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Was King David hypocritical here (not about the mother of Solomon)?

rusra02

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
No, I don't think David was hypocritical in asking God to punish his enemies. David was anointed by God as king in Israel. David's enemies were Jehovah's enemies. David was fighting these wicked enemies in the "wars of Jehovah" and with God's backing and approval. (1 Samuel 25:28)
 

NewChapter

GiveMeATicketToWork
No, I don't think David was hypocritical in asking God to punish his enemies. David was anointed by God as king in Israel. David's enemies were Jehovah's enemies. David was fighting these wicked enemies in the "wars of Jehovah" and with God's backing and approval. (1 Samuel 25:28)

The Messianic "Golden Rule" would still apply I would believe.

David's Lord (the Messiah) said, "do unto others as you would have done unto you."

:)
 

rusra02

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
The Messianic "Golden Rule" would still apply I would believe.

David's Lord (the Messiah) said, "do unto others as you would have done unto you."

:)
I don't think there is a disconnect. True Christians are to love even their enemies. As God's appointed King, Jesus the Messiah will soon execute God's enemies. Both he and David act with authority from Jehovah and at his command.(Psalm 2)
 

NewChapter

GiveMeATicketToWork
I don't think there is a disconnect. True Christians are to love even their enemies. As God's appointed King, Jesus the Messiah will soon execute God's enemies. Both he and David act with authority from Jehovah and at his command.(Psalm 2)

"Pray for those who despitefully use you" is what David did. Perhaps David would have had himself prayed against if he were in the shoes of the people he prayed against (thus, he did to others what he would have had done to him maybe.)
 

RabbiO

הרב יונה בן זכריה
The Messianic "Golden Rule" would still apply I would believe.

David's Lord (the Messiah) said, "do unto others as you would have done unto you."

:)

You have noted that you are not a Christian, yet your remark here only makes sense from a Christian perspective, certainly not from a Jewish point of view.

Why? Because it is premised on the messiah having come, and that messiah being Jesus.

Putting aside whether David was hypocritical in the particular instance cited, there is a different issue suggested by your original question.

You seem to be surprised that David might have very human faults. It's as if you expected David to be without failings.

If that is what you expected to read of David, then you will be disappointed in him, and just about every other person in the Hebrew Bible. The men and women who people Jewish scripture, be it the patriarchs, the matriarchs, Joseph, his brothers, Moses, Aaron and so on, are displayed in all their humanity, that which was good and that which was not. The men and women who people Jewish scripture are not cardboard cutouts, stick figures.
 

NewChapter

GiveMeATicketToWork
You have noted that you are not a Christian, yet your remark here only makes sense from a Christian perspective, certainly not from a Jewish point of view.

Why? Because it is premised on the messiah having come, and that messiah being Jesus.

Putting aside whether David was hypocritical in the particular instance cited, there is a different issue suggested by your original question.

You seem to be surprised that David might have very human faults. It's as if you expected David to be without failings.

If that is what you expected to read of David, then you will be disappointed in him, and just about every other person in the Hebrew Bible. The men and women who people Jewish scripture, be it the patriarchs, the matriarchs, Joseph, his brothers, Moses, Aaron and so on, are displayed in all their humanity, that which was good and that which was not. The men and women who people Jewish scripture are not cardboard cutouts, stick figures.

Actually David was alleged to have a heart that was the same as God's heart which makes David a special figure.

Yes I do believe that Jesus is the Messiah but I am not a Christian.

Peace to you,
Noah
 

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
We were talking about the story of David intending to kill a man who refused to help him, while generally throughout the Psalms he asks forgiveness for his evil.
The story is somewhere is 1 Samuel.
The brothers here have answered the question...perhaps David sought forgiveness in as much as he acknowledged his evil and repented, whereas those whom he prayed against & sought to kill did not "acknowledge and repent."

Thank you for your reply.
David and Goliath in 1 Samuel 17
David and Jonathan 1 Samuel 18
David and Saul 1 Samuel 19
David and Nabal 1 Samuel 25
David given Ziklag 1 Samuel 27
David mistrusted by the Philistines 1 Samuel 29
David defeats Amalekites 1 Samuel 30

Wealthy sheep-owner Nabal refused to help David. Nabal was very bad according to 1 Samuel 25:2-3; 1 Samuel 25:17; 1 Samuel 25:21; 1 Samuel 25:23-25
Nabal's own men feared how David would react and told, Not David, but told his wife Abigail. As David approached intending to slay Nabal, Abigail persuaded him not to become guilty.
David, although being imperfect, took the sensible advice of Abigail. About ten days later Nabal was struck dead by God - 1 Samuel 25:37-39
Where does it say David prayed against Nabal, or is it someone else you have in mind ?
 
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URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
Actually David was alleged to have a heart that was the same as God's heart which makes David a special figure.
Yes I do believe that Jesus is the Messiah but I am not a Christian.
Peace to you,
Noah

David prayed at Psalms 51:10-12 that God would create in him a pure heart, and put within him a new spirit, a steadfast one.
 

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
No, I don't think David was hypocritical in asking God to punish his enemies. David was anointed by God as king in Israel. David's enemies were Jehovah's enemies. David was fighting these wicked enemies in the "wars of Jehovah" and with God's backing and approval. (1 Samuel 25:28)

Isn't it Abigail (handmaid) speaking at 1 Samuel 25:23-25; 1 Samuel 25:26-28 and Not David ?________ 1 Samuel 25:32
Where in 1 Samuel 25:28 is David praying asking God to punish
 

NewChapter

GiveMeATicketToWork
Thank you for your reply.
David and Goliath in 1 Samuel 17
David and Jonathan 1 Samuel 18
David and Saul 1 Samuel 19
David and Nabal 1 Samuel 25
David given Ziklag 1 Samuel 27
David mistrusted by the Philistines 1 Samuel 29
David defeats Amalekites 1 Samuel 30

Wealthy sheep-owner Nabal refused to help David. Nabal was very bad according to 1 Samuel 25:2-3; 1 Samuel 25:17; 1 Samuel 25:21; 1 Samuel 25:23-25
Nabal's own men feared how David would react and told, Not David, but told his wife Abigail. As David approached intending to slay Nabal, Abigail persuaded him not to become guilty.
David, although being imperfect, took the sensible advice of Abigail. About ten days later Nabal was struck dead by God - 1 Samuel 25:37-39
Where does it say David prayed against Nabal, or is it someone else you have in mind ?

In the Psalms he prays against people a lot. A prayer of his that I have adopted is his prayer against the people who fed him bile, from Psalms 69:21-28.

Psalm 69:21-28
New International Version (NIV)
(21)They put gall in my food
and gave me vinegar for my thirst.
(22)May the table set before them become a snare;
may it become retribution and a trap.
(23)May their eyes be darkened so they cannot see,
and their backs be bent forever.
(24)Pour out your wrath on them;
let your fierce anger overtake them.
(25)May their place be deserted;
let there be no one to dwell in their tents.
(26)For they persecute those you wound
and talk about the pain of those you hurt.
(27)Charge them with crime upon crime;
do not let them share in your salvation.
(28)May they be blotted out of the book of life
and not be listed with the righteous.
 

NewChapter

GiveMeATicketToWork
David prayed at Psalms 51:10-12 that God would create in him a pure heart, and put within him a new spirit, a steadfast one.

Acts 13:22
English Standard Version (ESV)
(22)And when he had removed him, he raised up David to be their king, of whom he testified and said, ‘I have found in David the son of Jesse a man after my heart, who will do all my will.’
 

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
In the Psalms he prays against people a lot. A prayer of his that I have adopted is his prayer against the people who fed him bile, from Psalms 69:21-28.

Psalm 69:21-28
New International Version (NIV)
(21)They put gall in my food
and gave me vinegar for my thirst.
(22)May the table set before them become a snare;
may it become retribution and a trap.
(23)May their eyes be darkened so they cannot see,
and their backs be bent forever.
(24)Pour out your wrath on them;
let your fierce anger overtake them.
(25)May their place be deserted;
let there be no one to dwell in their tents.
(26)For they persecute those you wound
and talk about the pain of those you hurt.
(27)Charge them with crime upon crime;
do not let them share in your salvation.
(28)May they be blotted out of the book of life
and not be listed with the righteous.

Psalm 69 is a prayer for rescue.
David is being prophetic of Jesus as Messiah
Psalms 69:21 corresponds to Matthew 27:34; Matthew 27:48; Mark 15:23; Mark 15:36; Luke 23:36; John 19:29

In our day, at the soon coming ' time of separation ' on earth - Matthew 25:31-33 - the haughty 'goats' will be blotted out of the book of life.
If not, they would corrupt the righteous ' sheep ' - Matthew 25:37. The words from Jesus' mouth will execute the wicked - Isaiah 11:3-4; Revelation 19:11; Revelation 19:15; Psalms 92:7
 

NewChapter

GiveMeATicketToWork
Psalm 69 is a prayer for rescue.
David is being prophetic of Jesus as Messiah
Psalms 69:21 corresponds to Matthew 27:34; Matthew 27:48; Mark 15:23; Mark 15:36; Luke 23:36; John 19:29

In our day, at the soon coming ' time of separation ' on earth - Matthew 25:31-33 - the haughty 'goats' will be blotted out of the book of life.
If not, they would corrupt the righteous ' sheep ' - Matthew 25:37. The words from Jesus' mouth will execute the wicked - Isaiah 11:3-4; Revelation 19:11; Revelation 19:15; Psalms 92:7

Yeah David prayed against them.

Christianity teaches, if I'm not mistaken, that if one confesses and repents of his or her evil God is faithful and just to forgive the evil.

So, David always confesses his iniquity in the Psalms. I guess if he confessed & repented he could seek forgiveness, and that those whom he prayed against never confessed and repented.
 

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
Yeah David prayed against them.
Christianity teaches, if I'm not mistaken, that if one confesses and repents of his or her evil God is faithful and just to forgive the evil.
So, David always confesses his iniquity in the Psalms. I guess if he confessed & repented he could seek forgiveness, and that those whom he prayed against never confessed and repented.

Yes, David repented for having Uriah murdered in the front lines, however David did Not pray against Uriah, and David and Bath-sheba were blessed with Solomon.
 

rusra02

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
Isn't it Abigail (handmaid) speaking at 1 Samuel 25:23-25; 1 Samuel 25:26-28 and Not David ?________ 1 Samuel 25:32
Where in 1 Samuel 25:28 is David praying asking God to punish
Yes, it was Abagail who rightly said to David; "Jehovah will without fail make for my lord a lasting house, because my lord is fighting the wars of Jehovah." David was fighting with Jehovah's authorization, and that was the point made at 1 Samuel 25:28)
 
Its very simple. David confessed in his sins, and REPENTED. But his enemies WELL KNEW that he was appointed as the king to rule over God's chosen nation, but they still resisted him taking the throne.
 
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