Questions of Christianity

Snowbear · Jun 4, 2006

The Truth said:
Firstly, How many son does God has?

Most of us Christians believe we are children of God:

Romans 8:13 For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.
14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.
16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:
17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.

To most of us, this means we are "born again" of God... not "begotten" by God as Jesus was:

John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life

The Truth said:
Secondly, Jesus never claim to be the son of God but the son of man.

Yes He does:

John 11:3 Then his sisters sent to Him, saying, Lord, behold, he whom You love is sick.

J4 When Jesus heard, He said, This sickness is not to death, but for the glory of God, so that the Son of God might be glorified by it.

The angel told Mary that the Son of God would be born to her:

Luke 1:34 Then Mary said to the angel, How shall this be, since I do not know a man?
35 And the angel answered and said to her, The Holy Spirit shall come on you, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow you. Therefore also that Holy One which will be born of you shall be called Son of God.

He doesn't deny that He is the Son of God:

John 1:48 Nathanael said to Him, From where do You know me? Jesus answered and said to him, Before Philip called you, when you were under the fig tree, I saw you.

And He even achnowledged it when asked:

Luke 22:70 And they all said, Are you then the Son of God? And He said to them, You say it, because I AM!

And when He died, even the Roman army officer (centurion) aknowledged it:

Mark 15:39 And when the centurion, who stood across from him, saw that He cried out so, and expired, he said, Truly this man was Son of God.

The Truth said:
Finally, you can't prove your faith by disproving others or otherwise, you may lose the argument quickly.

I don't need to 'prove' my faith as my faith is between God and me. I will however, argue my beliefs without having any need to 'win' or 'lose' ... I just state them. Though I know that like faith, the beliefs of myself or others cannot be proved or disproved ... they are as individual and varied as the genetic codes that make up each one of us

... I am the only one who can know my beliefs. However, in doing the research to 'argue' them, I tend to confirm both my beliefs AND my faith

kai · Jun 5, 2006

i like to think i am a seeker of truth and i have looked at many religions and i have joined this forum to gain knowledge ,but i must say I find christianity really confusing, so many denominations, so many versions of the bible,in my very small village in england we have ,methodists,catholics,baptists,church of england, jehovas witness,unless your born into it, its hard to choose and the thought of having to choose dilutes the power of the message,thats why its easier for people to choose islam because it is simpler, i think Jesus would not be a happy chap if he came back and saw what a mess the christians have made of it.

Snowbear · Jun 5, 2006

kai said:
i like to think i am a seeker of truth and i have looked at many religions and i have joined this forum to gain knowledge ,but i must say I find christianity really confusing, so many denominations, so many versions of the bible,in my very small village in england we have ,methodists,catholics,baptists,church of england, jehovas witness,unless your born into it, its hard to choose and the thought of having to choose dilutes the power of the message,thats why its easier for people to choose islam because it is simpler, i think Jesus would not be a happy chap if he came back and saw what a mess the christians have made of it.

I too am a seeker of Truth. I was not "born into" any particular religion or denomination.

Since this thread is about Christianity and since I am one saved by Christ, I'll answer from that perspective.....

Since accepting Christ's salvation 2 years ago, I have had no call or pressure to join or associate with or tie myself to or claim any particular denomination, though by default I suppose I am a part of the "mess made by Christians." Instead, I have attempted to take the message and teachings offered by the Bible itself. Even there, I don't limit myself to a single translation. The Bible that was given to me when I first "converted" is the New King James Version. I find it easy enough read and understand, but I also use the e-Sword software to cross-reference other translations.

I find the 'religion' part of Christianity to be quite simple really.... Love God and love people. Sure there are some who try to complicate things and try to say that this is how you should love God or this is how you should love people. I really don't think it's so important what "denomination" of Christianity a person chooses to belong to. IMO, no matter what church one attends or what denomination or non-denomination one decides to associate with or which Bible translation one chooses to read, what's important is that the message one receives is the is the message that Jesus came to earth to tell us. If the church or translation or whatever is diluting or complicating that message, then well.... maybe..... just maybe.... there's reason to consider that there's something wrong with that version of the message

TashaN · Jun 5, 2006

You have a point, as you said in christianity human beings are children of God but on the other hand, Jesus and David, both of them are the begotten sons of God.

"...the Lord hath said unto me (David): 'Thou art My son: this day have I begotten thee." (Psalms 2:7)

Also he said according to the bible that two persons are his first born at the same time.

"...Israel is My son, even My firstborn:" (Exodus 4:22)
"...for I (God) am a Father to Israel, and Ephraim is My firstborn." (Jeremiah 31:9)

michel · Jun 5, 2006

The Truth said:
You have a point, as you said in christianity human beings are children of God but on the other hand, Jesus and David, both of them are the begotten sons of God.

"...the Lord hath said unto me (David): 'Thou art My son: this day have I begotten thee." (Psalms 2:7)

Also he said according to the bible that two persons are his first born at the same time.

"...Israel is My son, even My firstborn:" (Exodus 4:22)
"...for I (God) am a Father to Israel, and Ephraim is My firstborn." (Jeremiah 31:9)

"...the Lord hath said unto me (David): 'Thou art My son: this day have I begotten thee." (Psalms 2:7)

From what I can make out, that is a difference in Islamic understanding and Christianity. We Christians believe that this referred to Jesus; as in:-
(from http://www.christian-oneness.org/chapter9.htm)

(an extract)
Psalm 2:7; quoted in Acts 13:33, Hebrews 1:5 and Hebrews 5:5. This creates a problem: namely, how can Jesus be the Son eternally, yet have been begotten as Son on a fixed day in time? This chapter will present a consistent approach to this question.

In Christianity, Jesus is the only Begotten son of God.

joeboonda · Jun 5, 2006

The Truth said:
You have a point, as you said in christianity human beings are children of God but on the other hand, Jesus and David, both of them are the begotten sons of God.

"...the Lord hath said unto me (David): 'Thou art My son: this day have I begotten thee." (Psalms 2:7)

Also he said according to the bible that two persons are his first born at the same time.

"...Israel is My son, even My firstborn:" (Exodus 4:22)
"...for I (God) am a Father to Israel, and Ephraim is My firstborn." (Jeremiah 31:9)

Ok, first, lets get Psalms in the proper context, the whole context, for He was speaking of the Messiah:

2:4 He that sitteth in the heavens shall laugh: the LORD shall have them in derision.
2:5 Then shall he speak unto them in his wrath, and vex them in his sore displeasure.
2:6 Yet have I set my king upon my holy hill of Zion.
2:7 I will declare the decree: the LORD hath said unto me, Thou art my Son; this day have I begotten thee.
2:8 Ask of me, and I shall give thee the heathen for thine inheritance, and the uttermost parts of the earth for thy possession.
2:9 Thou shalt break them with a rod of iron; thou shalt dash them in pieces like a potter's vessel.

The Messiah, Jesus Christ, is the king on the holy hill of Zion who is God's only begotten son. He will rule the earth for his possession. It is the same as the verse quoted by NT writers, from Psalms 110:1

110:1 The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou at my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool.
(King James Bible, Psalms)

Jesus Christ is unique, He is the only begotten Son of God, and He is One with God, and He is God. He is a member of the Trinity. One of the 3 persons who make up God, much like a married couple, God says are now one flesh, so are God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit.

joeboonda · Jun 5, 2006

kai said:
i like to think i am a seeker of truth and i have looked at many religions and i have joined this forum to gain knowledge ,but i must say I find christianity really confusing, so many denominations, so many versions of the bible,in my very small village in england we have ,methodists,catholics,baptists,church of england, jehovas witness,unless your born into it, its hard to choose and the thought of having to choose dilutes the power of the message,thats why its easier for people to choose islam because it is simpler, i think Jesus would not be a happy chap if he came back and saw what a mess the christians have made of it.

Yes, that is why Jesus wrote to the 7 churches in Revelation, which many feel represent, not only real churches of the day, but of the church down through history, and of individual churches today. The central point, however, is that Jesus died, was buried, and rose again according to scripture. If we trust in Him alone to save us, in His death, for payment of our sins, then we are saved. Now, we are to study to show ourselves approved of God, a workman rightly dividing the word of truth. So, some 'denominations' only differ in small non-essential beliefs and practices, while others, which I would call a cult, or false religion, differ on ESSENTIAL doctrines of the faith. We are to 'beware of false prophets', Jesus said. So, we are to examine the doctrines and prove that which is good. As for your above mentioned groups, Methodist, Baptist, Church of England, probably are closer to each other, then Catholic, then way on out there would be the Jehovah Witnesses, which I would again say, way out there, out past the realms of Christianity IMO. Focus on JESUS CHRIST and His free gift of salvation, you don't earn as a reward, but receive as a gift, good works to follow, study the Word, and find a good Bible-believing Church, and get involved, pray and study.

logician · Jun 5, 2006

The gospels were written by anonymous authors well after the supposed tenure of Jesus. Given their many conflicts and impossibilities, they can be considered to be nothing more than another religious mythology invented by the literalist sect of Christianity.

joeboonda · Jun 5, 2006

logician said:
The gospels were written by anonymous authors well after the supposed tenure of Jesus. Given their many conflicts and impossibilities, they can be considered to be nothing more than another religious mythology invented by the literalist sect of Christianity.

That may be your opinion, and you are welcome to it, although MANY folks would wholeheartedly disagree, but where does that fit in with the line of this thread?

logician · Jun 5, 2006

When was Jesus born?

When did he die?

Why did Paul act like he never heard of an earthly Jesus?

Why was nothing recorded of the first 30 years of his life, except for the ridiculous temple story?

joeboonda · Jun 5, 2006

logician]When was Jesus born?

We know within 4 years or so, pretty good for 2k+

When did he die?

We know to within 4 years or so...

Why did Paul act like he never heard of an earthly Jesus?

Paul preached Christ crucified, buried, and risen again, that is pretty earthly to me.

Why was nothing recorded of the first 30 years of his life, except for the ridiculous temple story?

His ministry BEGAN when He was 30, and I hope you are prepared to answer to the Lord for calling a story of the Holy Scripture ridiculous. I think I am ready to add someone to my ignore list....

logician · Jun 5, 2006

LOL, WHO is "WE", give some supporting links.

As a matter of fact, nobody knows when Jesus was born or died, the gospels give varying accounts of his birth which could vary the date by decades. Paul never referred to any of Jesus's teachings, always referring to a spiritual Christ(GNOSTIC).

The Catholic church decided what gospels were "true" and which weren't in the fourth century, which carved the literalist Christ in stone.

joeboonda · Jun 5, 2006

I have studied His birth date, I will let you if you are interested search it out yourself. And you obviously have not read the Bible for Paul preached thus:

15:3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; 15:4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: 15:5 And that he was seen of Cephas, then of the twelve: 15:6 After that, he was seen of above five hundred brethren at once; of whom the greater part remain unto this present, but some are fallen asleep.
(King James Bible, 1 Corinthians)

That sounds like a VERY REAL PHYSICAL, not spiritual, Christ to me. Of course you do not believe the Bible, so I am wasting my time here.

4:3 But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost: 4:4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.
(King James Bible, 2 Corinthians)

logician · Jun 5, 2006

Don't do me any favors.

SunMessenger · Jun 6, 2006

logician said:
LOL, WHO is "WE", give some supporting links.

As a matter of fact, nobody knows when Jesus was born or died, the gospels give varying accounts of his birth which could vary the date by decades. Paul never referred to any of Jesus's teachings, always referring to a spiritual Christ(GNOSTIC).

The Catholic church decided what gospels were "true" and which weren't in the fourth century, which carved the literalist Christ in stone.

If you claim to have all the answers then why post here ? You do not ask questions to gain answers. You ask questions in an attempt to prove something contrary to those who respond to you. One beautiful thing about ones beliefs is that there is no need to prove or disprove them. A logical mind would have already known that so your actions here do not seem logical at all . So if it is logic you profess what is your point ? Be Well and God Bless...

logician · Jun 6, 2006

Very good for Christianity, since nobody can prove Jesus even existed.

SunMessenger · Jun 7, 2006

logician said:
Very good for Christianity, since nobody can prove Jesus even existed.

I must also impress the converse. No one can prove that He did not ... Be Well and God Bless...

logician · Jun 7, 2006

The onus is always on the person who posits something to prove it, not on somone else to disprove it. I can say the moon is made of green cheese, which implies I had better have evidence to back my claim. The onus is NOT on the other guy to prove the moon isn't made of green cheese. LIkewise, Christianity says that Jesus lived, performed miracles, died, and was ressurected, yet offers no convincing proof whatsoever that such a fantasy really happened.

SunMessenger · Jun 8, 2006

logician said:
The onus is always on the person who posits something to prove it, not on somone else to disprove it. I can say the moon is made of green cheese, which implies I had better have evidence to back my claim. The onus is NOT on the other guy to prove the moon isn't made of green cheese. LIkewise, Christianity says that Jesus lived, performed miracles, died, and was ressurected, yet offers no convincing proof whatsoever that such a fantasy really happened.

You should have told that to Albert Einstein since his theory of relativity has been accepted in the scientific community but has never been proven in any visable way. I say one does not need to prove their religious beliefs to anyone on this earth. People should enjoy their lifes of worship without any such clutter. We proved that the moon is not made of cheese in 1969. Remember the one small step for man and one giant leap for mankind. Oh by the way if the moon had been made of cheese I would have wished for cream cheese. I love that stuff:drool: :cheese: Be Well and God Bless...

ÃsahÃ¦ttr · Jun 8, 2006

SunMessenger said:
You should have told that to Albert Einstein since his theory of relativity has been accepted in the scientific community but has never been proven in any visable way.

Rubbish. The predictions of the bending of light is the first example that comes to mind. There have also been no end of experiments showing that time does slow down at high speeds.

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