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Christ's return

Booko

Deviled Hen
9harmony said:
I grew up knowing i was living in the time that would witness Christs return. at least that is what i believed from a very young age...but 13 years ago, i realized what that feeling actually was...

I'm very curious why you would know that, if it's something that can be explained in print, anyway.

I never had any intimations when I was young, but then I'm about as intuitive as a dead fern, so that means nothing. :)
 

SoyLeche

meh...
Squirt said:
I am. I had a dream once that I was here when He came. It was incredible!
Squirt dreams of posting to the RF when the Second Comming happens -- I think we have an addict :biglaugh:
 

DTrent

Member
Sometimes people confuse Christ's 2nd coming with Armageddon.
Since the Scriptures indicate that he already came in 1914 when WW1 began, (thus the "beginning of the end") and that he is presently here (thus the turmoil on the earth) then what I am awaiting is the great tribulation & then Armageddon. The world's problems are leading straight into that direction, as prophecied. - Matt.24; Luke 21.
What a situation THAT will be! The final fight between Christ & his brothers (angels) & Satan & his bros (the wicked angels). What it causes mankind to do & experience here on earth will be something that has never been experienced before nor will again. THEN we will see peace on earth, welcome back the dead during those 1000 yrs while Satan is "abyssed" (inactive) & humans will have the privilege of turning the earth back into a Paradise just as it originally was meant to be.
Each day is one step closer to God's purpose & more endurance needed on the Christian's part.
 

Booko

Deviled Hen
DTrent said:
Sometimes people confuse Christ's 2nd coming with Armageddon.
Since the Scriptures indicate that he already came in 1914 when WW1 began, (thus the "beginning of the end") and that he is presently here (thus the turmoil on the earth) then what I am awaiting is the great tribulation & then Armageddon. The world's problems are leading straight into that direction, as prophecied. - Matt.24; Luke 21.

What specific prophecies lead you to 1914? Is it the reference to the "abomination of desolation" in Daniel, or other things as well? Thanks.
 

9harmony

Member
Booko said:
I'm very curious why you would know that, if it's something that can be explained in print, anyway.

I never had any intimations when I was young, but then I'm about as intuitive as a dead fern, so that means nothing. :)

Hi Booko,

hmmm...i can't really say, it's just something i've always felt deep inside, ever since i can remember. Then when i discovered the Baha'i Faith, it was an 'AHA!!' moment for me. ;) it's actually kind of odd, because growing up Catholic and going to Catholic school, the Return of Christ was not something they focused on at all.

so, in my case it seems it was more of an innate, intuitive kind of thing. :D
 

ΩRôghênΩ

Disciple of Light
The spirit of christ has never left this world, and it has never been in this world. it has been within us. his bodily form is a physical projection from the light within us, etting us see him when we are ready to endure the apocalypse
 

kassi

Member
I believe that the old testament explains everything about christ, an example of the things he would fullfill. Christs first appeance was for sin, his second appearance for salvation of believers and all Israel. Moses first appeared to his brethren to reconcile them. you must first be reconciled to your brethren before you are reconciled to God.
As Moses was first rejected so was Christ, as Moses went and recieved a wife for himself so did christ, His body the chrurch. But as a Virgin awaits her bridegroom so do we. AS Moses was on the mountain in the presence of God so christ is at the right hand of God as Moses came off the Mountain with Glory So that the children of Israel
could not steadly look at his face So i also beleive Christ will return with much more Glory. We await the Messiah, the savior of the Body.
 

kassi

Member
As paul the apostle says: We are saved in hope but hope that is seen is no longer hope. And if christ has already returned then we are lost.
 

BruceDLimber

Well-Known Member
Greetings!

DTrent said:
Sometimes people confuse Christ's 2nd coming with Armageddon.

IOV the Second Coming happened in the mid-Nineteenth Century!

And as for Armageddon, it happened dudring World War I when General Allenby defeated the Turks at Megiddo.

So all the prophecies are already fulfilled, or in the process of becoming so right now!

Best,

Bruce
 

Ody

Well-Known Member
kassi said:
I believe that the old testament explains everything about christ, an example of the things he would fullfill. Christs first appeance was for sin, his second appearance for salvation of believers and all Israel. Moses first appeared to his brethren to reconcile them. you must first be reconciled to your brethren before you are reconciled to God.
As Moses was first rejected so was Christ, as Moses went and recieved a wife for himself so did christ, His body the chrurch. But as a Virgin awaits her bridegroom so do we. AS Moses was on the mountain in the presence of God so christ is at the right hand of God as Moses came off the Mountain with Glory So that the children of Israel
could not steadly look at his face So i also beleive Christ will return with much more Glory. We await the Messiah, the savior of the Body.

The messiah that is described by the jewish interpretation of the old testament is that Moshiach will come and bring peace for all nations rebuild the temple etc, the ot view of Moshiach is not an Intermidiary between G-d, because we view that rule
as not needed, even PAGAN to a degree, it is the overall weight of our actions that determines our salvation.
 

Quiddity

UndertheInfluenceofGiants
AlanGurvey said:
The messiah that is described by the jewish interpretation of the old testament is that Moshiach will come and bring peace for all nations rebuild the temple etc, the ot view of Moshiach is not an Intermidiary between G-d, because we view that rule
as not needed, even PAGAN to a degree, it is the overall weight of our actions that determines our salvation.

Is this the part of the differences between Moshiach Ben David and Moshiach Ben Josef? Or do you not hold to this difference?
 

9harmony

Member
kassi said:
As paul the apostle says: We are saved in hope but hope that is seen is no longer hope. And if christ has already returned then we are lost.

imho it really depends on our expectations. if we expect that when Christ returns we will immediately know and see His Kingdom erected, then yes, we may be lost...but when in the history of any religion have the scriptures gloriously descriptive unfoldment of events actually happened the way we envision them?

When Christ came the first time, He was crucified for exactly those reasons. It was blasphemous in the eyes of the clergy of the day, for Him to make the claims He made. Basically because it did not occur the way they expected, with all the pomp and glory associated with His coming in the scriptures.

What we should have learned from the history of Christ's life, is that these glorious descriptions actually describe a spiritual reality, as opposed to the material reality. And as such we should be somewhat humble in our approach.

One thing we need to remember is that God tells us that 'His ways are not our ways'.

if we can then change our expectations to see that with His Return, if God stays true to His ways, things may unfold in a similar fashion. Not quickly and with earthly fame and glory, but quietly with spiritual implications taking precedence, then we do not have to be lost, but rather overjoyed at the magnificence of God's ways.

Baha'i's believe that with the Return of Christ in the Glory of the Father, (who we believe to be Baha'u'llah <the Glory of God>) that His coming, set in motion the forces of the universe destined to attain the goal of erecting the Kingdom of God on earth. We believe that everything written in scripture will come to pass, but not necessarily as we would expect. And not overnight, but gradually, as has always been God's way in the past.



my 2 cents. ;)

have a great weekend!

loving greetings, amy
 

Booko

Deviled Hen
9harmony said:
What we should have learned from the history of Christ's life, is that these glorious descriptions actually describe a spiritual reality, as opposed to the material reality. And as such we should be somewhat humble in our approach.

You might also say that it starts out a spiritual reality, and in time becomes a material one as well. Quite a civilization was erected on the foundation of Christ, after all.

But I think you were making that point later in your post.

I added my 1 cent anyway. 2 cents is too much for me. :)
 

9harmony

Member
Booko said:
You might also say that it starts out a spiritual reality, and in time becomes a material one as well. Quite a civilization was erected on the foundation of Christ, after all.

But I think you were making that point later in your post.

Hi Booko, :)

good point, thanks for clarifying...

yes, imho the material realm is a reflection of the spiritual realities that are renewed from age to age, i believe the spiritual impetus brought on by the coming of each great Prophet are responsible for the rise of all great civilizations, as the spiritual teachings of the prophets take hold and change hearts, humanity as a whole takes great strides forward in the material realm.

I think first and foremost the prophets come to teach us about spiritual reality, imo that was their primary purpose for coming into the world. and as long as we maintain that focus, material progress is inevitable.

So, yes, in a long-winded way, i agree. ;-) The spiritual reality is the foundation upon which all else exists.
 

oneness

Member
Why should His return be any different from the first when He came to a people who hindered by literal translation of the prophecies asked for His kingdom and crown, and wondered how a carpenter from Bethlehem be the Messiah? He was opposed relentlessly by a corrupt clergy, and persecuted unceasingly by agents of a power-hungry state, possessed no army or wealth, condemned by the clerics and statesmen alike at the hour of His Ascension was denied by the closest of His disciples and friends and only believed by two women, and the light of His glory appeared dim and His embryonic community disbanded.

Yet two millennia onward behold His crown in the adoration of masses, His dominion in the hearts of His followers, and His spiritual kingdom lasting over 2000 years. Such was the potency of His Word and the all-encompassing and transforming powers unleashed by His appearance that the world was rebuilt anew and gradually the might of His spiritual kingdom erected firmly in the hearts of masses.

The same is true of His second coming as Bahá’u’lláh, Glory of God, that only a short while after His Ascension the community of His lovers is firmly established in the four corners of the globe, His transforming teachings of equality, justice and unity have permeated he hearts and minds of masses, and the world is drawn ever closer together that its unification and pacification not only seem possible, but inevitable.
 

kassi

Member
9harmony said:
imho it really depends on our expectations. if we expect that when Christ returns we will immediately know and see His Kingdom erected, then yes, we may be lost...but when in the history of any religion have the scriptures gloriously descriptive unfoldment of events actually happened the way we envision them?

When Christ came the first time, He was crucified for exactly those reasons. It was blasphemous in the eyes of the clergy of the day, for Him to make the claims He made. Basically because it did not occur the way they expected, with all the pomp and glory associated with His coming in the scriptures.

What we should have learned from the history of Christ's life, is that these glorious descriptions actually describe a spiritual reality, as opposed to the material reality. And as such we should be somewhat humble in our approach.

One thing we need to remember is that God tells us that 'His ways are not our ways'.

if we can then change our expectations to see that with His Return, if God stays true to His ways, things may unfold in a similar fashion. Not quickly and with earthly fame and glory, but quietly with spiritual implications taking precedence, then we do not have to be lost, but rather overjoyed at the magnificence of God's ways.

Baha'i's believe that with the Return of Christ in the Glory of the Father, (who we believe to be Baha'u'llah <the Glory of God>) that His coming, set in motion the forces of the universe destined to attain the goal of erecting the Kingdom of God on earth. We believe that everything written in scripture will come to pass, but not necessarily as we would expect. And not overnight, but gradually, as has always been God's way in the past.



my 2 cents. ;)

have a great weekend!

loving greetings, amy
I also believe in a spiritual reality For the kingdom of God is not flesh and blood but righteousness and peace. But also according to the scripture, there will be a personal and physical appearance of Christ.
 

BruceDLimber

Well-Known Member
Hi!

kassi said:
But also according to the scripture, there will be a personal and physical appearance of Christ.

Meaning no offense, but only if you insist on taking the scriptures literally--which was precisely the mistake that caused the Jews to miss Him the first time around! . . .

Peace,

Bruce
 

Booko

Deviled Hen
kassi said:
I also believe in a spiritual reality For the kingdom of God is not flesh and blood but righteousness and peace. But also according to the scripture, there will be a personal and physical appearance of Christ.

I would think so also. After all, we have one example of a "return" in the Bible. i.e. Elijah returned in John the Baptist.
 

kassi

Member
:flower:
BruceDLimber said:
Hi!



Meaning no offense, but only if you insist on taking the scriptures literally--which was precisely the mistake that caused the Jews to miss Him the first time around! . . .

Peace,

Bruce
Hi Bruce, You are absolutly right, For I am now understanding alot of the old testament in the spiritual but their were certainly some very literal scriptures,that were fulfilled his first appearance, It is knowing whats what that matters and this can only come from the revalation of God. I am learning not to think to highly of what I think I know. Im just a babe in Christ.:flower:
 
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