Can science prove or disprove the existence of a Spiritual existence? God?

PolyHedral · Oct 9, 2012

Call_of_the_Wild said:
If you add to infinity, you still have infinity...if you subtract from infinity, you still have infinity. This is absurd, because anytime you add to something you are supposed to have more, and when you subtract you are supposed to have less. This is the problem of infinity, it doesn't exist in reality, it only exist in our mind as a concept, but this concept cannot actually exist in reality.

Negative numbers? Zero?

Just because it doesn't fit your naive assumptions about how numbers work doesn't mean it's impossible.

Heathen Hammer · Oct 9, 2012

Call_of_the_Wild said:
If you add to infinity, you still have infinity...if you subtract from infinity, you still have infinity. This is absurd, because anytime you add to something you are supposed to have more, and when you subtract you are supposed to have less. This is the problem of infinity, it doesn't exist in reality, it only exist in our mind as a concept, but this concept cannot actually exist in reality.

In the case of what you are actually talking about, what is being added or subtracted?

Photonic · Oct 10, 2012

PolyHedral said:
Negative numbers? Zero?

Just because it doesn't fit your naive assumptions about how numbers work doesn't mean it's impossible.

The cool thing is he technically just disproved his god with his own logic.

Call_of_the_Wild · Oct 10, 2012

Heathen Hammer said:
In the case of what you are actually talking about, what is being added or subtracted?

Anything....anything that you can think of can be added or subtracted (or should be able to).

Call_of_the_Wild · Oct 10, 2012

Photonic said:
The cool thing is he technically just disproved his god with his own logic.

And how did "he" do that?

Call_of_the_Wild · Oct 10, 2012

PolyHedral said:
Negative numbers? Zero?

Just because it doesn't fit your naive assumptions about how numbers work doesn't mean it's impossible.

Im trying to figure out what point is being made here.

PolyHedral · Oct 11, 2012

You were objecting to an infinite recurrence because infinite quantities don't behave the same way finite ones do. You were baselessly concluding from that that infinity doesn't exist.

Now, what's wrong with either an infinite or a one-ended time?

Heathen Hammer · Oct 11, 2012

Call_of_the_Wild said:
Anything....anything that you can think of can be added or subtracted (or should be able to).

Where is it being added from. There should be nothing outside of infinity.

Call_of_the_Wild · Oct 11, 2012

PolyHedral said:
You were objecting to an infinite recurrence because infinite quantities don't behave the same way finite ones do. You were baselessly concluding from that that infinity doesn't exist.

Now, what's wrong with either an infinite or a one-ended time?

Don't behave the same way finite do? Well, if what you mean by "behave the same way" mean that one contradicts logic and the other one don't, then I guess infinity doesn't behave the same way finite quantities do.

Call_of_the_Wild · Oct 11, 2012

Heathen Hammer said:
Where is it being added from. There should be nothing outside of infinity.

There can be numbers inside of the infinite set.

PolyHedral · Oct 11, 2012

Call_of_the_Wild said:
Don't behave the same way finite do? Well, if what you mean by "behave the same way" mean that one contradicts logic and the other one don't, then I guess infinity doesn't behave the same way finite quantities do.

All of math is logical. That is the point. That does not require it to be intuitive, though.

Call_of_the_Wild · Oct 11, 2012

PolyHedral said:
All of math is logical. That is the point. That does not require it to be intuitive, though.

Regardless of how you put it, when you subtract from any amount, you are, by definition, supposed to have less than what you had, and the same thing with addition. With infinity, this isn't the case. If you have an infinite amount of marbles, and you give me three, you will still have an infinite amount. If you have an infinite amount of marbles, and I give you three, you will still have an infinite amount. This is clearly absurd, and absurdities don't exist in reality.

Photonic · Oct 11, 2012

Call_of_the_Wild said:
Regardless of how you put it, when you subtract from any amount, you are, by definition, supposed to have less than what you had, and the same thing with addition. With infinity, this isn't the case. If you have an infinite amount of marbles, and you give me three, you will still have an infinite amount. If you have an infinite amount of marbles, and I give you three, you will still have an infinite amount. This is clearly absurd, and absurdities don't exist in reality.

You aren't helping your case.

McBell · Oct 12, 2012

Photonic said:
You aren't helping your case.

$20 says he not only has no clue why not, but flat out denies it is true.

Heathen Hammer · Oct 12, 2012

Call_of_the_Wild said:
There can be numbers inside of the infinite set.

But not outside, and you are adding to it.

Call_of_the_Wild · Oct 12, 2012

Photonic said:
You aren't helping your case.

Just when I put the bait out there and hope you people will catch it and actually engage in it, more rhetoric is to follow. All rhetoric, no substance.:sarcastic

Call_of_the_Wild · Oct 12, 2012

Mestemia said:
$20 says he not only has no clue why not, but flat out denies it is true.

$20 says that you and at least 3 others will continue to talk AT me instead of TO me, all the while my argument will still stand.

Call_of_the_Wild · Oct 12, 2012

Heathen Hammer said:
But not outside, and you are adding to it.

It doesn't make a difference...if you have a bank account with an infinite amount of dollars in it, does it matter whats on the outside of it?? At least, it wouldn't matter to me

PolyHedral · Oct 12, 2012

Call_of_the_Wild said:
Regardless of how you put it, when you subtract from any amount, you are, by definition, supposed to have less than what you had, and the same thing with addition. With infinity, this isn't the case. If you have an infinite amount of marbles, and you give me three, you will still have an infinite amount. If you have an infinite amount of marbles, and I give you three, you will still have an infinite amount. This is clearly absurd, and absurdities don't exist in reality.

By whose "definition?" Even when you're dealing with only whole numbers, then subtracting can increase the answer (because you're subtracting a negative) or adding decrease it, or keep it the same. (Because zero is a whole number.) With some more advanced structures, e.g. complex numbers, "less than" doesn't even mean anything.

Besides, having the same amount of marbles afterwards makes perfect sense to me. After all, if I had less of them after giving some to you, then I could give enough to you that I wouldn't have any. If I can do that, then my original collection wasn't very infinite in the first place, was it? :shrug:

Heathen Hammer said:
But not outside, and you are adding to it.

Just because the integers are infinite doesn't mean that the fractions don't exist.

McBell · Oct 12, 2012

Call_of_the_Wild said:
all the while my argument will still stand.

thank you for further proving my point.

Can science prove or disprove the existence of a Spiritual existence? God?

Superabacus Mystic

Nope, you're still wrong

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Nope, you're still wrong

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Nope, you're still wrong

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