Ferguson: Moving on..why none of this will mater...

MysticSang'ha · Aug 30, 2014

Revoltingest said:
About all I can glean from this is that you're angry at some people siding with the cop, & perhaps some people who aren't taking a side yet. A movie clip with white liberal apologists & a white supremacist will certainly raise blood pressure, but these are characters in a movie, & not posters here. You must've gone thru Hell these last few weeks.

I'm pointing out rhetoric that is deeply problematic, and how I have seen many people of color who have spoken out about these very things are dismissed and ignored.

My emotions have as much to do with my point as anyone else's emotions with their points.

Revoltingest · Aug 30, 2014

MysticSang'ha said:
I'm pointing out rhetoric that is deeply problematic, and how I have seen many people of color who have spoken out about these very things are dismissed and ignored.

My emotions have as much to do with my point as anyone else's emotions with their points.

I'm guessing that we all feel that our perspectives are ignored to some extent.
Such is the noise.

MysticSang'ha · Aug 30, 2014

Revoltingest said:
I'm guessing that we all feel that our perspectives are ignored to some extent.
Such is the noise.

Ignored, dismissed, and demonized. People I stand with are called "looters", "rioters", "thugs." Doesn't matter if I say they've not done anything of that sort, doesn't matter at all. People will choose to focus on people destroying property as being more important than focusing on the facts of the Michael Brown shooting.

I get to go home and not have to live that every day.

And *I* have gone through hell? This whole region has, and this hasn't been the first time. I've brought up racial tensions many times before and have been accused of exacerbating white guilt, or that I hate my own race, and I've been called a ******-lover and playing the race card. I've brought this up for years here and elsewhere, and now the world has been watching this region and it's blowup of racial tension present, and amazingly I still read people saying some deeply problematic things about people I know and love and trust. Deeply problematic things like racial epithets and the "violent black man" trope.

*I* have gone through hell? Compared to some, I guess....but I assure you, I haven't gone through the kind of hell that family and friends who I know in Ferguson have gone through. I don't have to stay there. I don't call it my home. I get to leave it, but it breaks my heart seeing people I love who are there all the time.

Revoltingest · Aug 30, 2014

MysticSang'ha said:
Ignored, dismissed, and demonized. People I stand with are called "looters", "rioters", "thugs." Doesn't matter if I say they've not done anything of that sort, doesn't matter at all. People will choose to focus on people destroying property as being more important than focusing on the facts of the Michael Brown shooting.

I get to go home and not have to live that every day.

And *I* have gone through hell? This whole region has, and this hasn't been the first time. I've brought up racial tensions many times before and have been accused of exacerbating white guilt, or that I hate my own race, and I've been called a ******-lover and playing the race card. I've brought this up for years here and elsewhere, and now the world has been watching this region and it's blowup of racial tension present, and amazingly I still read people saying some deeply problematic things about people I know and love and trust. Deeply problematic things like racial epithets and the "violent black man" trope.

*I* have gone through hell? Compared to some, I guess....but I assure you, I haven't gone through the kind of hell that family and friends who I know in Ferguson have gone through. I don't have to stay there. I don't call it my home. I get to leave it, but it breaks my heart seeing people I love who are there all the time.

As a cunning racist fundamentalist misogynist (so I'm told), I sympathize
regarding posters wielding perfunctory insults instead of trying to understand.
Just remember that it reflects poorly on their judgement, maturity & humanity.

Hmm....that doesn't sound encouraging at all.
You gotta figure out how to find your equanimity again.

AgnosticBoy · Aug 30, 2014

MysticSang'ha said:
I know, and people were outright saying YOU were racist.

Mark my words, all those same people ready to pounce on you won't say a single word to him.

I agree. But OH NOES THAT'S SO EXCLUSIVE OF YOU AND NOT FAIR AND WHAT ABOUT RACISM FROM BLACK PEOPLE THEY'RE SO BAD...

Like I've said before, I hear ya.

Fact 1: I'm not a racist. I have Black, White, and Hispanic friends and I'm open to anyone who has a decent character.

Fact 2: which race do we predominately find wearing their pants on their butt? African-Americans! Even my girlfriend who's from Mexico has noticed that.

Fact 3: There's plenty of rap music out there that glorify the 'thug' lifestyle. And I went to high school where plenty of Blacks tried to brag about being a thug just as much as they brag about being a 'playa. Hek even some of the Black women tell me they are looking for a thug which is incredibly stupid of them if you ask me.

Are you ashamed to admit this? Look at the pants on these Ferguson residents:

ss-140816-ferguson-unrest-mn-07.nbcnews-ux-1240-900.jpg

Alceste · Aug 30, 2014

MysticSang'ha said:
I would like to offer this here....

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=niP07kbZMiU

A dinner table scene where the main character in the movie American History X - played by Edward Norton - as a noted White Nationalist and Supremacist, is saying a lot of the same narrative we've seen around here.

Of course, people don't want to be seen as a racist. Apparently that's as bad as being shot unarmed because somebody felt threatened. Apparently being called a racist is as bad as being called a rapist, and my goodness how horrible that people would say that since the effect is just as bad as being called the n-word.

Watch how this characters rhetoric about the LA riots in '92 after Rodney King matches a LOT with the rhetoric of people who are very quick to connect Michael Brown as a violent POS thug, and suggesting that the officer was only doing his job, and we don't know all the details, and how dare you call me a racist, and stop saying all cops are bad, etc.

This character is a White Nationalist.

With a swastika tattooed on his chest.

We live in a culture that normalizes this perspective and calls it "truth". And people of color are supposed to just be quiet about this?

I think I counted at least four or five lines in that monologue that were almost word-for-word things people have said in this thread, and I wasn't even trying.

(What a good movie that was).

On a related note, the KKK is now getting in on the action:
KKK raising money for Ferguson police officer

s2a · Aug 30, 2014

Shadow Wolf said:
And it still remains that just because it's the law doesn't mean it's right. Of course people should have the right to defend themselves, but shooting someone six times is excessive.

As you may have noted with focused accuracy. acknowledgement is hardly commensurate with agreement.

I do not now, nor ever argue, that "law' is always just or fair.

It just is, what it is.

If you wish to argue law is currently unfair or unjust, you're likely to side in favor of your argument, unless you vote.

I simply tire of those that complain, and do not vote.

Vote, or just accept insipid people in charge.

Alceste · Aug 30, 2014

Saint Frankenstein · Aug 31, 2014

AgnosticBoy said:
Fact 1: I'm not a racist. I have Black, White, and Hispanic friends and I'm open to anyone who has a decent character.

That doesn't mean a damn thing:

Your Mexican girlfriend doesn't matter, either. Even if she was black, you could still be racist against blacks since many people who have interracial relationships/sex are racist themselves.

Fact 2: which race do we predominately find wearing their pants on their butt? African-Americans! Even my girlfriend who's from Mexico has noticed that.

Fact 3: There's plenty of rap music out there that glorify the 'thug' lifestyle. And I went to high school where plenty of Blacks tried to brag about being a thug just as much as they brag about being a 'playa. Hek even some of the Black women tell me they are looking for a thug which is incredibly stupid of them if you ask me.

Are you ashamed to admit this? Look at the pants on these Ferguson residents:

Black trash and white trash both fundamentally act the same. I lived with my white hick side of the family for over a decade. They were a bunch of drug addicts/dealers, alcoholics, sexual perverts, racists, thieves and unemployed bums.

It's just trashy ghetto culture and whites in the ghetto act the same. I've lived in the inner city for basically all my life so I should know.

CynthiaCypher · Aug 31, 2014

Alceste said:

I think I might have to introduce some Americans here to the concept of "Chav", I think I am probably the only American on this forum that can understand Chavish

Alceste · Aug 31, 2014

CynthiaCypher said:
I think I might have to introduce some Americans here to the concept of "Chav", I think I am probably the only American on this forum that can understand Chavish

Lol, good going! That's a difficult one to learn.

s2a · Aug 31, 2014

Alceste said:
Lol, good going! That's a difficult one to learn.

I confess that "Chavish" sounds a lot like a bad rash.

You have something enlightening to share amongst we great unwashed?

A pleasant salve, or rune-stone of knowledge?

Anything at all?

AgnosticBoy · Aug 31, 2014

[QUOTE=Saint Frankenstein said:
Your Mexican girlfriend doesn't matter, either.

Doesnt matter? Are you a racist?

dawny0826 · Aug 31, 2014

CynthiaCypher said:
So the racial tension just came out of nowhere as if by magic?

I'm sure it didn't.

Again, the article didn't use the term "racists and bigots" - you did. That's ALL I was saying.

dawny0826 · Aug 31, 2014

Father Heathen said:
No one here has said that they were.

Exactly. And this is where the disconnect comes in when discussing these issues.

You can evaluate the manner by which the police acted during demonstrations and the manner by which they responded to vandalism as separate evaluations.

It would be challenging to dispute that the police used excess force during protests and demonstrations.

However, such force may not be excessive when evaluating their response to vandalism, contingent upon the scale of the looting and vandalism.

There are clearly issues that need to be addressed with the police force in Ferguson. But, per the OP, if laws aren't changed, the laws alone will continue to perpetuate injustices and racial/cultural tensions.

Alceste · Aug 31, 2014

s2a said:
I confess that "Chavish" sounds a lot like a bad rash.

You have something enlightening to share amongst we great unwashed?

A pleasant salve, or rune-stone of knowledge?

Anything at all?

Nah, bruv. Allow it, m8.

Shadow Wolf · Aug 31, 2014

s2a said:
As you may have noted with focused accuracy. acknowledgement is hardly commensurate with agreement.

I do not now, nor ever argue, that "law' is always just or fair.

It just is, what it is.

If you wish to argue law is currently unfair or unjust, you're likely to side in favor of your argument, unless you vote.

I simply tire of those that complain, and do not vote.

Vote, or just accept insipid people in charge.

I am of the minority of the voting population in America. My final vote will be leaving, which will be before the mid-terms later this year. I was looking at Canada's immigration page yesterday, and when it asks if you plan on being there temporarily or permanently, the permanent option looked more appealing than I thought it would.

MysticSang'ha · Aug 31, 2014

Again, I'm sadly amused that folks like CC and St Frank are confronted by people who think what they say are racist, and yet we got more than a few very very problematic posts by a certain contributor that remains uncontested by these very same people.

And....I'll bet $$$ that MY post bringing this up will be argued against because this member's kind of rhetoric is more than tolerated.

.

.

We're still playing Derailment Bingo, aren't we? We might as well have some fun with this.

Alceste · Aug 31, 2014

MysticSang'ha said:
Again, I'm sadly amused that folks like CC and St Frank are confronted by people who think what they say are racist, and yet we got more than a few very very problematic posts by a certain contributor that remains uncontested by these very same people.

And....I'll bet $$$ that MY post bringing this up will be argued against because this member's kind of rhetoric is more than tolerated.

.

.

We're still playing Derailment Bingo, aren't we? We might as well have some fun with this.

I'm in. We've already had "I can't be racist because I have a black friend" at least twice from the certain someone you are talking about.

Revoltingest · Aug 31, 2014

MysticSang'ha said:
Again, I'm sadly amused that folks like CC and St Frank are confronted by people who think what they say are racist, and yet we got more than a few very very problematic posts by a certain contributor that remains uncontested by these very same people.

In a mud wrestling match, it's hard to tell which is the more mudogenic.
Best thing is to stay out of the splash zone.

And....I'll bet $$$ that MY post bringing this up will be argued against because this member's kind of rhetoric is more than tolerated.

I'll bite. Stop trying to kill the party atmosphere!

We're still playing Derailment Bingo, aren't we? We might as well have some fun with this.

This thread went off the rails long ago.
Your mental health is worth more than any point which will be heard & satisfactorily addressed.
Here, just for you!

I'm wearing....

Ferguson: Moving on..why none of this will mater...

Big Squishy Hugger

Pragmatic Libertarian

Big Squishy Hugger

Pragmatic Libertarian

Member

Vagabond

Heretic and part-time (skinny) Santa impersonator

Vagabond

Wanderer From Afar

Well-Known Member

Vagabond

Heretic and part-time (skinny) Santa impersonator

Member

Mother Heathen

Mother Heathen

Vagabond

Certified People sTabber

Big Squishy Hugger

Vagabond

Pragmatic Libertarian