Preaching Against Other Religions vs. Teaching Your Own

SoyLeche · Aug 3, 2005

DeepShadow said:
I agree, Jonny, but here's a counterweight: how many times in Sunday School have you heard fellow LDS take to bashing other churches? I find it pretty hypocritical, and I've said so whenever I've had the chance.

We have our differences, sure, but there's a huge difference between saying, "We don't believe X, and here's why," and saying, "Oh, those stupid (insert denomination here), I'm so glad we don't believe in X!"

I think the main difference between this and what Jonny was talking about is that this type of comment is not the main text of the discussion. I can't remember ever having a lesson in an LDS church-type setting that had the main purpose of tearing down another religion. Also, anti-other church comments usually come from the congregation, and not from the teacher or discussion leader. For some reason, though, there appear to be organized lessons with the purpose of tearing down the LDS church. I haven't seen this against other churches, but I admit to being a bit naive to the topic. Has anyone seen this phenomenon against any church other than the LDS?

Katzpur · Aug 3, 2005

jonny said:
This is kinda off topic, but imagine seeing this on your way to church... It sure makes me want to convert!

http://www.fairlds.org/apol/antis/200404gc.html
http://www.fairlds.org/apol/antis/2004mesa.html
http://www.fairlds.org/apol/antis/streetpreachers.html

I quit attending our general conference because I was sick of being yelled at on my way to worship. Luckily, I can still watch it on TV. I know that some of those protesters a Christian preachers.

I know how you feel, Jonny. It's hard to ignore these guys, too. They're SO obnoxious! But you know what? I kind of feel like their antics reflect more negatively on them than they do on us. Maybe we should thank them for the free advertising.

Pah · Aug 3, 2005

It would be no surprise to any of you that I have not seen bashing from the pulpit - but I have seen other boards where LDS, JW and Catholics were bashed unmercifully. A Satanist was unheard of and a Wiccan was quickly ostricized. I didn't know a place like this existed.

I certianly have my differences with all that have a faith, but I recognize that in each one's humanity, faith may well be the core of the individual's self. It's not always apparent in my posting but that recognition demands my respect.

Another problem I encounter is the attribution of my enforcing RF rules of civility to an Atheistic end. This board, it should be emphasized again, is run by the staff as close to unbiased as we can get. We don't tolerate bringing faith into moderator decisions.

I'm afraid I got side tracked from the topic - sorry

Bob

Katzpur · Aug 3, 2005

Pah said:
It would be no surprise to any of you that I have not seen bashing from the pulpit - but I have seen other boards where LDS, JW and Catholics were bashed unmercifully. A Satanist was unheard of and a Wiccan was quickly ostricized. I didn't know a place like this existed.

I certianly have my differences with all that have a faith, but I recognize that in each one's humanity, faith may well be the core of the individual's self. It's not always apparent in my posting but that recognition demands my respect.

Another problem I encounter is the attribution of my enforcing RF rules of civility to an Atheistic end. This board, it should be emphasized again, is run by the staff as close to unbiased as we can get. We don't tolerate bringing faith into moderator decisions.

I'm afraid I got side tracked from the topic - sorry

Bob

But you know what the weirdest thing of all is (at least to me)? Almost all of the Mormon-bashing comes from our fellow-Christians! I seldom hear a Wiccan or a pagan or even an atheist voice really strong negative opinions towards the Latter-day Saints. It almost always comes from other Christians.

DeepShadow · Aug 3, 2005

SoyLeche said:
I think the main difference between this and what Jonny was talking about is that this type of comment is not the main text of the discussion. I can't remember ever having a lesson in an LDS church-type setting that had the main purpose of tearing down another religion. Also, anti-other church comments usually come from the congregation, and not from the teacher or discussion leader.

That's true, I've never heard such comments being the focus of a lesson, nor do I recall ever hearing such a comment from the pulpit (although with a lay ministry, there's always the possibility!)

I didn't mean to sidetrack things, I just wanted to focus on the part that I have control over. I can't stop people from jumping up and down outside our temples screaming "House of the Devil," (yes, I was there for that one; I was twelve, and it really upset me). I can't stop people from showing Godmakers as part of "cult awareness week" at their church. I like to focus on what I can change, which is how I speak of other churches, even ones I've had bad experiences with.

I'd also like to say that after coming to Religiousforums, it's been a lot easier not to speak of other churches in generalizations.

There. I now return you to your regularly scheduled thread.

Pah · Aug 3, 2005

Katzpur said:
But you know what the weirdest thing of all is (at least to me)? Almost all of the Mormon-bashing comes from our fellow-Christians! I seldom hear a Wiccan or a pagan or even an atheist voice really strong negative opinions towards the Latter-day Saints. It almost always comes from other Christians.

I have to admit, in my first days on the other boards, I was going to correct all those faults with Chrisitanity. It took about three months to change and happened as I made friends with Christians. In fact, the reversal had gone so well, that I was elected the first member of the year in running against one of that "disgruntled" Christians.

It's been my experience too that Christians are the more hostile to diverse bits of faith in other Christians. But a liberal Atheist was always a good target.

greatcalgarian · Aug 3, 2005

Pah said:
I have to admit, in my first days on the other boards, I was going to correct all those faults with Chrisitanity. It took about three months to change and happened as I made friends with Christians. In fact, the reversal had gone so well, that I was elected the first member of the year in running against one of that "disgruntled" Christians.

It's been my experience too that Christians are the more hostile to diverse bits of faith in other Christians. But a liberal Atheist was always a good target.

Most atheists are kind, tolerant, and patient people, who respected other people religious belief:bounce . Whereas fundamental Christians or Evangelical Christians tends to be a bit over zealous in spreading the good news

. They may think that an atheist can still be saved, since he/she still have to see "faith",

KirbyFan101 · Aug 3, 2005

greatcalgarian said:
Most atheists are kind, tolerant, and patient people, who respected other people religious belief:bounce .

You should see an athiest forum. Its the absolute worst kind of forum. Bar none.

greatcalgarian · Aug 4, 2005

KirbyFan101 said:
You should see an athiest forum. Its the absolute worst kind of forum. Bar none.

May be I should say, most atheists in this RF :bounce

Apotheosis · Aug 4, 2005

Athiests forums arnt all that bad, but if you go into one and attempt to preach, be careful, because usually it annoys them, and then they will have a bit of fun picking apart your faith, pointing out all of the problems in it, and most religous folks who go into an athiest forum and preach, are pretty ignorant, and as such they cannot defend their religion very well. So if you go into a athiest forum, be very well prepared, and do not preach.

As for teaching your own faith, or preaching against others, just teach what you believe, and let others bring up the differences between your belief and others. There is no need to outline the differences, if your religion believes that after death we become pink bunnies, no one will mistake you for a christan.

michel · Aug 4, 2005

Pah said:
It would be no surprise to any of you that I have not seen bashing from the pulpit - but I have seen other boards where LDS, JW and Catholics were bashed unmercifully. A Satanist was unheard of and a Wiccan was quickly ostricized. I didn't know a place like this existed.

I certianly have my differences with all that have a faith, but I recognize that in each one's humanity, faith may well be the core of the individual's self. It's not always apparent in my posting but that recognition demands my respect.

Another problem I encounter is the attribution of my enforcing RF rules of civility to an Atheistic end. This board, it should be emphasized again, is run by the staff as close to unbiased as we can get. We don't tolerate bringing faith into moderator decisions.

I'm afraid I got side tracked from the topic - sorry

Bob

Well, Pah, from what I have seen you need have no fear of being seen as being prejudiced in any way - and that is you, as a person; it is in your character. I am reasonably easy going - heck, I have to be (I am the only one to believe in the importance of religion in my day to day life in all my close family) - that tends to make me 'impervious' - unless I am suffering from a bad night - of course, when I can sometimes let things get a bit too close for comfort!

Generally though, I am O.K with what anyone else thinks - that's up to them.

I am dismayed though, by Kathryn's post - I have noticed that her Church seems to be a punch bag - and that is very sad, and I have very little patience for those intollerant of other's beliefs; after all, that is the teaching of love, in my mind - and Love is tollerance - to be picked on by other Christians makes me wonder at the faith of the bashers......

jonny · Aug 4, 2005

Katzpur said:
But you know what the weirdest thing of all is (at least to me)? Almost all of the Mormon-bashing comes from our fellow-Christians! I seldom hear a Wiccan or a pagan or even an atheist voice really strong negative opinions towards the Latter-day Saints. It almost always comes from other Christians.

This is true, but I don't think that preaching lies about other faiths is confined to Christianity. For example, I believe that many of the problems in the Middle East are a result of what is preached about Christians and Jews in the Mosques.

michel · Aug 4, 2005

jonny said:
This is true, but I don't think that preaching lies about other faiths is confined to Christianity. For example, I believe that many of the problems in the Middle East are a result of what is preached about Christians and Jews in the Mosques.

Huh I don't even want to think about that; I'd like to think that Islam is preached purely for the religion, and not as a weapon against other creeds - but I dare say you have a point, sad as it is. The saddest thing is that Islam, as a religion, seems to have been turned into a recruitment tool.............

Sabio · Aug 4, 2005

greatcalgarian said:
Whereas fundamental Christians or Evangelical Christians tends to be a bit over zealous in spreading the good news . They may think that an atheist can still be saved, since he/she still have to see "faith",

Great,

Evangelical Christians are zealous, this is true. This is actually part of our belief system (as taught by Paul the Apostle) to be zealous in sharing our faith.

Galatians 4:18
But it is good to be zealously affected always in a good thing,

And we are instructed to spread the Good News by Jesus:

Matthew 28
18And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.

19Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

20Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

So you see, we evangelicals are zealous in sharing the good news with the lost because its part of our spiritual makeup.

Sabio

michel · Aug 4, 2005

Sabio said:
Great,

Evangelical Christians are zealous, this is true. This is actually part of our belief system (as taught by Paul the Apostle) to be zealous in sharing our faith.

Galatians 4:18
But it is good to be zealously affected always in a good thing,

And we are instructed to spread the Good News by Jesus:

Matthew 28
18And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.

19Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

20Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

So you see, we evangelicals are zealous in sharing the good news with the lost because its part of our spiritual makeup.

Sabio

I agree, Sabio, but there are different ways of 'Spreading the word'; I prefer the subtle approach - and no hard sell!-that I think is where some go badly wrong -

Green Gaia · Aug 4, 2005

jonny said:
Do you think that churches should preach against other churches or stick to teaching what they believe to be true?

Well, for UUs we don't "preach" in the traditional sense of the word. So we do not preach against other religions. In fact, we believe there is wisdom in most, if not all, of the world's religions. We feel each is valuable for what it can tell us about ourselves and our world, and how its members find religious meaning and direction. We are also allowed the freedom to explore other religions and come to our own conclusions about them. As for sticking to teaching what we believe, it is as follows:

We believe in:

The inherent worth and dignity of every person;
Justice, equity, and compassion in human relations;
Acceptance of one another and encouragement to spiritual growth in our congregations;
A free and responsible search for truth and meaning;
The right of conscience and the use of the democratic process within our congregations and in society at large;
The goal of world community with peace, liberty, and justice for all;
Respect for the interdependent web of all existence of which we are a part.

And yes, we stick to teaching those Principles.

Katzpur · Aug 4, 2005

greatcalgarian said:
Most atheists are kind, tolerant, and patient people, who respected other people religious belief:bounce . Whereas fundamental Christians or Evangelical Christians tends to be a bit over zealous in spreading the good news . They may think that an atheist can still be saved, since he/she still have to see "faith",

I don't know that I'd go along with the generalization that "most" atheists are kind, tolerant and patient, but I'd definitely say that, in my experience, they are no less kind, tolerant and patient than your run-of-the-mill God-fearing individual. I've had some very respectful conversations with atheists and have actually had them come to my defense when the harrassment from anti-Mormons got too awfully intense. I've really appreciated that about them.

greatcalgarian · Aug 5, 2005

Katzpur said:
I don't know that I'd go along with the generalization that "most" atheists are kind, tolerant and patient, but I'd definitely say that, in my experience, they are no less kind, tolerant and patient than your run-of-the-mill God-fearing individual. I've had some very respectful conversations with atheists and have actually had them come to my defense when the harrassment from anti-Mormons got too awfully intense. I've really appreciated that about them.

Christian cannot stand the idea of another prophet after Jesus Christ. They like to monopolize Jesus according to the dogma developed around 400AD. Thus Christians have been bashing Muslim, even recruiting the President of United State to help by linking Muslims with Terrorists. Similarly is the mentality of bashing Mormons.

Atheists are humanist, hence they will not allow intolerance to flourish. They 'preach' religious freedom.

Mister Emu · Aug 5, 2005

Christian cannot stand the idea of another prophet after Jesus Christ.

I may be very sceptical of anyone claiming to be a prophet... doesn't mean I can't stand that idea of one existing.

Atheists are humanist, hence they will not allow intolerance to flourish.

Just how did you come to this conclusion?

While I have met many atheists that are some of the most tolerant people I have ever met, tolerance is not nessecarily inherent in athiesm.

Scuba Pete · Aug 6, 2005

You can preach with words...
I choose to preach with my life!

You can badger people into the pews...
I choose to love people into the Kingdom.

Philippians 1:15 It is true that some preach Christ out of envy and rivalry, but others out of goodwill. 16 The latter do so in love, knowing that I am put here for the defense of the gospel. 17 The former preach Christ out of selfish ambition, not sincerely, supposing that they can stir up trouble for me while I am in chains. 18 But what does it matter? The important thing is that in every way, whether from false motives or true, Christ is preached. And because of this I rejoice. NIV

Preaching Against Other Religions vs. Teaching Your Own

meh...

Not your average Mormon

Uber all member

Not your average Mormon

White Crow

Uber all member

Well-Known Member

Resident Ball of Fluff

Well-Known Member

Member

Administrator Emeritus

Well-Known Member

Administrator Emeritus

Active Member

Administrator Emeritus

Veteran Member

Not your average Mormon

Well-Known Member

Emu Extraordinaire

Le plongeur avec attitude...