language
see what happened to the old babylon
by the way
what is the the language that humans will use
after this so called
new earth and new heaven
as it is written
:read:
Revelation of John 21:1
I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth have passed away, and the sea is no more.
hope to see you there soon
:ty:
godbless
unto all always
meghanwaterlillies
Well-Known Member
I never even said anyone had to learn my language I went to their countries and they were told they had to learn it or they werent as education their own people told them they had to. AMERICA or whatever else the world wants is not an idol. Yes I reside in an english speaking country. Also no NWO means no OWN project and second warrior of nations. their own people project what is an idol and then mistreated that "idol". Like if I know nothing about you but but my own thoughts and culture makes me think your like a idol it will quickly turn to into the mis info and many people hate idols .. as also.. also they did to many even a woman or man can become an object of hate
firedragon
Veteran Member
This is a clarification.
Quran speaks of three revelations. Torah, Zaboor, Injeel. It does not say this is in the bible. It does not say they came in book form.
Muhammed by name has been mentioned in many books people deem as scripture. Even Hindu scripture. That could be prophesy, it could also be a stupendous coincidence, especially if you look at the hindu scripture.
Jesus preached the gospel according to the NT. It does not say he preached the gospels as we see today, and none of the books were named gospel by anyone but later leaders.
You speak of the bibles found from prior to the 7th century. Of course. There are almost complete bibles from before the 5th century. But, within the books, they do not claim to be the gospel. Nor do they claim to be the Torah or Zaboor.
ukok102nak
Active Member
~;> as what we've said before
as it is "some" not all
and we know you never said anything like that as in being idolistic in linguistic manner as some people always do
thats why
we ask first
what is the the language that humans will use
after this so called
new earth and new heaven
as it is written
:read:
Revelation of John 21:1
I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth have passed away, and the sea is no more.
hope to see you there soon
meaning not this time but when the time comes for all to behold the hidden truth behind the written words of god
as it is written
:read:
Revelation of John 10:7
but in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he is about to sound, then the mystery of God is finished, as he declared to his servants, the prophets.
:ty:
godbless
unto all always
meghanwaterlillies
Well-Known Member
Yeah hopefully soon like 70 x 7 soon~;> as what we've said before
as it is "some" not all
and we know you never said anything like that as in being idolistic in linguistic manner as some people always do
thats why
we ask first
what is the the language that humans will use
after this so called
new earth and new heaven
as it is written
:read:
Revelation of John 21:1
I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth have passed away, and the sea is no more.
hope to see you there soon
meaning not this time but when the time comes for all to behold the hidden truth behind the written words of god
as it is written
:read:
Revelation of John 10:7
but in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he is about to sound, then the mystery of God is finished, as he declared to his servants, the prophets.
:ty:
godbless
unto all always
This is incorrect, Ishmael is regarded as a prophet of God first born of Abraham, and mentioned at least 10 times in the Quran.
So if Muslims think Jacobs line were all prophets too they have some explaining to do.
Muslims appear to have the same sort of argument I have heard from Latter Day Saints. That all the books were corrupt so they gotta write their own coming from one last prophet to finally make the uncorruptable true religion. It seems to me rather convenient that all earth religions were corrupt so these "prophets" can see angels and were able to bring a final true religion. Certainly Muslims complicate things by claiming authority via both Ishmael and Isaacs son Jacob, since Muslims also think Jesus was a great prophet from the line of Jacob. To be frank, Muslim religion is just another Christian offshoot in this respect, but with added religious texts. I do find that hard to reconcile leaning on religions that are supposedly corrupt and then try and convince followers that it won't happen anymore. I'm curious to know what Islam thinks will happen to their religion in end days.
However all that said, how corrupt do Muslims think their father religions really are. I submit this from Quran for consideration.
[Quran 5:65-66] If only the people of the scripture believe and lead a righteous life, we will then remit their sins, and admit them into gardens of bliss. If only they would uphold the TORAH, and the GOSPEL, and what is sent down to them herein (QURAN) from their Lord, they would be showered with blessings from above them and from beneath their feet. Some of them are righteous, but MANY of them are evil-doers.
Oh my....*sigh* Again, we are dealing with separate religions, not different branches of Judaism.
Once again, as time passes, newer religions are created. Coming from this, newer sets of laws for the religious communities are put into place. Some of them carried over from the previous religion, some are altered, others are done away with entirely, and other brand new laws are created. This new set of laws would apply only to the newer religion, not the older ones.
And again, the Jewish Laws are only relevant for Jews, not non-Jews. The same applies to every other religion. There are still Jews in the world, so to them, halakhah applies, not to later religions. And anyway, Tumah, many Jews don't really make a big deal out of the Noahide Laws. For the most part, y'all don't even care to advocate them among followers of other religions, do y'all? So, tell me why the Noahide Laws should matter to me, as a Bahá’í? (Here's something, I hope, meaningful to consider, my Orthodox Jewish brother: my religion does accept Moses as one of many Messengers of G-d, and we do accept the Torah as being Divinely Revealed.
)Well, brother Tumah, y'all dropped the Laws, not us. Again, y'all don't advocate them among us as non-Jews, do y'all? But this genuinely has my interest piqued. I would like to know: I once heard that there was the concept of ‘Noahide’ religions, or followers of other religions (e.g. Muslims) as ‘Noahide’. Is this true? If so, then in your opinion, does my religion count as a ‘Noahide’ religion?
Concerning your question about whether I should, in such a case, remain a Christian or become a Bahá’í, I would search my own heart for such an answer. As to which religion is ideal, Tumah, I believe that any religion that guides you towards righteous actions in life (which, I am convinced, is fundamentally what God expects of people) is ideal. So, either one I chose wouldn't matter at all. From a Bahá’í perspective, “all Religions are ordained of God, and... except a few which are the outcome of human perversities, are reflections of His Will and Purpose. ”
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DawudTalut
Peace be upon you.
Peace be on you.
Unfortunately, world is already there IMO.
Radicalism will not fly too high.
The true -- Revelation Rationality Knowledge and Truth -- will win.
You missed the context. I meant that Ishmael isn't mentioned as the son to be sacrificed.
DawudTalut
Peace be upon you.
Peace be on all.
Yes.
The following quotes indirectly and directly tell that Holy Prophet (pbuh) read and taught the current format of Holy Quran.
1= "Whenever any portion of the Quran was revealed to the Holy Prophet, he used to commit it to memory and, as he continuously recited the Quran from one end to the other, he always carried the whole of the revealed Quran at all times in his memory. In addition to this the following devices were adopted for safe-guarding and preserving intact the text of the Quran :....."
Ref: Page 355 @ https://www.alislam.org/library/books/Introduction-Study-Holy-Quran.pdf
Page 358
The Holy Prophet used to say : "Those of you who wish to learn the Quran should learn it from 'Abdullah bin Mas'ud, Salim Maula Abi Hudhaifa, Mu'adh bin Jabal or Ubayy ibn Ka'b" (Muslim). These four had learnt the whole of the Quran under the supervision of the Holy Prophet.
2= "Once a year during the month of Ramadan (the Muslim month of fasting), the angel Gabriel would recite the entire revelation, revealed up to that time with the Prophet. During the last Ramadan, after the revelations had been completed, the angel recited the entire Quranic revelation to the Prophet twice.(3) This regular annual recitation was also meant to arrange the revelations in their present order."
Ref: https://www.alislam.org/library/links/00000054.html
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firedragon
Veteran Member
I think you misunderstood his question bro.
Tumah
Veteran Member
I don't think that's a proper response to what I've said. I'm talking about how Baha'i has absorbed a few elements of Islam while throwing away the rest. Just as Islam absorbed a few elements of Christianity and threw away the rest. Just as Christianity has absorbed a few elements of Judaism and threw away the rest.
Yes, I understand. Only Baha'i need to follow Baha'i law.
But ideally (and with the help of pioneers), everyone will become Baha'i under the Baha'i NWO where all religionists will stop believing in their own religious principles in order to accept the unity of all religions.
Or to put it in the words of Baha'u'llah:
Soon will the present-day order be rolled up, and a new one spread out in its stead.[6
Of course you need to reinterpret Jewish Law as stating that only people who follow Judaism are Jews, as opposed to the present Law that people born of a Jewish mother or convert is a Jew. Otherwise, there's going to be a problem with all those Jewish converts to Baha'i...
What does your responsibility to G-d have to do with us? I could hear the conversation:
G-d: So DJ, why didn't you follow my Laws?
DJ: Well the Jews don't go around telling people about them, so I just figured I was exempt even though I was aware about them (as I once liked a post explaining in detail all about them).
Not as a Baha'i as a non-Jew. The existence of Baha'i contradicts the already established Divine Noahide Laws. All non-Jews are required to keep the 7 Noahide Laws. Baha'is don't. There is no one about whom you can say, "keeping the 7 Noahide Laws are for Noahides, not Baha'is", because all non-Jews, including yourself are already Noahides.
Yes, I'm aware. Christianity and Islam does too. I don't see how that really matters for the purposes of this conversation.(Here's something, I hope, meaningful to consider, my Orthodox Jewish brother: my religion does accept Moses as one of many Messengers of G-d, and we do accept the Torah as being Divinely Revealed.
That was accidental. To the best of my knowledge, its not true. You've liked my post in the Judaism DIR. You can read all about it there.
All religions were formulated by the manifestations of god, yes I'm aware. However, the Baha'i belief seems to be that eventually Baha'i will become the dominant one.