In response to convictions about Satan, Temptation & Responsibility

Ulver · Jan 20, 2006

People in a few threads have been constantly talking about how Satan is an active force in this world and tempts people, churches and other such things.
This has all reminded me of something written in one of Neil Gaiman's Sandman Comics. Luckily enough I found the quote I was looking for, so I'll post it here. I know it's a work of fiction, but that doesn't mean the message and question should be ignored. Gaiman isn't some immature dolt bashing on religion. Far from.

"Why do they blame me for all their little failings? They use my name as if I spend my entire day sitting on their shoulders, forcing them to commit acts they would otherwise find repulsive. 'The devil made me do it.' I have never made one of them do anything. Never. They live their own tiny lives. I do not live their lives for them .... They talk of my going around and buying souls - never stopping to ask themselves why. I need no souls. And how can anyone own a soul? No. They belong to themselves - they just hate to have to face up to it." -- Lucifer, Season of Mists #2.

dawny0826 · Jan 20, 2006

Ulver said:
People in a few threads have been constantly talking about how Satan is an active force in this world and tempts people, churches and other such things.
This has all reminded me of something written in one of Neil Gaiman's Sandman Comics. Luckily enough I found the quote I was looking for, so I'll post it here. I know it's a work of fiction, but that doesn't mean the message and question should be ignored. Gaiman isn't some immature dolt bashing on religion. Far from.

"Why do they blame me for all their little failings? They use my name as if I spend my entire day sitting on their shoulders, forcing them to commit acts they would otherwise find repulsive. 'The devil made me do it.' I have never made one of them do anything. Never. They live their own tiny lives. I do not live their lives for them .... They talk of my going around and buying souls - never stopping to ask themselves why. I need no souls. And how can anyone own a soul? No. They belong to themselves - they just hate to have to face up to it." -- Lucifer, Season of Mists #2.

Very good post.

The whole "devil made do it" phrase really doesn't fly.

It's true that Satan does tempt but ultimately WE have to make choices. He may place the obstacles in front of us...put the thoughts in our heads...but I'm held accountable for the way that I approach every situation in life. If I don't follow Christ's example...the devil didn't do it...I did.

I'm a Christian...so I don't even have to tell you who my soul belongs to...

ThisShouldMakeSense · Jan 24, 2006

dawny0826 said:
Very good post.

The whole "devil made do it" phrase really doesn't fly.

It's true that Satan does tempt but ultimately WE have to make choices. He may place the obstacles in front of us...put the thoughts in our heads...but I'm held accountable for the way that I approach every situation in life. If I don't follow Christ's example...the devil didn't do it...I did.

I'm a Christian...so I don't even have to tell you who my soul belongs to...

well said! :clap

Smoke · Jan 24, 2006

Ulver said:
"Why do they blame me for all their little failings? They use my name as if I spend my entire day sitting on their shoulders, forcing them to commit acts they would otherwise find repulsive. 'The devil made me do it.' I have never made one of them do anything. Never.

Reminds me of the old Flip Wilson routine: "I said, 'I ain't gonna buy no dress, Devil.' And he pulled a gun."

cardero · Jan 24, 2006

Ahh, Neil Gaimen, if there ever was a truer meaning that all scripture is inspired by GOD.

Many people do not realize that not only did Lucifer go on to get his own comic series from Vertigo but that the old adage, the devil made me do it is a bit outdated and has never stood up well as an accurate defense in a court of law. I think many people could quickly discover the blame of their own "sins and transgressions" by staying close to the nearest mirror.

Now, I do have an open mind and even though I never met Satan, that does not necessarily mean he doesnt exist, but if he did, I have a feeling we can find him right where Neil Gaimen left him, in Perth, Western Australia on the shore, admiring the way GOD sets the sun.

Eynah · Jan 25, 2006

I love Gaiman, and I think that he says a lot that is fascinating to read. I have yet to read the Sandman comics, but I love the quote that you have. Thank you for posting it.

Tannenisis · Jan 26, 2006

I think of Satan as a metaphor for the suggestive thoughts/actions within ourselves. I do not believe Satan to be a literal being, but a personification of the individualistic and egotistic aspirations of man.

Secondly, there is no one else that we can blame for our actions save ourselves. One of the biggest faults of human beings is the failure to own up to their own choices.

Tannenisis

Faint · Jan 26, 2006

Tannenisis said:
...there is no one else that we can blame for our actions save ourselves. One of the biggest faults of human beings is the failure to own up to their own choices.

I agree. In the book quoted by the OP, Gaiman quotes Milton "The mind is its own place, and in itself, can make heaven of Hell, and a hell of Heaven", and also goes on to create a story in which people create their own hell. The people believe they must be tortured because they feel deep down that they have done something contrary to what they believe they should have done. In essence, they are masochists in the afterlife, torturing theirselves. Only when they realize that they are the ones personally responsible for their own suffering are they freed from their prison. As Gaiman writes, "you don't have to stay anywhere forever".

Ulver · Jan 26, 2006

Faint said:
I agree. In the book quoted by the OP, Gaiman quotes Milton "The mind is its own place, and in itself, can make heaven of Hell, and a hell of Heaven", and also goes on to create a story in which people create their own hell. The people believe they must be tortured because they feel deep down that they have done something contrary to what they believe they should have done. In essence, they are masochists in the afterlife, torturing theirselves. Only when they realize that they are the ones personally responsible for their own suffering are they freed from their prison. As Gaiman writes, "you don't have to stay anywhere forever".

I remember that part.

True meaning in those words. Makes more sense then a lot of thigns I've heard or seen in my life.

In response to convictions about Satan, Temptation & Responsibility

Ulver

Active Member

dawny0826

Mother Heathen

ThisShouldMakeSense

Active Member

Smoke

Done here.

cardero

Citizen Mod

Eynah

Member

Tannenisis

Member

Faint

Well-Known Member

Ulver

Active Member