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Why do Jews not believe Jesus is God's son?Anybody Jewish want to answer?

Anastasios

Member
Not only Jews, but also Muslims don't accept him as the Son of God. One of the essential reasons for Muslims is that it is out of possibility, since God cannot have a son, especially in human form. He certainly doesn't need to offer such a complex comprehension which is contradictory to his existence. An unreasoning idea cannot be acceptable in Islam.
Islam is a religion which requires belief in not only the Prophethood of Muhammad but all the prophets of God, including Jesus (Qur'an 2:137).
The Holy book of Islam, the Quran, relates in detail the story of Jesus, including his birth, mission as a Prophet to the Israelites, and his crucifixion. Muslims believe that this story is in harmony with the Bible too. Indeed, a whole chapter in the Qur'an is named after the mother of Jesus (Chapter 19 - Maryam).In Islam, Mary is described as a pious and righteous woman who symbolizes righteous believers blessed with Divine inspiration. Islam then affirms the fatherless birth of Jesus and rejects outright the opposing claim that his birth was illegitimate.
Whereas, Islam recognizes the virgin birth of Jesus as a miraculous event, it does not consider it unnatural; the laws of nature are never broken. It just reflects the inability of man to fully understand the science behind various phenomena observed in nature. Numerous scientists have explained the virgin births.
In Islam, the immaculate conception of Jesus is not interpreted to mean that he was in some way a Divine Being. He was still a human being (Qur'an 19:31)
Islam presents Jesus as a human who believed in the absolute Unity and Indivisibility of God (Qur'an 3:52).
Muslims consider the doctrine of Divinity of Jesus and Trinity as later changes to the teachings of Jesus. The New Testament itself furnishes abundant evidence to show that Jesus was only a human being whom God chose for the reformation of His people, and repeatedly contradicts the Divinity of Jesus. Jesus always referred to himself as having been sent by God (John 17:3) and his followers, too, considered him a man approved by God (Qur'an 19:37; Acts 2:22, John 3:2).
He was undoubtedly called the son of God, but this title has only been employed metaphorically and in fact is used for all the chosen ones of God (Matt 5:9, Exodus 4:22). The literal connotation of 'son of God' as a Divine Being and hence the subsequent development of Trinity Dogma was the result of Hellenistic influences on Christianity as it spread in the Gentile world. The Semitic usage of 'son of God' was misunderstood and forgotten and disputes about the exact status of Jesus erupted, as recorded in the early Church history.
Jesus prayed to God like all other God-fearing individuals (Luke 5:16), and engaged in spiritual exercises such as fasting (Matt 4:2). Furthermore, Jesus lacked knowledge of the future (Mark 13:32), as only the Divine Being possesses perfect and complete knowledge.
The Holy Qur'an mentions several miracles of Jesus, including his ability to create birds, his ability to cure the leprous and the blind, and raising the dead to life. The ability to create birds is a metaphor meaning ordinary people who accepted the teachings of Jesus were spiritually transformed into birds soaring high into the lofty regions of the spiritual firmament above all worldly concerns. The healing powers can also be understood in the spiritual sense. He restored sight to those people who were spiritually blind, and gave life to those spiritually dead. Jesus specifically referred to the Pharisees of his day as being blind because, among other maladies, they were hypocritical in nature.
Indeed, all reformers from God are spiritual physicians since the disbelievers are deaf, dumb and blind according to Islam (Qur'an 2:17).
The disbelievers of Jesus wished to bring about his death upon the cross for the purpose of calling him accursed in accordance with the pronouncement in Deut 21:23 which declares, "he that is hanged is accursed of God." His death on the cross would thus confirm him as a false Messiah. Islam contradicts the assertion that Jesus died an accursed death on the cross.
But there are also divisions on this matter in Islamic communities. The most remarkable idea comes from Ahmadi Muslims, while all the other islamic sects allege that Jesus was taken to heaven by God before Curicifixion and someone else who looks like him was nailed on cross. But this opinion is not reasonable. Ahmedi Muslims believe that God frustrated the plan of the disbelievers of Jesus. Although Jesus was nailed to the cross, he did not perish on it. He was removed from the cross in a state of unconsciousness (Qur'an 4:158). The Gospels, too, provide extensive evidence of his escape from the accursed death on the cross.
According to Islam, Jesus did not preach salvation through atonement of sins by his death on the cross. This philosophy of someone atoning for the sins of another is emphatically rejected in the Old Testament as well (Deut. 24:16, Ezekiel 18:2 and 20).
Ahmadi Muslims believe that Jesus came under the care of his devoted followers after he was removed from the cross. He was placed in the tomb where he recovered from his ordeal. The Gospels too describe that Jesus was still in his earthly body of flesh and bones after emerging from the tomb (Luke 24:39). An analysis of the post-crucifixion period described in the Gospels reveals that Jesus led a low-profile existence. He hurriedly traveled away from the locality of the crucifixion (Qur'an 23:51; Matt 28:10, Mark 16:7).
I am not an ahmedi muslim, but that idea is the most logical and reasonable one I've ever heard.
 

TashaN

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Anastasios said:
The Holy Qur'an mentions several miracles of Jesus, including his ability to create birds, his ability to cure the leprous and the blind, and raising the dead to life. The ability to create birds is a metaphor meaning ordinary people who accepted the teachings of Jesus were spiritually transformed into birds soaring high into the lofty regions of the spiritual firmament above all worldly concerns. The healing powers can also be understood in the spiritual sense. He restored sight to those people who were spiritually blind, and gave life to those spiritually dead. Jesus specifically referred to the Pharisees of his day as being blind because, among other maladies, they were hypocritical in nature.
Sorry but i have to interpret this passage because you are saying that Jesys have an individual power and it was only "spiritual" which is not correct if you are trying to talk from an islamic perspective.

The power that had given to Jesus Christ was real but not spiritual according to islam and it wasn't his because he can do nothing by himself but by the permission of God so he was praying to God and by then God was giving him this power to heal and creat birds .. etc. Jesus was able to perform miracles, but only by the will of God.


But there are also divisions on this matter in Islamic communities. The most remarkable idea comes from Ahmadi Muslims, while all the other islamic sects allege that Jesus was taken to heaven by God before Curicifixion and someone else who looks like him was nailed on cross. But this opinion is not reasonable. Ahmedi Muslims believe that God frustrated the plan of the disbelievers of Jesus. Although Jesus was nailed to the cross, he did not perish on it. He was removed from the cross in a state of unconsciousness (Qur'an 4:158).
If you are talking about islam so this verse will make things so clear for you hopefully:

"That they said (in boast) "We killed the Messiah Jesus the son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah"; - but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for, of a surety they killed him not.
No, Allah raised him up unto Himself; and Allah is Exalted in Power, Wise".
(al-Qur'an 4:157-158)


An analysis of the post-crucifixion period described in the Gospels reveals that Jesus led a low-profile existence. He hurriedly traveled away from the locality of the crucifixion (Qur'an 23:51; Matt 28:10, Mark 16:7).
[23:51] O you messengers, eat from the good provisions, and work righteousness. I am fully aware of everything you do.(Quran 23:51)

?????

What is the relationship between this verse and your topic?
 

Anastasios

Member
First I am certainly believing that islam never present or propose superstitious beliefs. That what people want to understand and to make it mysterious. Islam is religion of logic and nature. We don't have to use such miracles to believe in God, this is not the way of understanding Quran. The other problem is related to translation you are using, new translations are not like that any more. If we understand the verses as you copied, it creates a great problems of understanding the situation. Other wise muslims will have no difference that Christians about Jesus. This idea was placed into islam by early Christian converts, unfortunately. To believe that Jesus was taken by god to haven before or after crucufixion brings many questions, such as Muhammed's situation in the presence of god. This was the main weapon for Christian missionaries, they were using it in comparing the prophets. And poor muslims were believing that Jesus, who is living with God in the heaven, was superior than Muhammad, who was underground. And god didn't take him into heaven physically, but gave his honour spritually and saved him from death on the Cross. This is a very important point to understand it correctly. But this is not the topic. And in the Quran numbering system, "bismillahirrahmanirrahim" is considered as a verse, so you should fine the verses according to numbering I used.
Regards.

[4:158] And for their saying, 'We did slay the Messiah, Jesus, son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah;' whereas they slew him not, nor did they bring about his death upon the cross, but he was made to appear to them like one crucified; and those who differ therein are certainly in a state of doubt about it; they have no certain knowledge thereof, but only pursue a conjecture; and they did not arrive at a certainty concerning it.
[4:159] On the contrary, Allah exalted him to Himself. And Allah is Mighty, Wise.
[4:160] And there is none among the People of the Book but will continue to believe in it (curcifixion) before his death; and on the Day of Resurrection, he (Jesus) shall be a witness against them.

For detailed axplanations on the verses check the urls:
http://www.alislam.org/quran/tafseer/?page=225&region=EN
http://www.alislam.org/quran/tafseer/?page=226&region=EN
http://www.alislam.org/quran/tafseer/?page=227&region=EN

[23:51] And We made the son of Mary and his mother a Sign, and gave them shelter on an elevated land of green valleys and springs of running water.

This verse shows that Jesus and his Mother left the country together, after curicifixion, by which he couldn't be killed.
http://www.alislam.org/quran/tafseer/?page=697&region=EN
http://www.alislam.org/quran/tafseer/?page=698&region=EN


Please read and think carefully and you will understand it clearly.
 

TashaN

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Anastasios said:
We don't have to use such miracles to believe in God, this is not the way of understanding Quran.
Indeed we don't have to use these miracles to believe in God but also as long as these miracles exist so why bother? Is these miracles so difficult that God can't make it on his prophet's hands.

The other problem is related to translation you are using, new translations are not like that any more. If we understand the verses as you copied, it creates a great problems of understanding the situation.
No, don't ever worry about that because i'm using the Arabic original Quran which is the real words of Allah.


Other wise muslims will have no difference that Christians about Jesus. This idea was placed into islam by early Christian converts
Nope, i don't think so and there is no different between early converts and between someone who was born as a muslim.


To believe that Jesus was taken by god to haven before or after crucufixion brings many questions, such as Muhammed's situation in the presence of god. This was the main weapon for Christian missionaries, they were using it in comparing the prophets.
What are you talking about? we Muslims love all prophets and we make no different between them. Jesus to muslims is just the same as Mohammed.

We don't care about anyone who want to say that Jesus is better because he is in heaven. This is only the will of God and both are his prophets. The only different is that Allah chosed Mohammed to be the last prophet and that we have to believe in him in this way as "the Messenger of God".

And poor muslims were believing that Jesus, who is living with God in the heaven, was superior than Muhammad, who was underground. And god didn't take him into heaven physically, but gave his honour spritually and saved him from death on the Cross.
He is not superior and both are the same just as all prophets before them.


"bismillahirrahmanirrahim" is considered as a verse
It's not a verse. from where you are coming up with these things?

And for their saying, 'We did slay the Messiah, Jesus, son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah;' whereas they slew him not, nor did they bring about his death upon the cross, but he was made to appear to them like one crucified;
if you can read arabic it's so clear and simple:

وما قتلوه وما صلبوه which means they killed him not, nor crucified him.

Allah exalted him to Himself.
بل رفعه الله إليه so clear in arabic the same as: Allah raised him up unto Himself.


[4:160] And there is none among the People of the Book but will continue to believe in it (curcifixion) before his death; and on the Day of Resurrection, he (Jesus) shall be a witness against them.
This is the real one ...

وَإِن مِّنْ أَهْلِ الْكِتَابِ إِلاَّ لَيُؤْمِنَنَّ بِهِ قَبْلَ مَوْتِهِ وَيَوْمَ الْقِيَامَةِ يَكُونُ عَلَيْهِمْ شَهِيدًا

[4:159]And there is none of the People of the Book but must believe in him before his death; and on the Day of Judgment he will be a witness against them
 

Anastasios

Member
As you wish. I hope you will understand one day these issues.
Take care...
Let's leave it to the readers
May Allah bless you.
Regards.
 

truth5555

New Member
Most Jews did not know the scriptures, so i'll let scripture speak for itself, the bible fortold the comming of the messiah so man would know what he look like when he arrived, it is written in spiritual language so many don't understand. Here's a few verses from the old OT the tanak is the same. Isaiah 9:6, Micah 5:2, Zac 9:9, Isaiah 53( most jews will say this is the nation Israel, but it's not ) their are more than 300 of these messanic prophecies in scripture, Jesus fulfilled all of them. Birthplace fortold, Curcifixion foretold ,before curcifixion was even devised as a form of capitol punishment. King David saw Jesus on the cross 1000 years before the event happen psalm 22. Evidence proves Jesus is God in the flesh. The gospel of Matthew was written for the Jews if you are Jewish read it, it is loaded with Tanak scriptures. Most people don't take the time to prove what they believe. The bible is a fact base book supported by history The key to unlocking it is prophecy and history, are you seeking the truth. Prove all thing and hold to that which is true. Here's the sad part all mankind will know the truth in death, find the truth now while you are alive 100 out of 100 die.
 

truth5555

New Member
Discernment, quick facts Koran written over a period of 13 years one author. The Bible written over a period 1500 years by 40 authors. Koran list no miracles unable to fortell future events in history. The Bible fortells history with pinpoint accuracy thousands of miracles recorded. Koran 4.157 said Jesus was not curcified. The bible has eye witness account of the curcifixion by more than 500. Muhammad was not able to do any miracles or prophecied. God always confirm his prophets with a supernatural ability to foretell the future, heal or some type of Godly power. Muhammad not mention in the bible ( all christians know the comforter is the Holy spirit not muhammad). God does not confuse people he has one truth yet these two beliefs are different; Why one is the truth and one is a lie. two different stories. One raise people from the dead (Bible), the other (koran) has no power. You must decide which book is of God. Scripture all of it speaks of a redeemer who would bring his people back from the fall which took place in the garden, the Bible has given us clues to what that redeemer would look like, it gives his birthplace 500 years before he was born, how he would die 1000 years in advance, how he would be rejected by man,even by the jews. He died for my sins and yours. Hosea 4:6 said may people are lost due to lack of knowledge. Satan has decieved billions. The first Koran appeared in the 7th century the first books of the bible 1500 bc. God does not change no new revelation he left man his Holy Word found in scripture ,one scripture. Islam said the bible has been change, I challenge Islam to prove this, the dead sea scrolls show that the bible in context is still the same. The Isaiah scroll dates 700 bc and has not changed. Isaiah foretold the comming of the redeemer Is 9:6 plus many other scriptures. The truth of the Bible is spread thru out the bible so no one could tamper with it. the Ot supports the Nt. The Bible is consistance and is still revealing prophecy today. Watch the middle east read ezk 38,39 The day of the Lord is at hand, seek the truth.
 

neves

Active Member
As you wish. I hope you will understand one day these issues.
Take care...
Let's leave it to the readers
May Allah bless you.
Regards.

I am going to have to go with The Truth on this one... simply because his translations are more sound...

004.157
YUSUFALI: That they said (in boast), "We killed Christ Jesus the son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah";- but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for of a surety they killed him not:-
PICKTHAL: And because of their saying: We slew the Messiah, Jesus son of Mary, Allah's messenger - they slew him not nor crucified him, but it appeared so unto them; and lo! those who disagree concerning it are in doubt thereof; they have no knowledge thereof save pursuit of a conjecture; they slew him not for certain.
SHAKIR: And their saying: Surely we have killed the Messiah, Isa son of Marium, the messenger of Allah; and they did not kill him nor did they crucify him, but it appeared to them so (like Isa) and most surely those who differ therein are only in a doubt about it; they have no knowledge respecting it, but only follow a conjecture, and they killed him not for sure.

004.158
YUSUFALI: Nay, Allah raised him up unto Himself; and Allah is Exalted in Power, Wise;-
PICKTHAL: But Allah took him up unto Himself. Allah was ever Mighty, Wise.
SHAKIR: Nay! Allah took him up to Himself; and Allah is Mighty, Wise.

004.159
YUSUFALI: And there is none of the People of the Book but must believe in him before his death; and on the Day of Judgment he will be a witness against them;-
PICKTHAL: There is not one of the People of the Scripture but will believe in him before his death, and on the Day of Resurrection he will be a witness against them -
SHAKIR: And there is not one of the followers of the Book but most certainly believes in this before his death, and on the day of resurrection he (Isa) shall be a witness against them.

Also on your quote on the exodus of Isa(Jesus) and Maryam... you said Chapter 23 verse 51 which is...

023.051
YUSUFALI: O ye messengers! enjoy (all) things good and pure, and work righteousness: for I am well-acquainted with (all) that ye do.
PICKTHAL: O ye messengers! Eat of the good things, and do right. Lo! I am Aware of what ye do.
SHAKIR: O messengers! eat of the good things and do good; surely I know what you do.

did you mean Chapter 23 verse 50...?

023.050
YUSUFALI: And We made the son of Mary and his mother as a Sign: We gave them both shelter on high ground, affording rest and security and furnished with springs.
PICKTHAL: And We made the son of Mary and his mother a portent, and We gave them refuge on a height, a place of flocks and watersprings.
SHAKIR: And We made the son of Marium and his mother a sign, and We gave them a shelter on a lofty ground having meadows and springs.

even so read the whole sura and see under which circumstance it was revealed...
 

neves

Active Member
Discernment, quick facts Koran written over a period of 13 years one author. The Bible written over a period 1500 years by 40 authors. Koran list no miracles unable to fortell future events in history. The Bible fortells history with pinpoint accuracy thousands of miracles recorded. Koran 4.157 said Jesus was not curcified. The bible has eye witness account of the curcifixion by more than 500. Muhammad was not able to do any miracles or prophecied. God always confirm his prophets with a supernatural ability to foretell the future, heal or some type of Godly power. Muhammad not mention in the bible ( all christians know the comforter is the Holy spirit not muhammad). God does not confuse people he has one truth yet these two beliefs are different, Why one is the truth and one is a lie. two different stories. One raise people from the dead (Bible), the other (koran) has no power. You must decide which book is of God. Scripture all of it speaks of a redeemer who would bring his people back from the fall which took place in the garden, the Bible has given us clues to what that redeemer would look like, it gives his birthplace 500 years before he was born, how he would die 1000 years in advance, how he would be rejected by man,even by the jews. He died for my sins and yours. Hosea 4:6 said may people are lost due to lack of knowledge. Satan has decieved billions. The first Koran appeared in the 7th century the first books of the bible 1500 bc. God does not change no new revelation he left man his Holy Word found in scripture ,one scripture. Islam said the bible has been change, I challenge Islam to prove this, the dead sea scrolls show that the bible in context is still the same. The Isaiah scroll dates 700 bc and has not changed. Isaiah foretold the comming of the redeemer Is 9:6 plus many other scriptures. The truth of the Bible is spread thru out the bible so no one could tamper with it. the Ot supports the Nt. The Bible is consistance and is still revealing prophecy today. Watch the middle east read ezk 38,39 The day of the Lord is at hand, seek the truth.

You yourself said..."Koran written over a period of 13 years one author. The Bible written over a period 1500 years by 40 authors."... you tell me which one has the possibility to be corrupted from its original message...
 

truth5555

New Member
Study The Dead Sea Scrolls The Text Has Not Change. Original Copies Of The Isaiah Scroll Writter 700bc Are The Same Isaiah Today. Written On The Original Papayus. This Is True For Many Of The Books Daniel Etc. Remember The Books Found In The Bible Are Cannonized.
 

Dream Angel

Well-Known Member
Not only Jews, but also Muslims don't accept him as the Son of God. One of the essential reasons for Muslims is that it is out of possibility, since God cannot have a son, especially in human form.


In Islam, Mary is described as a pious and righteous woman who symbolizes righteous believers blessed with Divine inspiration. Islam then affirms the fatherless birth of Jesus and rejects outright the opposing claim that his birth was illegitimate.
Whereas, Islam recognizes the virgin birth of Jesus as a miraculous event, it does not consider it unnatural; the laws of nature are never broken. It just reflects the inability of man to fully understand the science behind various phenomena observed in nature. Numerous scientists have explained the virgin births.

Why cant God have a son - surely that is putting a limitation on him, which states he is not as powerful as you make him out to be.

Sceondly I cant see how you believe in the virgin birth, but dont believe that Jesus was the Son of God - I understand scientists have documented evidence of virgin births BUT none of these (as far as I know) were HUMAN!
 

truth5555

New Member
Here's Something Funny The Koran Believes In The Virgin Birth,but They Deny Jesus Is The Son Of God. So Who Is His Dad. Virgin Untouch By Man. So Who Is His Dad
 

bible truth

Active Member
I've often wondered why Jews do not believe that Jesus is God's son when they believe the old testament and the old testament fortells of his coming.A man came to my church the other day and he said that the reason is that when all the "christians" were persecuting people for not being christians,they did it in the name of Jesus.And since they did it in the name of Jesus the Jews don't want to believe in him.Is this true?

If you read Romans Chapter 11, you will see that God has saved a Jewish remnant chosen by grace to be Christians. To better understand God's wisdom, please read Romans Chapter 9, Chapter 10, Chapter 11, and Romans Chapter 2 for a biblical understanding to your Thread questions. - BT :)
 

Dream Angel

Well-Known Member
You can reply using the same post. You do know that right? And what does what agnostic mean have anything to do with this? Agnostic means I neither accept or deny the existance of God - I am open to the idea that there maybe a God.
 
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