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How many times did Jesus die?

Popeyesays

Well-Known Member
Cordoba said:
Each person is responsible for his or her good or bad deeds.

From a Muslim point of view, nobody can take responsibility for the acts of others.

God forgives all sins, because He is The Most Merciful.
He does not need Jesus peace be upon him to die in order to forgive mankind.
I think the key of that verse of the Qur'an is that God took His spirit up from the cross and left the body where it was. Flesh is dust.

By looking at it this way, one can reconcile the Qur'an and the Gospel without insulting either.

There were two resurrections and the really, truly critical resurrection was that resurrection of faith within the followers of Christ after a few days of confusion and despair.

Regards,
Scott
 

Ernestine

Member
Jesus died once. He was dead for 3 days after which he was raised a spirit by Jehovah God. The Qur'an and the Bible cannot be reconciled. When Jesus was on earth he had respect for the Bible which he preached as the single source of God's word. He quoted the Bible as the final authority on matters. Never did he try to downgrade the Bible but instead condemned those who tried to weaken its force with their own teachings.
 

Popeyesays

Well-Known Member
Ernestine said:
Jesus died once. He was dead for 3 days after which he was raised a spirit by Jehovah God. The Qur'an and the Bible cannot be reconciled. When Jesus was on earth he had respect for the Bible which he preached as the single source of God's word. He quoted the Bible as the final authority on matters. Never did he try to downgrade the Bible but instead condemned those who tried to weaken its force with their own teachings.
Neither did Muhammed ever downplay or deny the truth of Christ or Moses, if you might recall. The Qur'an and Muhammed did not exist at the time of Jesus, it was 620 odd years later.

"Reality is not divisible; it does not admit multiplicity. All the holy Manifestations of God have proclaimed and promulgated the same reality. They have summoned mankind to reality itself and reality is one. The clouds and mists of imitations have obscured the Sun of Truth. We must forsake these imitations, dispel these clouds and mists and free the Sun from the darkness of superstition. Then will the Sun of Truth shine most gloriously; then all the inhabitants of the world will be united, the religions will be one, sects and denominations will reconcile, all nationalities will flow together in the recognition of one Fatherhood and all degrees of humankind gather in the shelter of the same tabernacle, under the same banner."
(Abdu'l-Baha, Baha'i World Faith - Abdu'l-Baha Section, p. 256)

We are all brothers, like it or not.


Regards,
Scott
 

Popeyesays

Well-Known Member
Binyamin said:
How many people believe Isaiah 53 to be talking about Jesus?
The TaNakh does not have chapters in Isaiah, does it?. The 53rd chapter of Isaiah is usually considered to be a continuation of the Servant Song begun in Chapter 52, right?

So most Jews consider this to be a reference to the nation of Israel rather than to the Messiah - at least in modern terms.

I personally think it has more than one addressee and more than one reference to "Israel" and the Messiah. Actually, I believe much of it is also a reference to Baha`u'llah, but that isn't here nor there in this particular discussion.

Baha`i Faith and the Holy Land: http://www.capital.net/~bahai/schenectadybahai/haifa.html

Regards,
Scott
 

SoyLeche

meh...
Ernestine said:
Jesus died once. He was dead for 3 days after which he was raised a spirit by Jehovah God. The Qur'an and the Bible cannot be reconciled. When Jesus was on earth he had respect for the Bible which he preached as the single source of God's word. He quoted the Bible as the final authority on matters. Never did he try to downgrade the Bible but instead condemned those who tried to weaken its force with their own teachings.
[for a different thread if you like] When and where? [/for a different thread if you like]
 

Popeyesays

Well-Known Member
standing_on_one_foot said:
So...he didn't die a second time, then? What happened to his body?
Most Christians will say He was taken up bodily into heaven like Elijah.

I figure: "who cares?".

Regards,
Scott
 

Bangbang

Active Member
Jesus died in the flesh for our sins according to the bible. Christians would be horrified if he has died since then. I mean.....he is God right? Why would anyone think he died more than once?
 

Deut 13:1

Well-Known Member
Bangbang said:
Jesus died in the flesh for our sins according to the bible. Christians would be horrified if he has died since then. I mean.....he is God right? Why would anyone think he died more than once?
Well the reason I ask, is because Christians keep telling me that Jesus is Messiach and they tell me to look at Isaiah 53, so I do, and it says with his deaths, so I was wondering how many deaths he has, but if you say 1, then isaiah 53 can't be talking about him, so as a Jew, I'm still fine. Thanks.
 

Joshua

New Member
The Bible altogether is telling a story and there are to many gaps in it to take it literally. Your ways of incapsulating certian parts of the Bible is probably the very reason how we have so many religions or belife systems in this world today. Im not saying its wrong to question things at all but you will never understand the details of something without seeking His guidance first (Seek first the Kingdom). Do not seek from others.
 

joeboonda

Well-Known Member
My bible in Isaiah 53 doesn't say he had deaths plural, but maybe I have a bad translation, after all it is the KJV, but what did they know? Jesus died once for all and is seated at the right hand of God making intercession for his saints.
 

Katzpur

Not your average Mormon
Binyamin said:
Well the reason I ask, is because Christians keep telling me that Jesus is Messiach and they tell me to look at Isaiah 53, so I do, and it says with his deaths, so I was wondering how many deaths he has, but if you say 1, then isaiah 53 can't be talking about him, so as a Jew, I'm still fine. Thanks.
So far, I haven't been able to make an ounce of sense out of what you've said. In reading Isaiah 53, I only found the actual word "death" twice. Once was in verse 9: "And he made his grave with the wicked, and with the rich in his death; because he had done no violence, neither was any deceit in his mouth." The other was in verse 12: "Therefore will I divide him a portion with the great, and he shall divide the spoil with the strong; because he hath poured out his soul unto death..."

So, before we go on to discuss this, it would be very helpful if you were to state which verse you are referring to.
 

Deut 13:1

Well-Known Member
Katzpur said:
So far, I haven't been able to make an ounce of sense out of what you've said. In reading Isaiah 53, I only found the actual word "death" twice. Once was in verse 9: "And he made his grave with the wicked, and with the rich in his death; because he had done no violence, neither was any deceit in his mouth." The other was in verse 12: "Therefore will I divide him a portion with the great, and he shall divide the spoil with the strong; because he hath poured out his soul unto death..."

So, before we go on to discuss this, it would be very helpful if you were to state which verse you are referring to.
Verse 9
 

Deut 13:1

Well-Known Member
joeboonda said:
My bible in Isaiah 53 doesn't say he had deaths plural, but maybe I have a bad translation, after all it is the KJV, but what did they know? Jesus died once for all and is seated at the right hand of God making intercession for his saints.
Okay, so you agree Isaiah 53 isn't about him. You believe he died once, and Isaiah 53 talks about multiple deaths, which invalidates him. Thanks.
 

may

Well-Known Member
Binyamin said:
How many people believe Isaiah 53 to be talking about Jesus?
yes i do
Among the Hebrew prophecies of the Messiah, perhaps none provide a clearer picture than that recorded at Isaiah 52:13–53:12. Over 700 years in advance, Isaiah described, not the physical appearance of the Messiah, but details that were more significant—the purpose and manner of his suffering and specifics about his death, burial, and exaltation

 

Deut 13:1

Well-Known Member
may said:
yes i do
Among the Hebrew prophecies of the Messiah, perhaps none provide a clearer picture than that recorded at Isaiah 52:13–53:12. Over 700 years in advance, Isaiah described, not the physical appearance of the Messiah, but details that were more significant—the purpose and manner of his suffering and specifics about his death, burial, and exaltation

The problem with that is Isaiah 53 talks about deathS, not a single death. So you agree it isn't about Jesus? Cool.
 

may

Well-Known Member
Binyamin said:
The problem with that is Isaiah 53 talks about deathS, not a single death. So you agree it isn't about Jesus? Cool.

He was despised and was avoided by men, a man meant for pains and for having acquaintance with sickness. And there was as if the concealing of one’s face from us. He was despised, and we held HIM as of no account. 4 Truly our sicknesses were what HE himself carried; and as for our pains, HE bore them. But we ourselves accounted HIM as plagued, stricken by God and afflicted. 5 But HE was being pierced for our transgression; HE was being crushed for our errors. The chastisement meant for our peace was upon HIM, and because of HIS wounds there has been a healing for us. 6 Like sheep we have all of us wandered about; it was each one to his own way that we have turned; and Jehovah himself has caused the error of us all to meet up with that ONE. 7 HE was hard pressed, and HE was letting himself be afflicted; yet HE would not open HIS mouth. HE was being brought just like a sheep to the slaughtering; and like a ewe that before her shearers has become mute, HE also would not open his mouth............ isaiah 53; Yes that sounds like Jesus to me

 
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