Altered States of Consciousness

Shuddhasattva said:

I won't try to describe my experiences in detail, but many of them, the ones dearest to me, have revolved around mystical expressions of sexuality.

I think there's some truth to the claims by some psychiatrists and such that religious, altered states result from sublimated (or repressed, as they often term it) sexuality - many of them gosofar as to say denied homosexuality.

In my case, I took brahmacharya vrata (vow of celibacy) when I was 13 because I had intuited, in a hazy, pubescent manner, that that which my hormones was comeplling me to seek was an ultimately cyclical desire that would never result in the communion of minds that I sought.

This communion of minds - a symmetry between subject and object, such that neither can be said to be object or subject - one the object of the other, one the subject at the heart of the other, a mutually conjoined vision, is something that I began to think of in less romantic terms and more spiritualized terms gradually as I developed out of the 'hormones to head like a brick' phase of life.

Though a previous mystical experience caused by non-spiritual means that cannot be mentioned on this forum had first taken me back to Hinduism, it was a rap song "Shadows on the Sun" by Brother Ali that jarred me into awareness of this nonduality and set me down this path, for which I will always be grateful.

I had listened to the song many times, and I was listening to it one day, and the same words I had heard many times already hit me with tremendous new force.

That made everything click for me, and I mentally amended the second line from:

There's only one God and he's not just above
There's only one woman and there's only one love

to

There's only one God and She's not just above
There's only one woman and there's only one love

To give it the innate symmetry I felt the engendered deserved and proceeded from there, finding out as much as I could about this concept - most of which I found in Hinduism, Buddhism, and Taoism, as well as some in Sufism and Gnosticism.

Since then, structured contemplation in line with the agamas has caused me to, in contemplation of the male and female subtle forms, the linga (phallus) which interpenetrates all things, the yoni which encompasses all thing, mutually present in the heart of all subjects and objects, has opened realms of conscious that felt like experiencing, by the union of a single male and female deity, unions of countless deities in countless worlds in countless universes arrayed around them.

This is not a union that required my involvement on an egoic level. I didn't have to do anything, no volition necessary, it was already happening and its participants, the cosmic deities, allowed me the grace of being them by seeing them.

Hope this is helpful to someone.

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Thank you for sharing your story.

Gjallarhorn said:

One was simply meditating on the kuji-in (mudras that the hand seals of Naruto were based on). Another was a Hellenic variant on the Lesser Banishing Ritual of the Pentagram. Both completely different paradigms, with different functions.

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Ah that reminds me I need to catch up on that manga.

When you say meditating on the kuji-in, do you mean like being in intense focus? Did both of these rituals revolve around intently focusing on something?

Penumbra said:

Ah that reminds me I need to catch up on that manga.

When you say meditating on the kuji-in, do you mean like being in intense focus? Did both of these rituals revolve around intently focusing on something?

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Probably, though for the LBRP I can't seem to pin down what the focus was. It wasn't nearly as simple as just sitting and chanting a (due to my lack of knowledge of Sanskrit) gibberish mantra while holding my hands in a funny position.

Sunstone said:

If I ever were to have a mystical experience, I would never willingly discuss it publicly. But from what I have read about mystical experiences -- about the science of them -- it is still not certain what reliably causes them.

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As far as i'm concerned

the only thing that could ever be considered a mystical experience would only be percieved as such.


the mind is weak, and the eye is weaker.

Penumbra said:

Altered states of consciousness seem to be a common aspect to religion. Sometimes religion attracts believers due to promises about the afterlife or by simply being the cultural status quo, but other times, powerful subjective experiences lead a person to convert to a religion or stay with a religion.

The nature of these types of experience seem to differ substantially from person to person, and seem to be brought on by various ways from prayer, or meditation, or dancing, or substances, or rituals, or hypnosis, or trauma, or out of nowhere. Some of them are measurable. Some of them can occur to non-religious people as well. They seem to occur to people of various levels of intelligence, knowledge, cultural background, personality type, etc. They also seem to have occurred stretching far back into prehistory.

Altered states of consciousness are a foreign concept to me, except for the standard sleep vs. wakefulness cycle. I don't really understand altered states of consciousness, apart from reading scientific literature, but it does seem that a majority of people have had some type of this at some point.

Have you experienced any sort of religious or secular altered state of consciousness, like a mystical experience, or union with deities, or hypnosis, or a trance of some sort? If so, for what purpose did you seek it (if you sought it at all), what was it like, is it replicable, and in what way do you interpret it?

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percieved states of consciousness, sums it up sadly.

a combination of imagination tied to emotion, after trying to trip the brain up from a weakened state.

Its why people that are up and walking around and alert, never have anything other to percieve then being conscious.

As a note, since I have received more than one PM from members who have wished to share their stories via PM instead of in the thread, I added a note at the bottom of the OP saying that if you feel more comfortable sharing your story in a private message, then that is welcomed as well.

outhouse said:

percieved states of consciousness, sums it up sadly.

a combination of imagination tied to emotion, after trying to trip the brain up from a weakened state.

Its why people that are up and walking around and alert, never have anything other to percieve then being conscious.

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Consciousness is perception. A "perceived state of consciousness" is consciousness, and therefore a state of consciousness.

Some experiences reported by people, are not simply imagined stories. They're perceptions so powerful that they can motivate a person to follow a given religion for life, or to take up meditation, or to change careers, etc.

Some states can be measured. Like observing brain waves, or by observing activity in the parietal lobe of the brain. Unfortunately, the only types that can generally be scientifically observed are ones that are brought up at will, rather than the typically more powerful ones that seem to occur spontaneously.

When I was about 19 I moved from the foothills of the rockies, where I grew up, to the West Coast, after traveling for several months in Europe on on my own. Traveling had given me a taste for my own company, and at the time I was busking for a living so had no fixed schedule. I lived near the sea, in an area where there were many small, secluded pockets of beach. I often woke up feeling like going to the beach and just sitting there, and I very often did, in my own private pocket of stones, driftwood and sand. I just sat there and gazed out at the sea. As time passed I found myself sitting there for longer and longer. One day I sat there for so long that the tide came in and went back out again, taking some of my stuff with it. I wasn't trying to do anything, like meditate, I just liked thinking nothing and gazing or at the sea. It was peaceful. I liked having no thoughts, only sensations. The smell of the air, the sound of the waves and the gulls, the caress of a gentle breeze.

On one of these occasions I had a kind of a vision. The sea was infused with light, and the light was life itself. It filled me, the sea, and every living and non-living thing around me to varying degrees. That metaphor was filled with meaning for me and became the foundation of my perception of reality. I felt like I knew a heck of a lot about what that light was from the very instant I perceived it, and in the subsequent weeks, additional layers of significance and meaning would unfold.

I won't bother getting into the details of what it meant to me because it's subjective and boring, but I hope I've given you a little window into my experience.

outhouse said:

the mind is weak, and the eye is weaker.

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The problem is that the mind is much more powerful than we can be conscious of. Once we can understand the issue we are able to tap into its potential.

Penumbra said:

Altered states of consciousness seem to be a common aspect to religion. Sometimes religion attracts believers due to promises about the afterlife or by simply being the cultural status quo, but other times, powerful subjective experiences lead a person to convert to a religion or stay with a religion.

The nature of these types of experience seem to differ substantially from person to person, and seem to be brought on by various ways from prayer, or meditation, or dancing, or substances, or rituals, or hypnosis, or trauma, or out of nowhere. Some of them are measurable. Some of them can occur to non-religious people as well. They seem to occur to people of various levels of intelligence, knowledge, cultural background, personality type, etc. They also seem to have occurred stretching far back into prehistory.

Altered states of consciousness are a foreign concept to me, except for the standard sleep vs. wakefulness cycle. I don't really understand altered states of consciousness, apart from reading scientific literature, but it does seem that a majority of people have had some type of this at some point.

Have you experienced any sort of religious or secular altered state of consciousness, like a mystical experience, or union with deities, or hypnosis, or a trance of some sort? If so, for what purpose did you seek it (if you sought it at all), what was it like, is it replicable, and in what way do you interpret it?

Edit: While posting in the thread is the easiest method, if you'd prefer to share your story over a private message, that is welcomed as well. A few members have contacted me via PM regarding this thread, wishing to share their story there instead of publicly.

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Sure, plenty of times. I've done various kinds of Kabbalistic meditation to achieve trance states (with several notable successes), and when I was younger, I did three vision quests with the aid of fasting purification and natural hallucinogens.

In the vision quests, the one that was strongest, and had the most "visions" was the one I did with a combo of mescaline and opium. Some amazing visions, very intense, and it was the one I did with most intent of seeking. At that time in my life I was not observing Judaism, and was trying to decide what I should be, how I should structure my life in terms of a framework of spiritual development and moral behavior. I vision quested with the aim in mind of seeking answers to those questions. I didn't really find any final answers, but it cleared a lot of things up for me, even just in terms of what to avoid. My friend and I fasted for three days, went out to the wilderness, took the peyote, smoked the opium, and tripped hard. It was definitely one of the times I really felt like I wasn't just enjoying some mental special effects, but that (as Huxley put it) the doors of perception had opened, and I was able to interact with the world at a different level, and seek wisdom from supernatural sources.

I don't feel comfortable sharing more specific details about that one, though you can PM me if you're really interested.

The other two vision quests were with the aid of some very potent shrooms and a little good weed. These were way less intense, but were very helpful. One was in the countryside, one in town, both with the same friend, with the aim of trying to get any kind of sense of the energy of the divine in the world.

I felt an incredible sense of connection to everything. It was an amazing sense of comprehending how everything, living and nonliving, was joined by the thread of a common energy that whispered through the world like a pulse beat, and at the same time understanding that what I felt was the merest shadow, the most surface of shallow beginnings, of what really underlay the universe as we usually perceive it. It was like pulling back a curtain enough to see the shadow cast by someone standing on the other side, enough of a shadow to realize that they were absolutely huge. And yet I felt something that transcended the usual euphoria of such trips: a sense of being loved, of being touched by tolerant amusement and affection. I felt like I could sense that God knew what I was doing, and appreciated the sentiment, in the way that we are both amused by and appreciative of sometimes reckless childish enthusiasm in the very young.

The Kabbalistic meditation came much later, after considerable growth and study on my part, and without the aid of substances. Unless you count light fasting and trance music as a substance. I use a free-flowing combination of pranayama breath work, Kabbalistic mantra meditation, and deep visualization. Mostly I do it for inner peace and balance, but if I go long enough, I can usually make it to a light trance state. What I've perceived using this method has been different at different times, but it is always a sense of joyful closeness, of perceiving the warmth of divine presence as though separated by just a light screen or curtain. And as for the rest of what I perceived, I'm not sure I can put that into English words: it needs the language of Kabbalah.

But, again, I'm happy to try and go into more detail if you like.

Paul Rusco said:

I've heard a lot about (and am currently trying to engage in) Lucid Dreaming, if that's what you're on about?

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Haha, thats awesome. I was into that at one point. I read a book about it by Stephen LaBerge and his techniques were really good. The best lucid dreaming moment I had was when I was in a kind of cave with a tall cliff wall in front of me. At that moment I became lucid and decided to kind of jump/float over it. I flew! It was awesome, one of the best things Ive ever experienced.

I havn't been doing it much lately, but that would be great to get into it again and get better and better at it.

Are you having any success? Have you had a lucid dream yet?

Levite said:

Sure, plenty of times. I've done various kinds of Kabbalistic meditation to achieve trance states (with several notable successes), and when I was younger, I did three vision quests with the aid of fasting purification and natural hallucinogens

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I read somewhere that people who take mushrooms have approximately a 40% chance to have a religious experience - its probably more or less the same for other hallucinogens. If anyone is looking for an altered state of consiousness, thats probably the most powerful way to go about it - for good or worse.

I highly recommend against it

A member sent this via PM and gave permission to post it anonymously.

The earth beneath your feet is gone. All that you ever knew or loved, gone.
All around you is the universe.

And you are.

Most people would panic; I think so anyway.

As the vision ended, I could feel myself waking. I resisted. Even covered my eyes.

Since then all I really want to do is go home.

The words fail, but have no other way to say it.

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Penumbra said:

A member sent this via PM and gave permission to post it anonymously.

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Stephen?

Anonymously. Could be anyone.

Let's not play guess the anonymous poster.

Alceste said:

When I was about 19 I moved from the foothills of the rockies, where I grew up, to the West Coast, after traveling for several months in Europe on on my own. Traveling had given me a taste for my own company, and at the time I was busking for a living so had no fixed schedule. I lived near the sea, in an area where there were many small, secluded pockets of beach. I often woke up feeling like going to the beach and just sitting there, and I very often did, in my own private pocket of stones, driftwood and sand. I just sat there and gazed out at the sea. As time passed I found myself sitting there for longer and longer. One day I sat there for so long that the tide came in and went back out again, taking some of my stuff with it. I wasn't trying to do anything, like meditate, I just liked thinking nothing and gazing or at the sea. It was peaceful. I liked having no thoughts, only sensations. The smell of the air, the sound of the waves and the gulls, the caress of a gentle breeze.

On one of these occasions I had a kind of a vision. The sea was infused with light, and the light was life itself. It filled me, the sea, and every living and non-living thing around me to varying degrees. That metaphor was filled with meaning for me and became the foundation of my perception of reality. I felt like I knew a heck of a lot about what that light was from the very instant I perceived it, and in the subsequent weeks, additional layers of significance and meaning would unfold.

I won't bother getting into the details of what it meant to me because it's subjective and boring, but I hope I've given you a little window into my experience.

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Thanks for sharing.

Kind of left me on a cliffhanger there. Where did you instantly feel the light was coming from, if you don't mind sharing?

If a theist said it, I wouldn't ask because I'd assume that they'd say god. But from what I understand you don't identify as a theist, so I'm curious as to what you mean when you say that. Is it a taoish or pantheistic concept?

Paul Rusco said:

I've heard a lot about (and am currently trying to engage in) Lucid Dreaming, if that's what you're on about?

Click to expand...

839311 said:

Haha, thats awesome. I was into that at one point. I read a book about it by Stephen LaBerge and his techniques were really good. The best lucid dreaming moment I had was when I was in a kind of cave with a tall cliff wall in front of me. At that moment I became lucid and decided to kind of jump/float over it. I flew! It was awesome, one of the best things Ive ever experienced.

I havn't been doing it much lately, but that would be great to get into it again and get better and better at it.

Are you having any success? Have you had a lucid dream yet?

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I spent quite a bit of time trying to lucid dream before, since the descriptions sound pretty fun, but I could never get it to work.

Penumbra said:

I spent quite a bit of time trying to lucid dream before, since the descriptions sound pretty fun, but I could never get it to work.

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Here's how you do it.

Dream state has body chemistry involved. You have to use it to your advantage.

Preferably in the morning as you are already rested.....lay still.
Pick a day when you are sure you don't have a schedule, and the need to move won't be there.

Close your eyes and consider more sleeping.
The actually state of sleep is lessened because you already did that.

Remain still!...absolutely important!
Dream cycles include body chemistry that stops you from moving.
If you move, your body will shut off the dream cycle.

There is a condition in a few adults called...pavor nocturnum....night terrors.
While in a dream state they arise and respond to their dreams.
All too often the trouble is associated with bad dreams.
Bad dreams make us want to get up and run...some people do.
Pavor nocturnum is not what you are seeking, and is not a controlled event.
Such things happen because that persons chemistry is faulted.
And that condition could be dangerous.

It is noted....All children suffer pavor nocturnum.
We lose the condition as we learn the difference between being awake and sleeping....around the same time we learn our names.

Ever hear a baby scream in the night?....
When first approached...comfort means very little.
An adult with that same condition is likewise.
Approach sleep walkers, carefully.

As for you...
Remain still and 'daydream' about whatever you care to.
When the 'dream' takes an unexpected turn....you're there.

Penumbra said:

Thanks for sharing.

Kind of left me on a cliffhanger there. Where did you instantly feel the light was coming from, if you don't mind sharing?

If a theist said it, I wouldn't ask because I'd assume that they'd say god. But from what I understand you don't identify as a theist, so I'm curious as to what you mean when you say that. Is it a taoish or pantheistic concept?

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Funny you should ask, it never even occurred to me to wonder where it came "from". The fascinating aspect of it was how beautiful it was, how it infused everything, showing me that my "self" was not an island, but a ripple on the sea. I suppose you could say I perceived that light as the "from". It seemed to be raw potentiality, particularly for emergent life. I hadn't been exposed to Taoism before this, but I read the Tao te Ching afterwards and this concept made particular sense to me in the light of that experience:


There is something formlessly created Born before Heaven and Earth So silent! So ethereal! Independent and changeless Circulating and ceaseless It can be regarded as the mother of the world

I do not know its name Identifying it, I call it "Tao" Forced to describe it, I call it great



And when I say "made sense", I don't mean "gave me an explanation". I mean it seemed to me that whoever wrote that had experienced something very similar to what I had experienced, and interpreted it in a similar way.