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Why don't Theist's admit that there's no evidence for God?

McBell

Resident Sourpuss
However, this cannot be said of other religious texts outside of the Bible. The Bible has shown an amazing consistency and lack of manipulation since God inspired it.

Except that it is in fact said of other religious text outside the Bible.
The Vedas, the Koran...

You have not presented anything that has not also been said about the Koran.
So now it is a matter of which group has the better sales pitch?
 

ONEWAY

Member
I do agree that other texts claim to have the authority of God, but the ones that do are either connected to (i.e. Judaism) or are directly borrowing from the Christian worldview (i.e. Islam and Christian cults). God inspired the books of the Bible and from these came the other religions claiming similar authority. Christianity came before these religions (i.e. Islam and Christian cults). These religions are borrowing from the initial authority God had correctly given and the texts He had inspired prior to the Koran, etc.

I would challenge these other scriptures with how they are above God's revealed word He had already inspired and revealed to be His word. Especially in view of the warning God gives against adding to His revealed word, the Bible.
 

McBell

Resident Sourpuss
I do agree that other texts claim to have the authority of God, but the ones that do are either connected to (i.e. Judaism) or are directly borrowing from the Christian worldview (i.e. Islam and Christian cults). God inspired the books of the Bible and from these came the other religions claiming similar authority. Christianity came before these religions (i.e. Islam and Christian cults). These religions are borrowing from the initial authority God had correctly given and the texts He had inspired prior to the Koran, etc.

I would challenge these other scriptures with how they are above God's revealed word He had already inspired and revealed to be His word. Especially in view of the warning God gives against adding to His revealed word, the Bible.

Rather interesting claim given that your favoured (Christianity) is in the exact same boat.
 

Ouroboros

Coincidentia oppositorum
I would challenge these other scriptures with how they are above God's revealed word He had already inspired and revealed to be His word. Especially in view of the warning God gives against adding to His revealed word, the Bible.

Avestan in Zoroastrianism is also a revealed word from God (supposedly).
 

Monk Of Reason

༼ つ ◕_◕ ༽つ
I do agree that other texts claim to have the authority of God, but the ones that do are either connected to (i.e. Judaism) or are directly borrowing from the Christian worldview (i.e. Islam and Christian cults). God inspired the books of the Bible and from these came the other religions claiming similar authority. Christianity came before these religions (i.e. Islam and Christian cults). These religions are borrowing from the initial authority God had correctly given and the texts He had inspired prior to the Koran, etc.

I would challenge these other scriptures with how they are above God's revealed word He had already inspired and revealed to be His word. Especially in view of the warning God gives against adding to His revealed word, the Bible.

Werid. I wonder if there is a religion that preceded Christianity with a holy book claimed to be directly from god....
 

ONEWAY

Member
Let me clarify a few points I made before.

First, by saying that other religions have borrowed from the Bible's inspired authority from God, I am including both the Old and the New Testaments (if I understood your assertion correctly). By Scriptures own storyline, the Old and New Testaments are explicitly connected via the many prophecies given that foretold of the One Messiah who would come to be the Suffering Servant, to die on behalf of sinners in order to reconcile them with God by faith in the work of Christ. This much is clear as one sees the storyline unfold from covenant to covenant and God's purposes coming to fulfillment through His Son Jesus Christ, the true Jew.

Second, it is not only for a religion to claim such authority from God, but to make good on such claims. I know this sentence will be challenged, but the Scriptures have continually be tried, tested, argued against, and debated continually by some of the most fierce intellectuals. Yet, the Christian worldview has answered the challenges and also has shown how it practically is found and seen in all of life and experience. For example, in relation to life and experience, since we have all sinned against God and sought his own ways, man has sought to satisfy his heart with other things as Satan too seeks to deceive and misled many away from the One true Triune God. So, man does create religions contrary to who God has revealed Himself to be, does worship his own wisdom and self, does seek after pleasing himself rather than turning to His Creator to find ultimate joy and everlasting satisfaction.

It is for these other religions who claim such authority to make good on their claims in relation to life and reality, experience, consistency within its claims, and reason. Although there are some mysteries in Christianity that may not be resolvable (not to be confused with contradictions), Christianity has continually made good on its claims.
 

Monk Of Reason

༼ つ ◕_◕ ༽つ
Let me clarify a few points I made before.

First, by saying that other religions have borrowed from the Bible's inspired authority from God, I am including both the Old and the New Testaments (if I understood your assertion correctly). By Scriptures own storyline, the Old and New Testaments are explicitly connected via the many prophecies given that foretold of the One Messiah who would come to be the Suffering Servant, to die on behalf of sinners in order to reconcile them with God by faith in the work of Christ. This much is clear as one sees the storyline unfold from covenant to covenant and God's purposes coming to fulfillment through His Son Jesus Christ, the true Jew.

Second, it is not only for a religion to claim such authority from God, but to make good on such claims. I know this sentence will be challenged, but the Scriptures have continually be tried, tested, argued against, and debated continually by some of the most fierce intellectuals. Yet, the Christian worldview has answered the challenges and also has shown how it practically is found and seen in all of life and experience. For example, in relation to life and experience, since we have all sinned against God and sought his own ways, man has sought to satisfy his heart with other things as Satan too seeks to deceive and misled many away from the One true Triune God. So, man does create religions contrary to who God has revealed Himself to be, does worship his own wisdom and self, does seek after pleasing himself rather than turning to His Creator to find ultimate joy and everlasting satisfaction.

It is for these other religions who claim such authority to make good on their claims in relation to life and reality, experience, consistency within its claims, and reason. Although there are some mysteries in Christianity that may not be resolvable (not to be confused with contradictions), Christianity has continually made good on its claims.

Well... you were at least right in saying that what you were about to claim would be challenged at least. where to begin?

Well lets focus on this. You claim Christianity has an answer for everything? Correct? Why would that attribute be desired? What about that makes it "good"? I mean If you gave me enough time I could write a religion and a book with just as much encompassing power. If I had millions of followers to review my vague text I'm sure they could pull a near infinite amount of different possible interpretations to try and make it fit.


Next what about when Christianity gets it wrong? The world was not made in seven days. God didn't create man from the dust of the earth and certainly no woman from a rib. Or the condractions between what books of the bible made it into the bible and the books that didn't but were still considered holy scriputure (Lilith for example). Or homosexuality being "wrong"?
 

McBell

Resident Sourpuss
Let me clarify a few points I made before.

First, by saying that other religions have borrowed from the Bible's inspired authority from God, I am including both the Old and the New Testaments (if I understood your assertion correctly). By Scriptures own storyline, the Old and New Testaments are explicitly connected via the many prophecies given that foretold of the One Messiah who would come to be the Suffering Servant, to die on behalf of sinners in order to reconcile them with God by faith in the work of Christ. This much is clear as one sees the storyline unfold from covenant to covenant and God's purposes coming to fulfillment through His Son Jesus Christ, the true Jew.

Second, it is not only for a religion to claim such authority from God, but to make good on such claims. I know this sentence will be challenged, but the Scriptures have continually be tried, tested, argued against, and debated continually by some of the most fierce intellectuals. Yet, the Christian worldview has answered the challenges and also has shown how it practically is found and seen in all of life and experience. For example, in relation to life and experience, since we have all sinned against God and sought his own ways, man has sought to satisfy his heart with other things as Satan too seeks to deceive and misled many away from the One true Triune God. So, man does create religions contrary to who God has revealed Himself to be, does worship his own wisdom and self, does seek after pleasing himself rather than turning to His Creator to find ultimate joy and everlasting satisfaction.

It is for these other religions who claim such authority to make good on their claims in relation to life and reality, experience, consistency within its claims, and reason. Although there are some mysteries in Christianity that may not be resolvable (not to be confused with contradictions), Christianity has continually made good on its claims.

Sticking your fingers in your ears chanting la la la la though does help you protect your beliefs from truth and fact, does not help in the least bit when spouting nonsense as fact.
Especially when you are no longer preaching to the choir.
 

Ouroboros

Coincidentia oppositorum
Zoroastrians didn't borrow from Judaism. It emerged, through a prophet sent by Ahura Mazda, more than 1,000 years before Christianity, in Persia. There are several concepts that are the same as Judaism, even though there's no evidence from borrowing, but rather the possibility of the opposite, i.e. Judaism borrowing from Zoroastrians (the issue is still up in the air).
 

9-10ths_Penguin

1/10 Subway Stalinist
Premium Member
Let me clarify a few points I made before.

First, by saying that other religions have borrowed from the Bible's inspired authority from God, I am including both the Old and the New Testaments (if I understood your assertion correctly). By Scriptures own storyline, the Old and New Testaments are explicitly connected via the many prophecies given that foretold of the One Messiah who would come to be the Suffering Servant, to die on behalf of sinners in order to reconcile them with God by faith in the work of Christ. This much is clear as one sees the storyline unfold from covenant to covenant and God's purposes coming to fulfillment through His Son Jesus Christ, the true Jew.

Second, it is not only for a religion to claim such authority from God, but to make good on such claims. I know this sentence will be challenged, but the Scriptures have continually be tried, tested, argued against, and debated continually by some of the most fierce intellectuals. Yet, the Christian worldview has answered the challenges and also has shown how it practically is found and seen in all of life and experience. For example, in relation to life and experience, since we have all sinned against God and sought his own ways, man has sought to satisfy his heart with other things as Satan too seeks to deceive and misled many away from the One true Triune God. So, man does create religions contrary to who God has revealed Himself to be, does worship his own wisdom and self, does seek after pleasing himself rather than turning to His Creator to find ultimate joy and everlasting satisfaction.

It is for these other religions who claim such authority to make good on their claims in relation to life and reality, experience, consistency within its claims, and reason. Although there are some mysteries in Christianity that may not be resolvable (not to be confused with contradictions), Christianity has continually made good on its claims.
When did it make good on this claim (Mark 13:30):


I tell you the truth, this generation will not pass away until all these things take place.
 

9-10ths_Penguin

1/10 Subway Stalinist
Premium Member
From about 70 to 130 CE

The "these things" he was referring to includes this:

24 “But in those days, after that tribulation, the sun will be darkened and the moon will not give its light, 25 and the stars will be falling from heaven, and the powers that are in [m]the heavens will be shaken. 26 Then they will see the Son of Man coming in clouds with great power and glory. 27 And then He will send forth the angels, and will gather together His [n]elect from the four winds, from the farthest end of the earth to the farthest end of heaven.

So this happened between 70 and 130? When did the sun and moon go dark? When did the stars fall from Heaven? When did the Son of Man come out of the clouds?

Nobody since 130 was part of "the elect"?
 

nazz

Doubting Thomas
The "these things" he was referring to includes this:

So this happened between 70 and 130? When did the sun and moon go dark? When did the stars fall from Heaven? When did the Son of Man come out of the clouds?

They are all metaphors. Sun and moon going dark and stars falling from heaven is used in the OT in an obviously figurative way. The rabbis said Messiah would come either riding on a donkey (humbly) or riding the clouds of heaven (with power). Jesus told the High Priest he would witness the latter which just means the power manifested through Holy Spirit in the early church.

Nobody since 130 was part of "the elect"?
It doesn't say it was a one time event. It's just talking about the beginning of the church.
 
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