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If humans evolved from apes, why are there still apes?

I dont belive in evilution or anything but i know the answer to your original qustion.
Chimps, apes and other primates, such as humans suposebly had a common ancestor which evolved in many different creature to suit thier enviorment(suposebly).
 

MdmSzdWhtGuy

Well-Known Member
Tiberius said:
I've found that an analogy with cars can sometimes help people understand the idea of evolution of Humans from apes.

It's like saying, "if a Porsche evolved from a Landcruiser, whya re there still Landcruisers?"

Porsches didn't "evolve" from Landcruisers. it's more accurate to say that Porsches and landcruisers both evolved from an earlier type of car, let's say the Model T Ford.

As time went on, some cars took the parts of the Model T that were adapted to travelling over rough terrain and enhaced them and improved them, while others ignored the rough terrain aspects of the Model T and instead developed so as to be able to travel faster.

So we now have two types of car. One type is more suited to travel over rough terrain, and the other kind is more suited to travel fast. Both of these types of car "evolved" from an earlier car, a common automobile "ancestor".

In the same way, there was a type of ape that lived a long time ago, and over time, it evolved in the same way as the cars. Some of these apes evolved to be gorillas, others evolved to be chimps, and others evolved to be Humans.

This is the best, most workable analogy I have ever heard on this subject. I hope you don't mind, but I am gonna steal that analogy for future real life debates on the subject.

B.
 

randb

Member
1. I agree with you. I get really mad, when my Christian friends come up with the stupidest of questions like this one.
2. Evolution has nothing to do with being smart. Living things don't evolve by thinking. It just happens. Can you stop you're kidney from functioning for a while?...or your heart?
3. The car analogy is awesome...I've tried using that before...and they always say "oh...so u're saying that cars evolved over time...which clearly means that you're ignorant"
 

Scuba Pete

Le plongeur avec attitude...
The real issue here is not an intentional lie or willful ignorance. It's a matter of an ill conceived concept of mutual exclusivity.

Quite a number of atheists have used the argument that the presence of evolution disproves God. Thus they have drawn a line in the sand that any belief in evolution is in fact showing your disbelief in God.

Nothing could be further from the truth and I would suggest that it is incumbent upon all who love knowledge and the truth to expose this fallacy. There is no reason that theists and atheists alike can't agree that evolution or non-evolution proves nothing about the existence of God.
 

Tiberius

Well-Known Member
MdmSzdWhtGuy said:
This is the best, most workable analogy I have ever heard on this subject. I hope you don't mind, but I am gonna steal that analogy for future real life debates on the subject.

B.

:D Go right ahead! Glad you like it!
 
Why are there still chimps?
I believe in Creation (book of Genesis). I don't this precludes belief or understanding in Evolution type theories.
 

michel

Administrator Emeritus
Staff member
ch'ang said:
We did not evolve from pigs or apes or any other animal today, we share a common ancestor with apes and nothing more. If you want to take it all the way back we share a common ancestor with everything but it is more useful to only talk about recent ones.

Nice one! I agree; why did we evolve 'further' than apes ? I don't know; maybe it was a case of being in the right place at the right time; but we did all emmanate from a common beginning. We are merely a 'different mutation (?)' than that of apes.
 

Yerda

Veteran Member
NetDoc said:
Quite a number of atheists have used the argument that the presence of evolution disproves God. Thus they have drawn a line in the sand that any belief in evolution is in fact showing your disbelief in God.
That sounds more likely to come from a theist.
 

jeffrey

†ßig Dog†
I've seen documentaries on TV about how places that are cut off from the rest of the world that has animals and plant life that has evolved differently. Places in South America and where Darwin got his theory from, the... going to spell this wrong, Galapolis Islands. It's obvious, and with proof that animals and plants have evolved, why is it so hard to believe that man did too?
 

robtex

Veteran Member
jeffrey said:
with proof that animals and plants have evolved, why is it so hard to believe that man did too?

Jeff, from what I have learned on here, the reason for many theist having issue with the idea of man evolving is the idea that man is the zenith of God's creation and therefore not changeable or a product of evolution. I was reading a book about javaman at my part-time job ( http://www.mikedust.com/history/javaman.html) and some early anthropolical studies of skeleton remains of him. A number of my co-workers were uncomfortable that such a book existed and I would bring it into their workplace. An interesting question could be what theists think Javaman's relation to God was and where exactly it that belief system got Javaman today.
 

jeffrey

†ßig Dog†
Go back to th time of the bible. They had no concept of evolution. No idea of the ice age or iron age. The earth was flat. They had no idea's of planets. Their concept of how a woman became pregnant was wrong. (They didn't know a woman has eggs). The point being, how could they write about something they knew nothing about? If God would have told them, do you really believe they would understand?
 

jeffrey

†ßig Dog†
Rob, I know nothing about him, and being on my phone... I'll check that link out tonight. Of course, I believe in a God, a creator. Someone or something that got the ball rolling, so to speak. But to me, the OT is just stories, with alot of it man trying to figure out where he came from. Back then, I'm sure what they thought made sense.
 

Todd

Rajun Cajun
jeffrey said:
Go back to th time of the bible. They had no concept of evolution. No idea of the ice age or iron age. The earth was flat. They had no idea's of planets. Their concept of how a woman became pregnant was wrong. (They didn't know a woman has eggs). The point being, how could they write about something they knew nothing about? If God would have told them, do you really believe they would understand?

Actually, they did have concept of evolution back in biblical times. In 5th century B.C., the Greek phylosipher/scientist Empedocles (I think he was called the Father of Evolution, but not sure) tried to explain creation in natural terms instead of supernatural. He described cave men and primitive life forms evolving into higher life forms.

Here's some biblical references that might explain that they new about this theory in biblical times. They don't specifically use the word "evolution", however it describes peoples view against creation. I've underlined the key points that somewhat describe evolutionary philosophy in the bible.

Colossians 2:8See to it that no one takes you captive through hollow and deceptive philosophy, which depends on human tradition and the basic principles of this world rather than on Christ.

2 Peter 3:3 First of all, you must understand that in the last days scoffers will come, scoffing and following their own evil desires. 4They will say, "Where is this 'coming' he promised? Ever since our fathers died, everything goes on as it has since the beginning of creation." 5But they deliberately forget that long ago by God's word the heavens existed and the earth was formed out of water and by water. 6By these waters also the world of that time was deluged and destroyed.
 

evearael

Well-Known Member
No idea of the ice age or iron age.

That's not quite true:
Genesis 4:22 "Zillah also had a son, Tubal-Cain, who forged all kinds of tools out of bronze and iron. Tubal-Cain's sister was Naamah."
 

jeffrey

†ßig Dog†
Interesting, Todd. I believe in parts :) of that. God created this world. And the last part I believe was their reference to the flood. False theories, Seeing the evidence of evolution, how could it be false? You have the caveman, so to speak, so what happened to him? God killed him off and created Adam and Eve?
 

Todd

Rajun Cajun
jeffrey said:
You have the caveman, so to speak, so what happened to him? God killed him off and created Adam and Eve?

Nope. They were around during biblical times. There were many cave dwellers. Even David and Saul spent time in caves, although I'm sure that's not what you are talking about. One "theory", is that there was a degeneration in some humans whether spiritual or physical or financial. Many people in caves were considered poor and savage outcasts in biblical days. Here's some references. My comments are in blue.

Genesis 19:30 Lot and his two daughters left Zoar and settled in the mountains, for he was afraid to stay in Zoar. He and his two daughters lived in a cave.

Job 24:8 They are drenched by mountain rains and hug the rocks for lack of shelter.

You should probably read the whole chapter of Job 24 as it describes these people as poor, wild, and almost animal like. (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=job%2024&version=31)


Job 30:3 Haggard from want and hunger,
they roamed [a] the parched land
in desolate wastelands at night.
4 In the brush they gathered salt herbs,
and their food [b] was the root of the broom tree.
5 They were banished from their fellow men,
shouted at as if they were thieves.
6 They were forced to live in the dry stream beds,
among the rocks and in holes in the ground.
7 They brayed among the bushes
and huddled in the undergrowth. 8 A base and nameless brood,
they were driven out of the land.

This explains one possibility of what might have happened ("they were driven out of the land"). This is all I can come up with for now since I'm at work right now. I'll try to comment more on this later tonight.
 

Todd

Rajun Cajun
One more point and I gotta get back to work. Think about it. How did Empedocles (5th Century BC) and other philosophers and writers come up with cave men back in those days. To my knowledge, there were no archeological expeditions to find bones of cave men. IMO, they must have been outcasts that lived in caves during the same time period.
 

Todd

Rajun Cajun
Halcyon said:
"If humans evolved from apes, why are there still apes?"

Sorry, I strayed off subject a little over the past few posts. I do agree that "If humans evolved from apes, why are there still apes?" this is not a good arguing point for creationists.
 
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