"The kingdom of God is within you"

Johnlove said:

Jesus told us who would come to heaven with him, and it is not those who believe he came to save those who just say they believe in him.


To be in Jesus one can’t sin. So how can a sinner be believing in Jesus?


(1 John 2:6) “But if anyone obeys his word, God’s love is truly made complete in him. This is how we know we are in him: Whoever claims to live in him must walk as Jesus did”


The following verse tells us who will go to heaven.


(Matthew 7:21-23) “It is not those who say to me, ‘Lord, Lord’, who will enter the kingdom of Heaven but the person who does the will of My Father in Heaven. When the day comes many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, cast out demons in your name, work many miracles in your name?’ Then I shall tell them to their faces: I have never known you; away from me, you evil men!”



Yes Jesus said those who do the will of the Father in Heaven will go with him.


A sinner will never enter the kingdom of God.


(1 Corinthians 6:9-19) “You know perfectly well that people who do wrong will not inherit the Kingdom of God: people of immoral lives, idolaters, adulterers, catamites, sodomites, thieves, usurers, drunkards, slanders and swindlers will never inherit the kingdom of God.”

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1. We have a circular argument - Billiards Ball cannot be write about scriptures that say trusting in God is salvation because only non-sinners can enter God's Kingdom. This is a circular argument because I've already explained that those who trust Jesus are not sinners, but saints. Scripture is clear here.

Your quotation of 1 Cor 6:9 omits verse 10. How do you feel about verse 10?

Johnlove said:

Satan is not allowed in God’s kingdom.

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I dearly love the Christian contemplatives even if people tend to stop short with their ultimate intentions which is not contemplation as an end in itself but a time when even that ends. God/Satan, Heaven/Hell are bound within the human body and mind which collectively forms the soul. The body is tied to Universal creation and the mind to individual life so an unmerciful spiritual struggle goes on.

Theologia Germanica - Christian Classics Ethereal Library

BilliardsBall said:

1. We have a circular argument - Billiards Ball cannot be write about scriptures that say trusting in God is salvation because only non-sinners can enter God's Kingdom. This is a circular argument because I've already explained that those who trust Jesus are not sinners, but saints. Scripture is clear here.

Your quotation of 1 Cor 6:9 omits verse 10. How do you feel about verse 10?

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Trusting in God is salvation? Is salvation entering into the kingdom of God?


Show me scripture that says that salvation is entering into the kingdom of God.


Jesus told us who would go with him into the kingdom of Heaven.


(Matthew 7:21-23) “It is not those who say to me, ‘Lord, Lord’, who will enter the kingdom of Heaven but the person who does the will of My Father in Heaven. When the day comes many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, cast out demons in your name, work many miracles in your name?’ Then I shall tell them to their faces: I have never known you; away from me, you evil men!”



(1 Corinthians 6:9-19) “You know perfectly well that people who do wrong will not inherit the Kingdom of God: people of immoral lives, idolaters, adulterers, catamites, sodomites, thieves, usurers, drunkards, slanders and swindlers will never inherit the kingdom of God.”

Johnlove said:

Trusting in God is salvation? Is salvation entering into the kingdom of God?


Show me scripture that says that salvation is entering into the kingdom of God.


Jesus told us who would go with him into the kingdom of Heaven.


(Matthew 7:21-23) “It is not those who say to me, ‘Lord, Lord’, who will enter the kingdom of Heaven but the person who does the will of My Father in Heaven. When the day comes many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, cast out demons in your name, work many miracles in your name?’ Then I shall tell them to their faces: I have never known you; away from me, you evil men!”



(1 Corinthians 6:9-19) “You know perfectly well that people who do wrong will not inherit the Kingdom of God: people of immoral lives, idolaters, adulterers, catamites, sodomites, thieves, usurers, drunkards, slanders and swindlers will never inherit the kingdom of God.”

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Do children of God get to Heaven? "But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name: 13 who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God."

So, what do you think of 1 Cor 6:10, the verse that follows immediately after 1 Cor 6:9 as quoted above?

This is what I have learned on this thread.

A person following Jesus for real does not sin. Satan does not enter into God's Kingdom. A sinner will never enter the Kingdom of God.

I would like someone to define sin, satan, and kingdom of God please.

Also please explain what "in Jesus" means.

BilliardsBall said:

Do children of God get to Heaven? "But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name: 13 who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God."

So, what do you think of 1 Cor 6:10, the verse that follows immediately after 1 Cor 6:9 as quoted above?

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Scripture tells us who it is that is a child of God.


(1 John 3:9-10) “No one who has been begotten by God sins; because God’s seed remains inside him, he cannot sin when he has been begotten by God. In this way we distinguish the children of God from the children of the devil: anybody not living a holy life and not loving his brother is no child of God’s.”


(1 Corinthians 6:9-19) “You know perfectly well that people who do wrong will not inherit the Kingdom of God: people of immoral lives, idolaters, adulterers, catamites, sodomites, thieves, usurers, drunkards, slanders and swindlers will never inherit the kingdom of God.”



I believe Paul got it right sinners will not inherit the Kingdom of God.

Johnlove said:

Scripture tells us who it is that is a child of God.


(1 John 3:9-10) “No one who has been begotten by God sins; because God’s seed remains inside him, he cannot sin when he has been begotten by God. In this way we distinguish the children of God from the children of the devil: anybody not living a holy life and not loving his brother is no child of God’s.”


(1 Corinthians 6:9-19) “You know perfectly well that people who do wrong will not inherit the Kingdom of God: people of immoral lives, idolaters, adulterers, catamites, sodomites, thieves, usurers, drunkards, slanders and swindlers will never inherit the kingdom of God.”



I believe Paul got it right sinners will not inherit the Kingdom of God.

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Have you never heard of the sin of omission? You can read about it in Matthew 25:31 - 46

savagewind said:

This is what I have learned on this thread.

A person following Jesus for real does not sin. Satan does not enter into God's Kingdom. A sinner will never enter the Kingdom of God.

I would like someone to define sin, satan, and kingdom of God please.

Also please explain what "in Jesus" means.

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Are you kidding me !!!!.

Father - Son - Holy Spirit

Universal- individual - Spirit to feel how one is part of the other

Body - mind - spirit

Have a ball !.

Sin is invariably missing the point as you evolve from child to adult and certainly nowadays when the mind refuses to accept what the body experiences as it participates in the life of the Universe.

Sometimes God the Father, other times the Presence throughout Creation depending on whether the person is inspired or in need. The Kingdom of Heaven is indeed in us all regardless of the hard shell of intellectual pretense that obscures it.

savagewind said:

I would like someone to define sin, satan, and kingdom of God please.

Also please explain what "in Jesus" means.

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Gerald Kelleher said:

Are you kidding me !!!!.

Father - Son - Holy Spirit

Universal- individual - Spirit to feel how one is part of the other

Body - mind - spirit

Have a ball !.

Sin is invariably missing the point as you evolve from child to adult and certainly nowadays when the mind refuses to accept what the body experiences as it participates in the life of the Universe.

Sometimes God the Father, other times the Presence throughout Creation depending on whether the person is inspired or in need. The Kingdom of Heaven is indeed in us all regardless of the hard shell of intellectual pretense that obscures it.

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Huh?

savagewind said:

Huh?

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Oh you are fine, it is a beautiful Christian perception where Universal and individual meet -

"We behold that which we are, and we are that which we behold. "

John Ruysbroeck - Wikiquote

Tell me that one about the exploding Universe again so I can have a good laugh at how silly people really are for some light entertainment but I suggest you take a walk on the beach and the countryside or watch as the stars come into view as our planet turns to regain the spirit which made Ruysbroeck make that statement.

God is more interior to us than we are to ourselves. His acting in us is nearer and more inward than our own actions. God works in us from inside outwards; creatures work on us from the outside

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John Ruysbroeck - Wikiquote

My question what is sin is for the one who says a person can't sin.

savagewind said:

John Ruysbroeck - Wikiquote

My question what is sin is for the one who says a person can't sin.

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Sin for you appears to be some action compared to or contrary to a moral dictate but these things are set aside when the curtain rises on the real Christian spectacle which ties the individual to the Universal, the temporal to the Eternal. Yes, some people just need to understand things about avoiding hell and going to heaven by living a decent life that hurts nobody but for others Christ and Christianity is something more than that.

I think most Christians eventually reach the point where they cease to concern themselves about doing something to end up with satan/hell as a notion and shift to the greater presence that runs through existence and in Christ's words that spirit gives life and meaning to the mind and body while the body alone can't bridge the difference.

Perhaps not going so far as Blake, too many people assume a moral perfection that doesn't exist for Christ or anyone else as 'sinless' -

"If Moral Virtue was Christianity
Christs Pretensions were all Vanity
And Caiphas & Pilate Men
Praise Worthy & the Lions Den
And not the Sheepfold Allegories
Of God & Heaven & their Glories
The Moral Christian is the Cause
Of the Unbeliever & his Laws"

William Blake

William Blake – The Everlasting Gospel | Genius

As you see, great poets are just an extension of the books of the Bible but this evolves as time goes on.

savagewind said:

Have you never heard of the sin of omission? You can read about it in Matthew 25:31 - 46

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If one is not being led by the Holy Spirit there is no way to explain how God guides one so he or she will always do God’s will.


I always pray for God’s will to be my will forever, and ever.


If I am doing God’s will then I am obeying God, and sin is disobeying God.


How do you ignore John’s scripture?


(1 John 3:9-10) “No one who has been begotten by God sins; because God’s seed remains inside him, he cannot sin when he has been begotten by God. In this way we distinguish the children of God from the children of the devil: anybody not living a holy life and not loving his brother is no child of God’s.”


(1 John 5: 1-6) “Whoever believes that Jesus is the Christ is a child of God, and whoever loves the father loves the son. In this way we know that we love God's children, when we love God and keep his commandments. This is what the love of God is: keeping his commandments. Nor are his commandments burdensome, because every child of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world -- our faith. Who can overcome the world but the one who believes that Jesus is the Son of God? He it is who came by water and blood, Jesus Christ, not with water alone but with water and blood, and it is the Spirit that bears witness, for the Spirit is Truth.”

Johnlove said:

If one is not being led by the Holy Spirit there is no way to explain how God guides one so he or she will always do God’s will.


I always pray for God’s will to be my will forever, and ever.


If I am doing God’s will then I am obeying God, and sin is disobeying God.


How do you ignore John’s scripture?


(1 John 3:9-10) “No one who has been begotten by God sins; because God’s seed remains inside him, he cannot sin when he has been begotten by God. In this way we distinguish the children of God from the children of the devil: anybody not living a holy life and not loving his brother is no child of God’s.”


(1 John 5: 1-6) “Whoever believes that Jesus is the Christ is a child of God, and whoever loves the father loves the son. In this way we know that we love God's children, when we love God and keep his commandments. This is what the love of God is: keeping his commandments. Nor are his commandments burdensome, because every child of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world -- our faith. Who can overcome the world but the one who believes that Jesus is the Son of God? He it is who came by water and blood, Jesus Christ, not with water alone but with water and blood, and it is the Spirit that bears witness, for the Spirit is Truth.”

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You are assuming incorrectly that I ignore any scripture. I suspect incorrect assumption is a sin. Don't you?

savagewind said:

You are assuming incorrectly that I ignore any scripture. I suspect incorrect assumption is a sin. Don't you?

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You keep accusing me of sin, and do you know that Satan is the accuser?


Why don’t you stop trying to be my judge, Jesus is my judge.


You can put your efforts into discussing the scripture quoted by me, it may do you so good.

Johnlove said:

You keep accusing me of sin, and do you know that Satan is the accuser?


Why don’t you stop trying to be my judge, Jesus is my judge.


You can put your efforts into discussing the scripture quoted by me, it may do you so good.

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I am not judging you. I am judging your words. Are you your words? Scripture says "there is no one that does not sin" and you say to be with Jesus means a person does not sin. They do not MATCH. I am judging the FACT that they do not match.

I think scripture should match. If scripture does not match something is wrong. Either it was transcribed wrong or the understanding of it is wrong.

savagewind said:

I am not judging you. I am judging your words. Are you your words? Scripture says "there is no one that does not sin" and you say to be with Jesus means a person does not sin. They do not MATCH. I am judging the FACT that they do not match.

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Why don’t you quote that scripture rather than just your opinion? You say "there is no one that does not sin. Where does scripture say that?


If you are speaking about first John then you are making John contradict himself, and if you have scripture that say what you posted, then John contradicts scripture, and then the bible can’t be the written Word of God.


(1 John 3:9-10) “No one who has been begotten by God sins; because God’s seed remains inside him, he cannot sin when he has been begotten by God. In this way we distinguish the children of God from the children of the devil: anybody not living a holy life and not loving his brother is no child of God’s.”


John tells us a born again Christian cannot sin.



(1 John 2:6) “But if anyone obeys his word, God’s love is truly made complete in him. This is how we know we are in him: Whoever claims to live in him must walk as Jesus did”


John tells us if one claims to be in Jesus then he or she must walk as Jesus walked, and Jesus did not sin.


(1 John 3: 5 - 6) “Now you know that He appeared in order to abolish sin, and that in Him there is no sin; anyone who lives in God does not sin, and anyone who sins has never seen Him or known Him.”


If one sins John says they have never see God, nor know God.


Do you think you could be honest and discuss what John wrote, it is scripture?

Johnlove said:

Why don’t you quote that scripture rather than just your opinion? You say "there is no one that does not sin. Where does scripture say that?


If you are speaking about first John then you are making John contradict himself, and if you have scripture that say what you posted, then John contradicts scripture, and then the bible can’t be the written Word of God.


(1 John 3:9-10) “No one who has been begotten by God sins; because God’s seed remains inside him, he cannot sin when he has been begotten by God. In this way we distinguish the children of God from the children of the devil: anybody not living a holy life and not loving his brother is no child of God’s.”


John tells us a born again Christian cannot sin.



(1 John 2:6) “But if anyone obeys his word, God’s love is truly made complete in him. This is how we know we are in him: Whoever claims to live in him must walk as Jesus did”


John tells us if one claims to be in Jesus then he or she must walk as Jesus walked, and Jesus did not sin.


(1 John 3: 5 - 6) “Now you know that He appeared in order to abolish sin, and that in Him there is no sin; anyone who lives in God does not sin, and anyone who sins has never seen Him or known Him.”


If one sins John says they have never see God, nor know God.


Do you think you could be honest and discuss what John wrote, it is scripture?

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savagewind said:

The sin of The World is the denying of The Son of God as Lord and Savior. That is the sin a believer does not do. (1John 3:9)

But to say a believer in The Lord does not sin is a lie.
1 John 1:8
If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us.
Proverbs 20:9
Who can say, "I have kept my heart pure; I am clean and without sin"?
Jeremiah 2:35
you say, 'I am innocent; he is not angry with me.' But I will pass judgment on you because you say, 'I have not sinned.'
James 3:2
We all stumble in many ways. Anyone who is never at fault in what they say is perfect, able to keep their whole body in check.
1 Kings 8:46
"When they sin against you--for there is no one who does not sin--and you become angry with them and give them over to their enemies, who take them captive to their own lands, far away or near;

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Johnlove said:

Why don’t you quote that scripture rather than just your opinion?

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Right! You too.

You say

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"there is no one that does not sin. Where does scripture say that?

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You did not read my post. Why?

If you are speaking about first John then you are making John contradict himself, and if you have scripture that say what you posted, then John contradicts scripture, and then the bible can’t be the written Word of God.

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The Word does not contradict itself.

(1 John 3:9-10) “No one who has been begotten by God sins; because God’s seed remains inside him, he cannot sin when he has been begotten by God. In this way we distinguish the children of God from the children of the devil: anybody not living a holy life and not loving his brother is no child of God’s.”

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It has to mean something you do not know about.

John tells us a born again Christian cannot sin.

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Why won't you explain this?

(1 John 2:6) “But if anyone obeys his word, God’s love is truly made complete in him. This is how we know we are in him: Whoever claims to live in him must walk as Jesus did”

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We can walk as Jesus did and not walk exactly like he did. We are not like him, but you know that if you know scripture.

John tells us if one claims to be in Jesus then he or she must walk as Jesus walked, and Jesus did not sin.

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You think you know what "walk as Jesus walked" means but I think you do not.

(1 John 3: 5 - 6) “Now you know that He appeared in order to abolish sin, and that in Him there is no sin; anyone who lives in God does not sin, and anyone who sins has never seen Him or known Him.”

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Jesus is God's firstborn. Firstborn mean just one. Try as you might you will never be first born like Jesus is.

If one sins John says they have never see God, nor know God.

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Please look up what "on purpose" means.

Do you think you could be honest and discuss what John wrote, it is scripture?

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I hear you calling me dishonest.