Where Inspiration?

Booko · May 17, 2006

evearael said:
...and that is my incentive to relearn Hebrew. My husband will buy it for me, if I do. :bounce

If you don't want the 9 qt. baking dish, can I buy it off you?

evearael · May 17, 2006

If you don't want the 9 qt. baking dish, can I buy it off you?

Yes, for the low, low price of $2,998... Just kidding! If I got that I would be so happy, I would give you the 9 qt. baking dish. However, considering my work load, it will take a while, so don't pin all your baking hopes on me...

sandy whitelinger · May 17, 2006

Booko said:
If you don't want the 9 qt. baking dish, can I buy it off you?

Hmm, I thought that was the incentive.

Ody · May 17, 2006

sandy whitelinger said:
Do most followers of Judaism believe this?

That is a great reason on why i rejected christianity and chose judaism and embraced my roots. Yes the majority of jews believe it is our actions that decide whether we attain salvation or not, that you did not know this is somewhat depressing, it is a basic fact of Judaism.

Ody · May 17, 2006

sandy whitelinger said:
I know I could look it up, but in general what is the mitzvot?

Good deed, Righteous action. Also doing a commandment.

Ody · May 17, 2006

sandy whitelinger said:
would this by any chance include things that go back to conversations between Adam and G-d?

We recieved all of the oral torah at Har Sinai.

Booko · May 17, 2006

AlanGurvey said:
That is a great reason on why i rejected christianity and chose judaism and embraced my roots. Yes the majority of jews believe it is our actions that decide whether we attain salvation or not, that you did not know this is somewhat depressing, it is a basic fact of Judaism.

A Jewish e-friend of mine once explained that he didn't care what people believed, because you can't measure belief. Anyone can say they believe anything. So what? What you can measure is behaviour, and that's what he cared about and what Judaism cared about.

jewscout · May 17, 2006

Booko said:
A Jewish e-friend of mine once explained that he didn't care what people believed, because you can't measure belief. Anyone can say they believe anything. So what? What you can measure is behaviour, and that's what he cared about and what Judaism cared about.

frubals to that!!

sandy whitelinger · May 18, 2006

AlanGurvey said:
That is a great reason on why i rejected christianity and chose judaism and embraced my roots. Yes the majority of jews believe it is our actions that decide whether we attain salvation or not, that you did not know this is somewhat depressing, it is a basic fact of Judaism.

Why then even have an animal sacrifice for sin?

Also what is it that might be in the Talmud or the Mishnah that circumvents this scripture:

Leviticus 17:11 "For the life of the flesh is in the blood: and I have given it to you upon the altar to make anatonement for your souls: for it is the blood that maketh an atonement for the soul."

angellous_evangellous · May 18, 2006

sandy whitelinger said:
Why then even have an animal sacrifice for sin?

Perhaps our Jewish friends can correct me...

It's my understanding that Judaism compensated for not having a Temple with the mizvot. Judaism did not stop with the destruction of the Temple, which hailed the end of animal sacrifices. It boldly kept going, virtually (IMHO) unaffected by the Jesus followers and subsequent Christian movements.

It is useless and silly to interpret Judaism through Christianity. Christians cannot teach Jews about God. :no:

It is always the other way around.

jewscout · May 18, 2006

angellous_evangellous said:
Perhaps our Jewish friends can correct me...

It's my understanding that Judaism compensated for not having a Temple with the mizvot. Judaism did not stop with the destruction of the Temple, which hailed the end of animal sacrifices. It boldly kept going, virtually (IMHO) unaffected by the Jesus followers and subsequent Christian movements.

It is useless and silly to interpret Judaism through Christianity. Christians cannot teach Jews about God. :no:

It is always the other way around.

close sir,
the mitzvot were there before, during, and after the Temple...they are simply the Commandments or Laws of the Torah.
now we replace sacfices in the context of repentance w/ prayers and good deeds and charity, all part of Judaism AND Torah:angel2:

angellous_evangellous · May 18, 2006

jewscout said:
close sir,
the mitzvot were there before, during, and after the Temple...they are simply the Commandments or Laws of the Torah.
now we replace sacfices in the context of repentance w/ prayers and good deeds and charity, all part of Judaism AND Torah:angel2:

Yes... I was going to say that the Babylonian exile - being away from the Temple - prepared Judaism for its later stages without a Temple. The emphasis definately changed when there was no sacrafice... I imagine..

sandy whitelinger · May 18, 2006

jewscout said:
close sir,
the mitzvot were there before, during, and after the Temple...they are simply the Commandments or Laws of the Torah.
now we replace sacfices in the context of repentance w/ prayers and good deeds and charity, all part of Judaism AND Torah:angel2:

Back to my question then, why have animal sacrifice at all and what specifically (specific source) allows the circumvention of blood atonement?

jewscout · May 18, 2006

sandy whitelinger said:
Back to my question then, why have animal sacrifice at all and what specifically (specific source) allows the circumvention of blood atonement?

first off your OP talks about saving...saving from what??

why have animal sacrifices..there are several answers to that, one is that the Israelites wanted to worship HaShem in the style of the time so He basically said, if ur gonna do this do it THIS way.
another is that this was a result of the spiritual fall of the Golden Calf.
Another is that it represents a physical representation of our desire to please and be close to G-d, the hebrew word Korbon, doesn't really mean "Sacrifice" anyways.

circumvention of blood sacrifice...Hosea
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]"Take words with you, And return to the LORD. Say to Him, "Take away all iniquity; receive us graciously, For we will render for bulls the offering of our lips." (Hosea 14:2-3)[/FONT]
http://www.outreachjudaism.org/response.html

jewscout · May 18, 2006

angellous_evangellous said:
Yes... I was going to say that the Babylonian exile - being away from the Temple - prepared Judaism for its later stages without a Temple. The emphasis definately changed when there was no sacrafice... I imagine..

yepper

Feathers in Hair · May 18, 2006

Booko said:
A moose once bit my sister.

Booko, I admire your kindness and civility!

sandy whitelinger · May 18, 2006

jewscout said:
first off your OP talks about saving...saving from what??

Let's take a stab here..........eternal damnation.

jewscout said:
why have animal sacrifices..there are several answers to that, one is that the Israelites wanted to worship HaShem in the style of the time so He basically said, if ur gonna do this do it THIS way..

Is this from the Talmud or the Mishna because it certainly isn't in the Old Testament?

jewscout said:
Another is that it represents a physical representation of our desire to please and be close to G-d, the hebrew word Korbon, doesn't really mean "Sacrifice" anyways.

Oh puhlease!!!!

jewscout · May 18, 2006

Let's take a stab here..........eternal damnation.

here's a shocker...judaism doesn't believe in eternal damnation so your entire line of questioning in pointless

Is this from the Talmud or the Mishna because it certainly isn't in the Old Testament?

it rabbinical commentary...

Oh puhlease!!!!

well you can choose to pretend like it means whatever you want it to...
but often times hebrew words don't have accurate english equivilants...which often happens in translations from one language to another....

Sandy if the point of your line of questioning is to convince jews to believe in Jesus to escape eternal damnation and be "saved" you aren't doing a good job of it (not to mention prosylitizing is against RF rules)

if you honestly want to know how jews deal w/ sin w/o the Temple and Korbonim I believe many people have already answered your question adequately...simply reread the thread.

that being said i will no longer entertain questions for the purposes of finding loopholes to exploit, i have explained and defended the jewish stance, accept or don't it's your choice.

but if your looking for someone to convert go do it somewhere else...ur just wasting your time w/ me...u won't win.

sandy whitelinger · May 19, 2006

jewscout said:
circumvention of blood sacrifice...Hosea
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]"Take words with you, And return to the LORD. Say to Him, "Take away all iniquity; receive us graciously, For we will render for bulls the offering of our lips." (Hosea 14:2-3)[/FONT]
http://www.outreachjudaism.org/response.html

Why then did the blood sacrifices continue after this?

Sandy if the point of your line of questioning is to convince jews to believe in Jesus to escape eternal damnation and be "saved" you aren't doing a good job of it (not to mention prosylitizing is against RF rules)

if you honestly want to know how jews deal w/ sin w/o the Temple and Korbonim I believe many people have already answered your question adequately...simply reread the thread.

that being said i will no longer entertain questions for the purposes of finding loopholes to exploit, i have explained and defended the jewish stance, accept or don't it's your choice.

Not once in this thread have I even mentioned Jesus nor have I made one attempt to proselytize anyone. Perhaps it is you who needs to stop projecting your own misconceptions onto what I am doing.

I am asking questions for clarification. If there is any real confusion about that it is unintentional from my part.

If it is not obvious that I've asked questions for clarification then, maybe, I'll try harder. Yet if something doesn't make sense from my understanding I'll continue to either have my understanding increasesed or point out inconsistencies. If that doesn't suit your fancy I'll not stay up night fretting over it.

angellous_evangellous · May 19, 2006

jewscout said:
that being said i will no longer entertain questions for the purposes of finding loopholes to exploit

sandy whitelinger said:
I'll continue to... point out inconsistencies.

:grill:

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