Would People Behave Better if They are Judged by their Behavior or Their Thoughts?

Jonathan Hoffman · Jun 10, 2013

Would People Behave Better if They are Judged by their Behavior or Their Thoughts?

I am trying to be even more precise in how I ask this question as the other thread has gotten lost in the weeds.

I think the answer is obvious, but anything seems to be possible on this discussion board.

Pegg · Jun 10, 2013

I think that if a person knows that God is listening to and judging his very thoughts, he will be more inclined to control them....and that will lead to better behaviour.

For example Romans 2:15*They are the very ones who demonstrate the matter of the law to be written in their hearts, while their conscience is bearing witness with them and, between their own thoughts, they are being accused or even excused.

This verse shows that we are 'accused or excused' by our own 'thoughts'

Green Kepi · Jun 10, 2013

I don't think we have 'much' of a choice. God judges our thoughts, words, actions, and motives. He judges our heart. The Bible says. He searches the heart. Scripture teaches that man's heart is desperately wicked.

“O Jehovah, you have searched through me, and you know me. You yourself have come to know my sitting down and my rising up. You have considered my thought from far off.”—Psalm 139:1-2.

Jonathan Hoffman · Jun 10, 2013

Pegg said:
I think that if a person knows that God is listening to and judging his very thoughts, he will be more inclined to control them....and that will lead to better behaviour.

For example Romans 2:15*They are the very ones who demonstrate the matter of the law to be written in their hearts, while their conscience is bearing witness with them and, between their own thoughts, they are being accused or even excused.

This verse shows that we are 'accused or excused' by our own 'thoughts'

What translation is that?

Shiranui117 · Jun 10, 2013

Jonathan Hoffman said:
What translation is that?

It might be the Jehovah's Witnesses creation, the New World Translation?

Pegg · Jun 10, 2013

Jonathan Hoffman said:
What translation is that?

that is the NWT

I also like how some other translations bring out the point:

Romans 2:15
Contemporary English Version (CEV)
15 This proves that the conscience is like a law written in the human heart. And it will show whether we are forgiven or condemned, 16 when God appoints Jesus Christ to judge everyones secret thoughts, just as my message says.

Revised Standard Version (RSV)
15 They show that what the law requires is written on their hearts, while their conscience also bears witness and their conflicting thoughts accuse or perhaps excuse them 16 on that day when, according to my gospel, God judges the secrets of men by Christ Jesus.

Orthodox Jewish Bible (OJB)
15 In that they demonstrate the Torah at work [YIRMEYAH 31:33], the Torah written in their levavot, their matzpun (conscience) also bearing witness, while their thoughts bring accusation or even make defense among themselves,
16 In the Yom [HaDin (Day of Judgment)] when, according to my Besuras HaGeulah, Hashem, through Rebbe, Melech HaMoshiach Yehoshua, is to judge the secrets of kol Bnei Adam (all men).

these versions all say that it is the 'secret thoughts' that Christ will judge.

Jonathan Hoffman · Jun 10, 2013

Pegg said:
that is the NWT

I also like how some other translations bring out the point:

Romans 2:15
Contemporary English Version (CEV)
15 This proves that the conscience is like a law written in the human heart. And it will show whether we are forgiven or condemned, 16 when God appoints Jesus Christ to judge everyones secret thoughts, just as my message says.

Revised Standard Version (RSV)
15 They show that what the law requires is written on their hearts, while their conscience also bears witness and their conflicting thoughts accuse or perhaps excuse them 16 on that day when, according to my gospel, God judges the secrets of men by Christ Jesus.

Orthodox Jewish Bible (OJB)
15 In that they demonstrate the Torah at work [YIRMEYAH 31:33], the Torah written in their levavot, their matzpun (conscience) also bearing witness, while their thoughts bring accusation or even make defense among themselves,
16 In the Yom [HaDin (Day of Judgment)] when, according to my Besuras HaGeulah, Hashem, through Rebbe, Melech HaMoshiach Yehoshua, is to judge the secrets of kol Bnei Adam (all men).

these versions all say that it is the 'secret thoughts' that Christ will judge.

Please use literal translations.

Jonathan Hoffman · Jun 10, 2013

Pegg said:
that is the NWT

I also like how some other translations bring out the point:

Romans 2:15
Contemporary English Version (CEV)
15 This proves that the conscience is like a law written in the human heart. And it will show whether we are forgiven or condemned, 16 when God appoints Jesus Christ to judge everyones secret thoughts, just as my message says.

Revised Standard Version (RSV)
15 They show that what the law requires is written on their hearts, while their conscience also bears witness and their conflicting thoughts accuse or perhaps excuse them 16 on that day when, according to my gospel, God judges the secrets of men by Christ Jesus.

Orthodox Jewish Bible (OJB)
15 In that they demonstrate the Torah at work [YIRMEYAH 31:33], the Torah written in their levavot, their matzpun (conscience) also bearing witness, while their thoughts bring accusation or even make defense among themselves,
16 In the Yom [HaDin (Day of Judgment)] when, according to my Besuras HaGeulah, Hashem, through Rebbe, Melech HaMoshiach Yehoshua, is to judge the secrets of kol Bnei Adam (all men).

these versions all say that it is the 'secret thoughts' that Christ will judge.

What Law is written on their hearts? The Mosaic Law?

Skwim · Jun 11, 2013

Jonathan Hoffman said:
Would People Behave Better if They are Judged by their Behavior or Their Thoughts?

Well, first they'd have to care about the judgement. I know if I don't respect a person or there's no untoward consequences to their judgment, then I couldn't care less what they thought of me.

dust1n · Jun 11, 2013

Jonathan Hoffman said:
Would People Behave Better if They are Judged by their Behavior or Their Thoughts?

I am trying to be even more precise in how I ask this question as the other thread has gotten lost in the weeds.

I think the answer is obvious, but anything seems to be possible on this discussion board.

Isn't thought a behavior?

Pagan_Patriot · Jun 11, 2013

I think we need to start judging more in American society. I hear all these things like "Don't point fingers" or "Only God can judge", but let's set that all aside and tackle our problems.

I think one way we can fix society is by judging women who have all these kids out of wedlock(We already judge men who walk out on their kids, so I'm leaving that out). I'm going to bring race into this because it's relevant.

Blacks struggle with 72 percent unwed mothers rate - Health - Women's health | NBC News

72% of black children today are born out of wedlock. And surprise, there's a highly disproportionate crime rate when it comes to black Americans. I think we need to start doing some real finger pointing, and some judging, to let these mothers know that it's not ok. I realize it's hard to raise kids as a single mom, but we should be reminded that everyone should live within their means. If we started judging, then we can have some hope in stopping this crime epidemic.

Well... There's my case for judging. What do you all think?

Pegg · Jun 11, 2013

Jonathan Hoffman said:
Please use literal translations.

Romans 2:15-16
Young's Literal Translation (YLT)

15 who do shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also witnessing with them, and between one another the thoughts accusing or else defending,
16 in the day when God shall judge the secrets of men, according to my good news, through Jesus Christ.

our thoughts are what accuse us before God because it is our thoughts that he judges first.

Thief · Jun 11, 2013

It is written....
All that was ever done in secret shall be made known.

Again it is written....
That you have done so in your heart.....you have already done so.

I suspect....after the last breath we stand from the dust....naked.
Heaven can see through our mind and heart as if we are glass.

And the angels may be at liberty to leave us standing....wherever we have fallen.

Pegg · Jun 11, 2013

Jonathan Hoffman said:
What Law is written on their hearts? The Mosaic Law?

the 'law' of God is righteousness. Every person, religious or not, knows what is right and what is wrong....that is what Paul is saying.

The matter of the 'law' in this context means that matter of righteousness. And we know that God does not look for those who practice mosaic law to become his children... he looks for those practising righteousness. This is highlighted for us in the account about Cornelius...the first gentile to receive holy spirit.
The angel who appeared to Cornelius said:
Acts 10:4*The man gazed at him and, becoming frightened, said: “What is it, Lord?” He said to him: “Your prayers and gifts of mercy have ascended as a remembrance before God"

Cornelius was not a man who practised mosaic law...but he was righteous in Gods eyes because he lived a righteous life.

dust1n · Jun 11, 2013

Pagan_Patriot said:
I think we need to start judging more in American society. I hear all these things like "Don't point fingers" or "Only God can judge", but let's set that all aside and tackle our problems.

I think one way we can fix society is by judging women who have all these kids out of wedlock(We already judge men who walk out on their kids, so I'm leaving that out). I'm going to bring race into this because it's relevant.

Blacks struggle with 72 percent unwed mothers rate - Health - Women's health | NBC News

72% of black children today are born out of wedlock. And surprise, there's a highly disproportionate crime rate when it comes to black Americans. I think we need to start doing some real finger pointing, and some judging, to let these mothers know that it's not ok. I realize it's hard to raise kids as a single mom, but we should be reminded that everyone should live within their means. If we started judging, then we can have some hope in stopping this crime epidemic.

Well... There's my case for judging. What do you all think?

Um, you've heard of a thing called the Bible, right?

Sculelos · Jun 11, 2013

If you honestly are doing what you think is right and willingly and honestly search and grasp and love any truth you have in you. Then God will know and will save you no matter what religion you are.

If you know what your doing is wrong, but still do it anyway. Spitefully and ignore and reject the things of God then truth is not in you and you will die twice.

Pagan_Patriot · Jun 11, 2013

dust1n said:
Um, you've heard of a thing called the Bible, right?

Ya why?

Me Myself · Jun 11, 2013

What is this doing obiblical debates? Isnt it supposed ot be presenting an hypotetical?

According to Jesus gospels, both wille judged, but you knew that, so , what did you expect form this thread?

dust1n · Jun 11, 2013

Pagan_Patriot said:
Ya why?

So why on Earth would anyone possibly think anyone is going to any credence to your theory for why one should judge people, in the Biblical debates section, in which the Bible is to be discussed, when this is one of the highest regarded scriptures book ever:

"Judge not, and you shall not be judged. Condemn not, and you shall not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven." - Luke 3:37

Hey, just Jesus talking here...

Matthew 13:1-6

1 Judge not, that ye be not judged.
2 For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.
3 And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye?
4 Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and, behold, a beam is in thine own eye?
5 Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye.
6 Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you.

dust1n · Jun 11, 2013

Me Myself said:
What is this doing obiblical debates? Isnt it supposed ot be presenting an hypotetical?

According to Jesus gospels, both wille judged, but you knew that, so , what did you expect form this thread?

Because obviously the OP wanted answers from the Biblical perspective.

Would People Behave Better if They are Judged by their Behavior or Their Thoughts?

Active Member

Jehovah our God is One

Active Member

Active Member

Pronounced Shee-ra-noo-ee

Jehovah our God is One

Active Member

Active Member

Veteran Member

Zindīq

Active Member

Jehovah our God is One

Rogue Theologian

Jehovah our God is One

Zindīq

Active Member

Active Member

Back to my username

Zindīq

Zindīq