The Truth,
Now on to your next to last reply:
First thing, how is it that something some man said on a web site proves anything about the Bible or the even Quran for that matter? Am I supposed to believe the things that you say just because you can find a web site somewhere that says it too? Sorry, I was born at night but it wasnt last night!
Second thing, the very same web sites also say the Bible teaches the Trinity, we both know that is wrong, so how can you or I believe anything they say about the Bible? Please explain that one to me.
Let me borrow a quote from one of my posts in the other thread:
Perhaps one thing that Christians and Muslims can agree upon is that the Devil does not want Gods guidance to reach man. Therefore, it is reasonable to assume that Satan and his cohorts, including so-called Christians and so-called Muslims, would try to have the Holy Scriptures corrupted so that mankind might be misled and turned away from God. Over the centuries, various individuals have tried to add to certain verses. But did they succeed in corrupting Gods words? Would God allow them to do so? No! Throughout the Scriptures, he affirms that he would preserve his words. The green grass has dried up, the blossom has withered; but as for the word of our God, it will last to time indefinite, says Isaiah 40:8. (See also 1 Peter 1:24, 25.) Likewise, the Quran says: There is none that can alter the Words (and Decrees) of God. (Al-Anam [6]:34) Thus, all attempts to change Gods words have failed because it is inconceivable that God would permit any manipulation of his books.
Third thing, I thought we established it at the very beginning that just as all those Muslims going around killing other Muslims and killing all the innocent by-standers and attacking schools full of school children do not accurately represent what you say the Quran teaches there are also many so-called Christians that really do not represent the Bible, is that not what we agreed to? So why do you now try to bring what they say into this discussion? Should I respond by going to look for some outrageously radical Islamic site to get quotes from about what the Quran teaches? Should I go out to the web and find a site written by Muslims that have turned apostate and that put out all kinds of garbage about the Quran and Muslims? That is what you are doing to me! Would it not be better that I stay on the sites you recommended because they, according to you, correctly present what you believe? Would you like me to recommend a web site for you to read that correctly presents what I believe? And if I did would you bother to go read it?
Now lets see what is really said in those verses:
(Psalm 147:1, 13, 20) Praise Jah, you people, For it is good to make melody to our God; For it is pleasantpraise is fitting.
13 For he has made the bars of your gates strong; He has blessed your sons in the midst of you.
20 He has not done that way to any other nation; And as for [his] judicial decisions, they have not known them. Praise Jah, you people!
The opening and closing verses of that Psalm clearly show that it is addressed to people. The reference to Jerusalem and Zion are simply figures of speech, you know things like metaphor, simile, and hyperbole, that add life and color to poetry, so it is not the city Jerusalem being addressed it is the people and the sons mentioned are the sons of the people. So where do you see sons = servants?
(Proverbs 1:8-10) Listen, my son, to the discipline of your father, and do not forsake the law of your mother. 9 For they are a wreath of attractiveness to your head and a fine necklace to your throat. 10 My son, if sinners try to seduce you, do not consent.
Again, we find that son = male offspring and not son = servant. Do we see a pattern developing here?
The remainder (I did not read them all because you ask me to hurry and answer) seems to refer mostly to spirit creatures that are in fact the offspring of God and who have God as their father or progenitor.
OK, I am still waiting for all these many scriptures where son = servant rather than son = male offspring.
The Truth, et.al., please do not throw garbage you find laying around on the web at me. Please backup what you say.
Opps! I just reread your post and find I miss read it to say hurry rather than what it really said not in a hurry.
So, I read all those verses and they either refer to the spirit sons of God, again son = offspring and not son = servant, or they refer the nation of Israel, who were sons = offspring of God in a double sense. First in the same sense that we all owe our life to the Creatortherefore he is our Father. Second the sons of Jacob (Israel) owed there very existence to God in a way that hit closer to home because it was by the miracle birth of Isaac that they were eventually produced. Also the nation of Israel had been saved by God from Egypt and Pharaoh, and from the nations surrounding it that would have destroyed them if they could have and Israel owed him their life as a nation of people chosen to produce the seed and to be the main but not only worshippers of God, at least at that time.
There was only one scripture out of all those scriptures where a good argument could be made that sons = servants: (Psalm 82:1-7)God is stationing himself in the assembly of the Divine One; In the middle of the gods he judges: How long will you keep on judging with injustice And showing partiality to the wicked themselves? 3 Be judges for the lowly one and the fatherless boy. To the afflicted one and the one of little means do justice. 4 Provide escape for the lowly one and the poor one; Out of the hand of the wicked ones deliver [them]. 5 They have not known, and they do not understand; In darkness they keep walking about; All the foundations of the earth are made to totter. 6 I myself have said, You are gods, And all of you are sons of the Most High. 7 Surely you will die just as men do; And like any one of the princes you will fall! Also it can be argued quite effectively that even here the definition of son = offspring will work just as well.
So all that work was done for one scripture that can go either way while all the rest clearly mean son = offspring and not son = servant. But that isnt the worst of it! You and Qabandi are making all this fuss about the fact that son = servant in the Hebrew languageonly one problem Jesus is called son of God in the Greek language used in the Greek Scriptures portion of the Bible. Oh well!
Now let me finish by pointing out that when one relies totally on the Bible and what it really says there are no mysteries! Amos 3:7, BBE, Certainly the Lord [Jehovah] will do nothing without making clear his secret to his servants, the prophets. So all those poor men that have wondered who is referred to in Genesis 6:1-2 had to do to find out was read the Bible and let it explain itself:
(Job 1:6) Now it came to be the day when the sons of the [true] God entered to take their station before Jehovah, and even Satan proceeded to enter right among them.
(Job 38:7) When the morning stars joyfully cried out together, And all the sons of God began shouting in applause?
(1 Peter 3:19-20) In this [state] also he went his way and preached to the spirits in prison, 20 who had once been disobedient when the patience of God was waiting in Noahs days, while the ark was being constructed, in which a few people, that is, eight souls, were carried safely through the water.
(2 Peter 2:4) Certainly if God did not hold back from punishing the angels that sinned, but, by throwing them into Tar´ta·rus, delivered them to pits of dense darkness to be reserved for judgment;
(Jude 6) And the angels that did not keep their original position but forsook their own proper dwelling place he has reserved with eternal bonds under dense darkness for the judgment of the great day.
The truth of the matter is that if you do not want to understand the Bible, you wont, but if you do, you will.
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