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Are Jews still God's Chosen People?
- Thread starter jeager106
- Start date
Since you are new, I will do something uncommon by posting this. This is the Judaism DIR. The only posts allowed to be made by non-Jewish members are to ask respectful questions for the purposes of learning. No commentary of non-Jewish members is allowed. No debating by anyone.
Would you like to have this thread moved to Religious Debates?
Would you like to have this thread moved to Religious Debates?
psychoslice
Veteran Member
Yes I think that the Jews are G-ds chosen people, its just that other religions stick their nose in and want what the Jews have.
Yes, this might work better in the Abrahamic root DIR, since it's for two faith groups, so I will move it there pending a possible move to somewhere else.
An observation:
A lot of folk talk about if we're chosen or not without addressing what that even means.
As a believer in the Suffering Servant of Isaiah 53, it's my opinion that it's not something anyone else should envy.
An observation:
A lot of folk talk about if we're chosen or not without addressing what that even means.
As a believer in the Suffering Servant of Isaiah 53, it's my opinion that it's not something anyone else should envy.
They were chosen to be the first people to whom God revealed himself and receive the Scriptures. This of course (for Christians) was ultimately to set things up for Christ and the New covenant meant for all.
It's not in either Christian or Jewish views, a belief in any inherent ethnic superiority.
It's not in either Christian or Jewish views, a belief in any inherent ethnic superiority.
rosends
Well-Known Member
A question like this can only be answered from within a particular theological structure. You are assuming God's existence, the bible's accuracy in presenting God and the historical events and the concept of "chosen." If one accepts those and is Jewish, he probably sees that continuation of the "chosen" (whatever that indicates) status. If he is Christian he probably sees either the removal of that title and movement of it onto others, a second group ALSO considered "chosen" or a redefinition of "Jews" to include others so that the title applies to more people.
JM2C
CHRISTIAN
Ro 11:25 I want you to understand this mystery, dear brothers and sisters, so that you/GENTILES will not feel proud and start bragging. Some of the Jews have hard hearts, but this will last only until the complete number of GENTILES comes to Christ.
Ro 11:28 Many of the Jews are now enemies of the Good News. But this has been to your benefit, for God has given his gifts to you Gentiles. Yet the Jews are still HIS CHOSEN PEOPLE because of his promises to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.
Yes they are still "His chosen people -Romans 11:28" "for God’s gifts and his call are irrevocable -Romans 11:29"
Ro 11:28 Many of the Jews are now enemies of the Good News. But this has been to your benefit, for God has given his gifts to you Gentiles. Yet the Jews are still HIS CHOSEN PEOPLE because of his promises to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.
Yes they are still "His chosen people -Romans 11:28" "for God’s gifts and his call are irrevocable -Romans 11:29"
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And if it's in Acts it has to be true. Thanks for sharing.
Kolibri
Well-Known Member
I believe the idea of the Jews being a chosen people at least for a time may be based off of Exodus 19:5,6.
"Now if you will strictly obey my voice and keep my covenant, you will certainly become my special property (or "treasured possession") out of all peoples, for the whole earth belongs to me. You will become to me a kingdom of priests and a holy nation."
Hosea 1:2 expresses how God felt about his relationship with his people up to that time. Under very harsh terms he equated himself as being married to a prostitute. Verse 6 shows that he cast off the 10 tribe nation of Israel. (Samaria was conquered by the Assyrians and repopulated with foreigners after the former inhabitants were relocated). Verse 7 says he would show mercy to the house of Judah. Verse 9 shows God as declaring some as "not my people." Verse 10 ends with "In the place where it was said to them, 'You are not my people,' it will be said to them, 'The sons of the living God.'"
After this the Kingdom of Judah was conquered by the Babylonians. No longer was there a king to sit on Jehovah's throne. The land became uninhabited for 70 years as most were carted off to Babylon and the remainder fled to Egypt. The Books of Ezra and Nehemiah chronicle how after this the arrangement for temple worship was firmly established again in Jerusalem. And it did continue till the Temple was destroyed by the Romans in 70 C.E.
Not being a Jew, I cannot comment from their perspective.
But from here the part of the Bible commonly known as the New Testament, adds to this both Jehovah's love for the Jews as individuals and a transference of who would be known as God's special property.
At Matthew 21:42, 43, Jesus applies Psalms 118:22 to himself and stated that "the kingdom of God will be taken away from you and give to a nation producing it's fruits"
Romans 9:22-26 quotes Hosea and applies it to the anointed Christians as "those not my people" becoming "my people."
1 Peter 2:9, 10 also quotes Hosea but also ties in the promise in Exodus 19 to become a "royal priesthood, a holy nation."
It is interesting to note that though Christ died on Nisan 14th of 33 C.E. and the Christians were anointed on Pentecost that year, the first of the Gentiles to become a Christian was not until 36 C.E. - bringing the 70 weeks of Daniel 9:24-27 to a close. (A Christian's perspective is this was fulfilled in Jesus as Messiah. Anointed at his baptism at the end of 69 weeks (of years). Dying 3 1/2 years later thus causing the temple sacrifices and offerings to no longer be the approved way of worship....and yet the covenant with the Jews being that special property by birthright being kept in force till the first Gentile became an anointed Christian 3 1/2 years later).
At that time Peter is quoted as saying: "Now I truly understand that God is not partial, but in every nation the man who fears him and does what is right is acceptable to him." (Act 9:34,35)
Paul later wrote that among anointed Christians there was no longer a distinction between Jews and Greeks, that 'if you belong to the Christ, you are really Abraham's offspring (or "seed"), heirs with reference to a promise." (Galatians 3:26-29)
I might point out that my personal hope is in an earthly reward in paradise. As such I do not see myself as special property even though I am a Christian. Just not called to be a king and priest. Even so, I certainly don't feel deprived of God's friendship.
"Now if you will strictly obey my voice and keep my covenant, you will certainly become my special property (or "treasured possession") out of all peoples, for the whole earth belongs to me. You will become to me a kingdom of priests and a holy nation."
Hosea 1:2 expresses how God felt about his relationship with his people up to that time. Under very harsh terms he equated himself as being married to a prostitute. Verse 6 shows that he cast off the 10 tribe nation of Israel. (Samaria was conquered by the Assyrians and repopulated with foreigners after the former inhabitants were relocated). Verse 7 says he would show mercy to the house of Judah. Verse 9 shows God as declaring some as "not my people." Verse 10 ends with "In the place where it was said to them, 'You are not my people,' it will be said to them, 'The sons of the living God.'"
After this the Kingdom of Judah was conquered by the Babylonians. No longer was there a king to sit on Jehovah's throne. The land became uninhabited for 70 years as most were carted off to Babylon and the remainder fled to Egypt. The Books of Ezra and Nehemiah chronicle how after this the arrangement for temple worship was firmly established again in Jerusalem. And it did continue till the Temple was destroyed by the Romans in 70 C.E.
Not being a Jew, I cannot comment from their perspective.
But from here the part of the Bible commonly known as the New Testament, adds to this both Jehovah's love for the Jews as individuals and a transference of who would be known as God's special property.
At Matthew 21:42, 43, Jesus applies Psalms 118:22 to himself and stated that "the kingdom of God will be taken away from you and give to a nation producing it's fruits"
Romans 9:22-26 quotes Hosea and applies it to the anointed Christians as "those not my people" becoming "my people."
1 Peter 2:9, 10 also quotes Hosea but also ties in the promise in Exodus 19 to become a "royal priesthood, a holy nation."
It is interesting to note that though Christ died on Nisan 14th of 33 C.E. and the Christians were anointed on Pentecost that year, the first of the Gentiles to become a Christian was not until 36 C.E. - bringing the 70 weeks of Daniel 9:24-27 to a close. (A Christian's perspective is this was fulfilled in Jesus as Messiah. Anointed at his baptism at the end of 69 weeks (of years). Dying 3 1/2 years later thus causing the temple sacrifices and offerings to no longer be the approved way of worship....and yet the covenant with the Jews being that special property by birthright being kept in force till the first Gentile became an anointed Christian 3 1/2 years later).
At that time Peter is quoted as saying: "Now I truly understand that God is not partial, but in every nation the man who fears him and does what is right is acceptable to him." (Act 9:34,35)
Paul later wrote that among anointed Christians there was no longer a distinction between Jews and Greeks, that 'if you belong to the Christ, you are really Abraham's offspring (or "seed"), heirs with reference to a promise." (Galatians 3:26-29)
I might point out that my personal hope is in an earthly reward in paradise. As such I do not see myself as special property even though I am a Christian. Just not called to be a king and priest. Even so, I certainly don't feel deprived of God's friendship.
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Kolibri
Well-Known Member
In regards to Romans 11:25,26 it may be useful to look elsewhere in Romans to get see these verses in a different perspective.
At Romans 2:28, 29, Paul wrote that what made a Jew a Jew was no longer a circumcision of the flesh but one of the heart. So Romans 11:25,26 could mean that since so few Jews by birth ("Israel") accepted Jesus, having their hearts dulled towards him, enough people of the nations would receive this circumcision of the heart to guarantee that the spiritual Israel of God would have its number completely filled.
At Romans 2:28, 29, Paul wrote that what made a Jew a Jew was no longer a circumcision of the flesh but one of the heart. So Romans 11:25,26 could mean that since so few Jews by birth ("Israel") accepted Jesus, having their hearts dulled towards him, enough people of the nations would receive this circumcision of the heart to guarantee that the spiritual Israel of God would have its number completely filled.
Levite
Higher and Higher
The Jews were "chosen" by God to be the Jewish People, to be partners with Him in the covenant of Torah. That has nothing to do with whether He may have chosen other peoples for other purposes, and/or related to them I other ways, or even other covenants.
So yes, the Jews are still chosen-- to be what they are. Other peoples may be chosen to be what they are. But that's not our affair: the relations of God to non-Jews is their business. Just as the relationship of God and the Jews is our business, not that of non-Jews.
Avi1001
reform Jew humanist liberal feminist entrepreneur
R' Mordeci Kaplan, whom I agree with on this topic, rejected the notion of "Chosenness", in large part because it has been misunderstood and misinterpreted through the ages.
Although Jews have ethical and moral responsibilities, the notion of "Chosenness" has not been useful in clarifying this.
"Kaplan rejected several traditional Jewish categories, most notably Chosenness. He felt that the term was misunderstood and too often taken as a sign of Jewish superiority, when instead it was conceived as an expression of Jewish obligation to God and humanity".
Ref: Rabbi Mordecai Kaplan | Jewish Virtual Library
Although Jews have ethical and moral responsibilities, the notion of "Chosenness" has not been useful in clarifying this.
"Kaplan rejected several traditional Jewish categories, most notably Chosenness. He felt that the term was misunderstood and too often taken as a sign of Jewish superiority, when instead it was conceived as an expression of Jewish obligation to God and humanity".
Ref: Rabbi Mordecai Kaplan | Jewish Virtual Library
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Moishe3rd
Yehudi
I was going to put this in my own words but, various rabbis do it much better than I could.
Simply put, for Torah observant Jews (Orthodox) who believe in the 3,000 year old Traditions of being Jewish, "The Chosen People" does not mean what people commonly take it to mean.
One big part is that our Forefathers, specifically Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, Chose G-d.
And, that the Jewish People at Mt. Sinai also Chose G-d.
It was a mutual agreement between G-d and the Jews.
To wit:
"The Jewish nation is often referred to as "the Chosen People."
Many people (including Jews) are uncomfortable with this idea. They perceive the concept of a "Chosen People" as racist and mindful of the Nazi concept of a supreme "Aryan" nation. It appears to contradict the accepted Western ideal of all people being equal before God.
Is the Jewish concept of choseness racist?
When the Torah refers to the Jewish people as "chosen," it is not in any way asserting that Jews are racially superior. Americans, Asians, Russians, Europeans, Scandinavians and Ethiopians -- and moreover Caucasians, blacks and Orientals -- are all part of the Jewish people. It is impossible to define choseness as anything related to race, since Jews are racially diverse.
Yet while the term "Chosen People" (Am Nivchar - Deut. 7:6) does not mean racially superior, choseness does imply a special uniqueness.
What is this uniqueness?
Historically, it goes back to Abraham. Abraham lived in a world steeped in idolatry, which he concluded was contradicted by the reality of design in nature.
So Abraham came to a belief in God, and took upon himself the mission of teaching others of the monotheistic ideal. Abraham was even willing to suffer persecution for his beliefs. After years of enormous effort, dedication and a willingness to accept the responsibility to be God's representative in this world, God chose Abraham and his descendents to be the teachers of this monotheistic message.
In other words it is not so much that God chose the Jews; it is more accurate that the Jews (through Abraham) chose God.
Choseness was not part of God's "original plan." Initially all of humanity was to serve the role of God's messengers, but after the fall of Adam, humanity lost that privilege, and it was open for grabs. Only Abraham chose to take the mantel. If others would have (and they were offered the choice), they too would have joined in this special covenant which was sealed upon the giving of the Torah at Mount Sinai.
If a privilege is offered to everyone willing to pay the necessary price, nobody can protest that those willing to make the extra effort are being shown favoritism. For example: It is reasonable that an employee who agrees to work overtime, attend training seminars, and manage special projects, should be entitled to a performance bonus -- particularly if each employee was given the same opportunity.
The essence of being chosen means responsibility. It is a responsibility to change the world -- not by converting everyone to Judaism, but by living as a model community upheld by ethics, morals and beliefs of one God. In that way, we can influence the rest of mankind, a "light unto the nations" (Isaiah 42:6).
Judaism is Universal
Further, Judaism is not exclusionary. A human being need not to be Jewish to reach a high spiritual level. Enoch "walked with God," and Noah had quite a high level of relationship, though neither were Jewish. Our tradition is that all of the 70 nations must function together and play an integral part in that "being" called humanity.
According to Judaism (Talmud - Sanhedrin 58b), any person can achieve a place in the World to Come by faithfully observing the seven basic laws of humanity. These seven laws are named the "Laws of Noah," since all humans are descended from Noah:
1) Do not murder.
2) Do not steal.
3) Do not worship false gods.
4) Do not be sexually immoral.
5) Do not eat the limb of an animal before it is killed.
6) Do not curse God.
7) Set up courts and bring offenders to justice.
Torah is for all humanity. King Solomon built the Holy Temple in Jerusalem, he specifically asked God to heed the prayer of non-Jews who come to the Temple (1-Kings 8:41-43). The Temple was the universal center of spirituality, which the prophet Isaiah referred to as a "house of prayer for all nations." Non-Jews were welcome to bring offerings to the Temple as well. In fact, the service in the Holy Temple during the week of Sukkot featured a total of 70 bull offerings, corresponding to each of the 70 nations of the world. In fact, the Talmud says that if the Romans would have realized how much they were benefiting from the Temple, they never would have destroyed it!
Most other religions say that non-believers are condemned to eternal damnation. Even the calendar systems of Christianity and Islam reflect an exclusionary philosophy; each begins with the birth of their respective religion. The Jewish calendar, on the other hand, begins with the creation of Adam, the first man, teaching us the intrinsic value of every human, even though the Jewish religion was not yet born.
For this reason, Jews do not proselytize in search of converts. One can still merit a place in heaven, no conversion necessary.
Conversion
An important component of Judaism's non-exclusionary approach is that any person -- regardless of national or racial background -- can choose to accept the Torah and become part of the Jewish nation. Indeed, some of the greatest names in Jewish history - Ruth, the ancestor of King David, and Onkelos the Talmudic Sage -- were converts to Judaism.
According to the Code of Jewish Law (the "Shulchan Aruch"), there are three requirements for a valid conversion (paralleling the Jewish experience at Mount Sinai):
1) Mitzvot - The convert must believe in God and the divinity of the Torah, as well as accept to observe all 613 mitzvot (commandments) of the Torah. This includes observance of Shabbat, Kashrut, etc., as detailed in the Code of Jewish Law, the authoritative source for Jewish observance.
2) Milah - Male converts must undergo circumcision by a qualified "Mohel."
3) Mikveh - All converts must immerse in the Mikveh, a ritual bath linked to a reservoir of rain water.
All of the above must be done before a halachically-valid rabbinical court of three Jewish men who themselves believe in God, accept the divinity of the Torah, and observe the mitzvot."
And:
By Rabbi Aron Tendler
Chosen and Tough
"Parshas Re'eh begins the main legal text of Sefer Divarim. Containing 55 Mitzvos, Re'eh's focus is on those Mitzvos which set Israel apart from all other nations and lifestyles. Although all Mitzvos make us "different", these are the commandments such as Kashrus and the Yomim Tovim which publicly declare our status as "Am Livadad Yishkon - A nation that dwells alone".
The public persona of a nation, or for that matter, any organization, is a product of public perception, rather than substance. Billions of dollars are spent on creating an image, selling a dream, advertising, and other forms of P.R.; and success is measured by how visible you are along the information highway. More often than we are willing to admit, we are fooled into buying unnecessary, frivolous, and non-substantive products, because of effective selling strategies.
The Torah in Parshas Vaeschanan promised us that our public image would be that of a "wise and understanding nation". It promised us that so long as we keep G-d's mitzvos we will be successful in all our endeavors, and respected by all the other nations. It promised that our public persona would be founded upon substance and quality, not slick advertising and suggestion.
In preparation for the Bnai Yisroel entering Eretz Yisroel, Moshe forewarned them against being influenced by the idolatrous practices and life styles of the Seven Nations. He commanded them to, "...tear down their altars, break up their sacred pillars, burn their Asherah trees, and chop down the statues of their gods, obliterating their names from that place". (12:3)
Moshe did not propose compromises or political niceties. Moshe didn't discuss living in peace with other ideologies or religions. Moshe detailed in clear and unequivocal terms their obligation to clean up the spiritual environment. The nation that was destined to "dwell alone" required a homeland that was "alone".
Moshe did not believe that we could withstand the influences of a foreign society determined to assimilate us into its values. As history has tragically proven, and as the present continues to support, Moshe was unerringly accurate in his assessment, and fears. Had the Bnai Yisroel listened to Moshe and removed all foreign practices, their subsequent place in history would have been of messianic proportions. We would have been acknowledged as a "wise and understanding nation", and respected for "dwelling alone". The spiritual product we are intended to sell as the Chosen People would have become a marketing success.
In 14:2 of Re'eh, Hashem proclaimed us as the "Chosen People", a designation which we need to understand. Many have mistakenly cloaked themselves with an air of intellectual superiority and religious elitism that unfortunately leads to selfishness and the negation of responsibility. Individuals or nations that see themselves as superior by virtue of genetics or ancestry, rather than personal merit and behavior, will view all others as inferior to them because of the absence of the same. Regardless of the others personal merits and accomplishments, if he doesn't have the same background as myself he is less than I am.
Taken to its extreme, history has shown the extent that superiority will dehumanize the "man who was created in G-d's image". If superiority is solely the result of ancestry then Darwin's Survival of the Fittest is the inevitable destruction of all those deemed as potentially dangerous to the existence of the superior species.
Making difficult decisions that hurt today, but are of benefit tomorrow, is the meaning of wisdom and maturity. In all areas of life such decisions and sacrifices are demanded. None of us, in the hopes of prolonging our lives or that of our loved ones, would stay the surgeon's scalpel bust because the incision hurts today. Misplaced mercy and humility has been the cause of great damage in individual, family, communal, and national destinies.
The Mishnah in Pirkei Avos 2:9 defines the straight path that a person should follow. Rabbi Shimon says, "one who makes decisions today with concern for tomorrow". The same is true for organizations and nations. The concerns for the here and now often misguide us in relation to the realities of tomorrow. I have little doubt that most of Sefer Divarim, if said today, would be deemed "politically incorrect". Yet, had the Bnai Yisroel heeded Moshe's fundamentalist demands and removed all foreign practices and ideologies, the world would have gained immeasurably.
Being the Chosen People carries with it a responsibility. We are to be the nation who is most responsible to Hashem and His purpose in creating all of mankind, not just the Jew. To do so we must be perceived by the rest of the world as different by virtue of our behavior, actions, and humility. Even among our own we attempt to equalize all, including the Ger - convert, by acknowledging our shared ancestry as the "children of Avraham and Sarah". As Yishayuhu declared, (Haftoras Ekev)"Look to Avraham your father and to Sarah who gave birth to you".
Individual Yichus is only as good as the individual's merits, actions, and values. It was Avraham and Sarah who, as the only Jews alive, devoted the majority of their time teaching the non-Jew about G-d and His purpose for creating the universe. Of course, we are obligated to protect our uniqueness from the assimilative values of society. In so doing, we must be fearless and at times ruthless. Idolatry and paganism, in whatever sophisticated form they appear, demean mankind to the level of animal by declaring the animal in man as divine. On the other hand, adherence to Torah and mitzvos directs and elevates the animal in man, endowing it with dignity, humility, and G-dliness."
Simply put, for Torah observant Jews (Orthodox) who believe in the 3,000 year old Traditions of being Jewish, "The Chosen People" does not mean what people commonly take it to mean.
One big part is that our Forefathers, specifically Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, Chose G-d.
And, that the Jewish People at Mt. Sinai also Chose G-d.
It was a mutual agreement between G-d and the Jews.
To wit:
"The Jewish nation is often referred to as "the Chosen People."
Many people (including Jews) are uncomfortable with this idea. They perceive the concept of a "Chosen People" as racist and mindful of the Nazi concept of a supreme "Aryan" nation. It appears to contradict the accepted Western ideal of all people being equal before God.
Is the Jewish concept of choseness racist?
When the Torah refers to the Jewish people as "chosen," it is not in any way asserting that Jews are racially superior. Americans, Asians, Russians, Europeans, Scandinavians and Ethiopians -- and moreover Caucasians, blacks and Orientals -- are all part of the Jewish people. It is impossible to define choseness as anything related to race, since Jews are racially diverse.
Yet while the term "Chosen People" (Am Nivchar - Deut. 7:6) does not mean racially superior, choseness does imply a special uniqueness.
What is this uniqueness?
Historically, it goes back to Abraham. Abraham lived in a world steeped in idolatry, which he concluded was contradicted by the reality of design in nature.
So Abraham came to a belief in God, and took upon himself the mission of teaching others of the monotheistic ideal. Abraham was even willing to suffer persecution for his beliefs. After years of enormous effort, dedication and a willingness to accept the responsibility to be God's representative in this world, God chose Abraham and his descendents to be the teachers of this monotheistic message.
In other words it is not so much that God chose the Jews; it is more accurate that the Jews (through Abraham) chose God.
Choseness was not part of God's "original plan." Initially all of humanity was to serve the role of God's messengers, but after the fall of Adam, humanity lost that privilege, and it was open for grabs. Only Abraham chose to take the mantel. If others would have (and they were offered the choice), they too would have joined in this special covenant which was sealed upon the giving of the Torah at Mount Sinai.
If a privilege is offered to everyone willing to pay the necessary price, nobody can protest that those willing to make the extra effort are being shown favoritism. For example: It is reasonable that an employee who agrees to work overtime, attend training seminars, and manage special projects, should be entitled to a performance bonus -- particularly if each employee was given the same opportunity.
The essence of being chosen means responsibility. It is a responsibility to change the world -- not by converting everyone to Judaism, but by living as a model community upheld by ethics, morals and beliefs of one God. In that way, we can influence the rest of mankind, a "light unto the nations" (Isaiah 42:6).
Judaism is Universal
Further, Judaism is not exclusionary. A human being need not to be Jewish to reach a high spiritual level. Enoch "walked with God," and Noah had quite a high level of relationship, though neither were Jewish. Our tradition is that all of the 70 nations must function together and play an integral part in that "being" called humanity.
According to Judaism (Talmud - Sanhedrin 58b), any person can achieve a place in the World to Come by faithfully observing the seven basic laws of humanity. These seven laws are named the "Laws of Noah," since all humans are descended from Noah:
1) Do not murder.
2) Do not steal.
3) Do not worship false gods.
4) Do not be sexually immoral.
5) Do not eat the limb of an animal before it is killed.
6) Do not curse God.
7) Set up courts and bring offenders to justice.
Torah is for all humanity. King Solomon built the Holy Temple in Jerusalem, he specifically asked God to heed the prayer of non-Jews who come to the Temple (1-Kings 8:41-43). The Temple was the universal center of spirituality, which the prophet Isaiah referred to as a "house of prayer for all nations." Non-Jews were welcome to bring offerings to the Temple as well. In fact, the service in the Holy Temple during the week of Sukkot featured a total of 70 bull offerings, corresponding to each of the 70 nations of the world. In fact, the Talmud says that if the Romans would have realized how much they were benefiting from the Temple, they never would have destroyed it!
Most other religions say that non-believers are condemned to eternal damnation. Even the calendar systems of Christianity and Islam reflect an exclusionary philosophy; each begins with the birth of their respective religion. The Jewish calendar, on the other hand, begins with the creation of Adam, the first man, teaching us the intrinsic value of every human, even though the Jewish religion was not yet born.
For this reason, Jews do not proselytize in search of converts. One can still merit a place in heaven, no conversion necessary.
Conversion
An important component of Judaism's non-exclusionary approach is that any person -- regardless of national or racial background -- can choose to accept the Torah and become part of the Jewish nation. Indeed, some of the greatest names in Jewish history - Ruth, the ancestor of King David, and Onkelos the Talmudic Sage -- were converts to Judaism.
According to the Code of Jewish Law (the "Shulchan Aruch"), there are three requirements for a valid conversion (paralleling the Jewish experience at Mount Sinai):
1) Mitzvot - The convert must believe in God and the divinity of the Torah, as well as accept to observe all 613 mitzvot (commandments) of the Torah. This includes observance of Shabbat, Kashrut, etc., as detailed in the Code of Jewish Law, the authoritative source for Jewish observance.
2) Milah - Male converts must undergo circumcision by a qualified "Mohel."
3) Mikveh - All converts must immerse in the Mikveh, a ritual bath linked to a reservoir of rain water.
All of the above must be done before a halachically-valid rabbinical court of three Jewish men who themselves believe in God, accept the divinity of the Torah, and observe the mitzvot."
And:
By Rabbi Aron Tendler
Chosen and Tough
"Parshas Re'eh begins the main legal text of Sefer Divarim. Containing 55 Mitzvos, Re'eh's focus is on those Mitzvos which set Israel apart from all other nations and lifestyles. Although all Mitzvos make us "different", these are the commandments such as Kashrus and the Yomim Tovim which publicly declare our status as "Am Livadad Yishkon - A nation that dwells alone".
The public persona of a nation, or for that matter, any organization, is a product of public perception, rather than substance. Billions of dollars are spent on creating an image, selling a dream, advertising, and other forms of P.R.; and success is measured by how visible you are along the information highway. More often than we are willing to admit, we are fooled into buying unnecessary, frivolous, and non-substantive products, because of effective selling strategies.
The Torah in Parshas Vaeschanan promised us that our public image would be that of a "wise and understanding nation". It promised us that so long as we keep G-d's mitzvos we will be successful in all our endeavors, and respected by all the other nations. It promised that our public persona would be founded upon substance and quality, not slick advertising and suggestion.
In preparation for the Bnai Yisroel entering Eretz Yisroel, Moshe forewarned them against being influenced by the idolatrous practices and life styles of the Seven Nations. He commanded them to, "...tear down their altars, break up their sacred pillars, burn their Asherah trees, and chop down the statues of their gods, obliterating their names from that place". (12:3)
Moshe did not propose compromises or political niceties. Moshe didn't discuss living in peace with other ideologies or religions. Moshe detailed in clear and unequivocal terms their obligation to clean up the spiritual environment. The nation that was destined to "dwell alone" required a homeland that was "alone".
Moshe did not believe that we could withstand the influences of a foreign society determined to assimilate us into its values. As history has tragically proven, and as the present continues to support, Moshe was unerringly accurate in his assessment, and fears. Had the Bnai Yisroel listened to Moshe and removed all foreign practices, their subsequent place in history would have been of messianic proportions. We would have been acknowledged as a "wise and understanding nation", and respected for "dwelling alone". The spiritual product we are intended to sell as the Chosen People would have become a marketing success.
In 14:2 of Re'eh, Hashem proclaimed us as the "Chosen People", a designation which we need to understand. Many have mistakenly cloaked themselves with an air of intellectual superiority and religious elitism that unfortunately leads to selfishness and the negation of responsibility. Individuals or nations that see themselves as superior by virtue of genetics or ancestry, rather than personal merit and behavior, will view all others as inferior to them because of the absence of the same. Regardless of the others personal merits and accomplishments, if he doesn't have the same background as myself he is less than I am.
Taken to its extreme, history has shown the extent that superiority will dehumanize the "man who was created in G-d's image". If superiority is solely the result of ancestry then Darwin's Survival of the Fittest is the inevitable destruction of all those deemed as potentially dangerous to the existence of the superior species.
Making difficult decisions that hurt today, but are of benefit tomorrow, is the meaning of wisdom and maturity. In all areas of life such decisions and sacrifices are demanded. None of us, in the hopes of prolonging our lives or that of our loved ones, would stay the surgeon's scalpel bust because the incision hurts today. Misplaced mercy and humility has been the cause of great damage in individual, family, communal, and national destinies.
The Mishnah in Pirkei Avos 2:9 defines the straight path that a person should follow. Rabbi Shimon says, "one who makes decisions today with concern for tomorrow". The same is true for organizations and nations. The concerns for the here and now often misguide us in relation to the realities of tomorrow. I have little doubt that most of Sefer Divarim, if said today, would be deemed "politically incorrect". Yet, had the Bnai Yisroel heeded Moshe's fundamentalist demands and removed all foreign practices and ideologies, the world would have gained immeasurably.
Being the Chosen People carries with it a responsibility. We are to be the nation who is most responsible to Hashem and His purpose in creating all of mankind, not just the Jew. To do so we must be perceived by the rest of the world as different by virtue of our behavior, actions, and humility. Even among our own we attempt to equalize all, including the Ger - convert, by acknowledging our shared ancestry as the "children of Avraham and Sarah". As Yishayuhu declared, (Haftoras Ekev)"Look to Avraham your father and to Sarah who gave birth to you".
Individual Yichus is only as good as the individual's merits, actions, and values. It was Avraham and Sarah who, as the only Jews alive, devoted the majority of their time teaching the non-Jew about G-d and His purpose for creating the universe. Of course, we are obligated to protect our uniqueness from the assimilative values of society. In so doing, we must be fearless and at times ruthless. Idolatry and paganism, in whatever sophisticated form they appear, demean mankind to the level of animal by declaring the animal in man as divine. On the other hand, adherence to Torah and mitzvos directs and elevates the animal in man, endowing it with dignity, humility, and G-dliness."
roger1440
I do stuff
The term “chosen people” is defined differently among Jews and Christians. The term originates in Jewish scripture. Christians then take the term remold it into something else that ends up unlike what it started as. So the answer must lie within the context of how the term is defined.
free spirit
Well-Known Member
Many Christians also attach a great deal of importance to the alleged future events in Romans 11:26-27, which read: “And thus all Israel will be saved; just as it is written, the Deliverer will come from Zion, He will remove ungodliness from Jacob. And this is My covenant with them, when I take away their sins.”
They mistakenly believe that the above scripture of forgiving sins has yet to take place. They do not realise that the above scripture belongs to the Old Testament and has been fulfilled with the crucifixion of our Lord, for His sacrifice to forgive the sins of the world was once, and for all men. Or do they think that Jesus has to come back and sacrifice Himself once more especially for the sins of the “Jews?” Or do they think that the blessing of Calvary, which flows to all men, was withheld from reaching the “Jews?” They also fail to understand that the removal of ungodliness as is written above is for Jacob (the believer and appreciator of the blessing) and not for Esau (the believer in God but depreciatorof the blessing).
Also Romans chapter 11 speaks about the Israel of God as the olive tree. Those who did not believe were cut off from the olive tree and we who believe were grafted into the olive tree. Sadly there are some Christians who mistakenly believe that the branches that were cut off from the olive tree have somehow become the tree again. But it is impossible for this to take place without first believing in Christ, because only with that acknowledgement will Jesus be able to graft them back again into the rich olive tree. The olive tree “as if you do not know” is Christ himself. For it is written: John 15:5 “I am the vine, you are the branches; he who abides in Me, and I in him, he bears much fruit; for apart from Me you can do nothing.” Christians should preach to the “Jews” about the Lord and tell them that the promised land is found in Christ. Galatians 3:16 makes it clearer still, for we read: “Now the promises were spoken to Abraham and to his seed. He does not say, and to seeds, as referring to many, but rather to one. And to your seed that is Christ.” God doesn't play games, they were chosen to bring Christ into the world.
Pegg
Jehovah our God is One
The purpose of having a chosen nation was so that mankind could find the Messiah. Abraham was chosen to be the one through whom the Messiah would come from. The mosaic law was given to the descendants of Abraham to ensure that when he did arrive, people would be able to identify him and he would be born into a spiriutally and morally clean nation (relatively speaking). He had to be born in the line of King David of the tribe of Judah... this narrowed down how mankind could identify the messiah.
After arriving, the door opened to people from all nations to approach God through the Messiah.
So there is no more 'chosen people' today. The purpose of having a 'chosen nation' has been accomplished. We are all on a level playing field now.
free spirit
Well-Known Member
In this case ACTS 3:22-23, is explaining what is written in Deuteronomy 18:18-19.
You confuse "explaining" and "Interpreting." I cannot think of a single reason to consider Acts as authoritative.
free spirit
Well-Known Member
Yes you are correct, we all, "Jews or Gentiles" have the same chance to become the new chosen: for we read in
1Peter 2:9-10: “But you are a chosen race, a royal priesthood, a Holy Nation, a people for God’s own possession, that you may proclaim the excellencies of Him who has called you out of darkness into His marvellous light; for you once were not a people, but now you are the people of God; you had not received mercy, but now you have received mercy.”
Yes. I believe that the Jews never stopped being God's Chosen People.