Why do i have to believe?

Hello all,

I don't follow the bible nor do i believe we were created by a supreme being. I am not here to cause trouble but to try and understand more about religion.

I hear loads of things religion says, then a few years later it changes to suit how we live now. On some web pages loads of people are asking who goes to hell and and who doesnt? Well isnt there a different answer from all these preists and people of the cloth? Why do i have to chose a religion to go somewhere nice when i die? Why do i have to love some man who died many moons ago? When you say were all gods creatures, why? My mum and dad created me not god. I never had a choice.

Someone said if I deny gods love or somthing then i go to hell. Is that true? I might be an alright person who doesnt care about going to heaven but somewhere else.

Why do we have preists and popes? Why are they different to god than any normal person? Why do we pay money in churches when there are more pressing matters in the world. Why do we have churches? Are they just there for the few in local towns of the uk to prey?

When adam and eve were created did god believe in insest?

Just some things that concern me.

hi Dodds,

Well, you sure come in with a handful of questions!

I thought I would like to welcome you to the forum,

You might like to have a look at :- Articles for New Members ; from there, there is a link to the forum rules, which you ought to see.

You might also like to post on:- Are you new to ReligiousForums.com? , so that you can introduce yourself to the members.

I hope you enjoy your time with us.

Dodds® said:

I hear loads of things religion says, then a few years later it changes to suit how we live now.

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Religion is man made and subject to the whim of man. You don't need religion. You need God.

Dodds® said:

Someone said if I deny gods love or somthing then i go to hell. Is that true? I might be an alright person who doesnt care about going to heaven but somewhere else.

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According to the Christian faith, a belief in the divinity of Christ, recognition of his sacrifice and God's Grace are required for salvation.

Dodds® said:

Why do we have preists and popes? Why are they different to god than any normal person? Why do we pay money in churches when there are more pressing matters in the world. Why do we have churches?

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In the order you've asked --
Because it's a man made religion with a need for a hierarchy.
They aren't.
Because the churches need to be supported and have convinced people that they are ignoring God's law if they don't give their money to the church.
Because people are not reading their bible and are relying on what the church elders say so they believe you must be specially ordained to do communion, heal, etc.

Dodds® said:

When adam and eve were created did god believe in insest?

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If the bible is to taken literally, then at one time God "allowed" it in order to populate the earth. However, at some point God no longer allows it:

If a man takes his sister, his father’s daughter or his mother’s daughter, and sees her nakedness and she sees his nakedness, it is a wicked thing. And they shall be cut off in the sight of their people. He has uncovered his sister’s nakedness. He shall bear his guilt.
Leviticus 20:17

Cursed is the one who lies with his sister, the daughter of his father or the daughter of his mother.
Deut. 27:22

Personally, I do not believe in the literal translation of creation, so it's not an issue.

Welcome to RF, and definitely check out the links Michel shared. They are very informative. I'm not a Christian scholar, but I'll share my 2 copper coins.

Dodds® said:

...On some web pages loads of people are asking who goes to hell and and who doesnt? Well isnt there a different answer from all these preists and people of the cloth?...Why do i have to chose a religion to go somewhere nice when i die?...

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Not all Christians believe that people outside their faith go to Hell when they die, but I do realize some of the more vocal ones do.

Dodds® said:

...Why do i have to love some man who died many moons ago?...

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I presume you are referring to Jesus Christ. You don't have to love him or anyone else. That's your choice and a matter of your faith. The Christians that I know believe that he was the Messiah and that he taught us to love everybody.

Dodds® said:

...When you say were all gods creatures, why?...

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Because my belief is that God created each one of us.

Dodds® said:

...Why do we have preists and popes? Why are they different to god than any normal person?...

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I don't think they are 'different' to God as much as they believe that God is calling them to spread His word.

Dodds® said:

...Why do we pay money in churches when there are more pressing matters in the world?...

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Many of these 'pressing matters' are addressed by churches who use peoples donations to help people in many different ways.

Dodds® said:

...Why do we have churches?...

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So people can gather to share expressions of their faith.

Since I've been on RF, I have noticed many people have similar misconceptions about Christians and think that we are this homogenized and monolithic group in which everybody believes the same things. I hope you are sensing a consistancy in my answers that tells you this is not the case.:162: Good luck with your own faith journey where ever it may lead. As long as you ask questions and are willing to accept the answers whether or not they are what you expected, you'll find this site very informative.

Dodds® said:

Hello all,

I don't follow the bible nor do i believe we were created by a supreme being. I am not here to cause trouble but to try and understand more about religion.

I hear loads of things religion says, then a few years later it changes to suit how we live now. On some web pages loads of people are asking who goes to hell and and who doesnt? Well isnt there a different answer from all these preists and people of the cloth? Why do i have to chose a religion to go somewhere nice when i die? Why do i have to love some man who died many moons ago? When you say were all gods creatures, why? My mum and dad created me not god. I never had a choice.

Someone said if I deny gods love or somthing then i go to hell. Is that true? I might be an alright person who doesnt care about going to heaven but somewhere else.

Why do we have preists and popes? Why are they different to god than any normal person? Why do we pay money in churches when there are more pressing matters in the world. Why do we have churches? Are they just there for the few in local towns of the uk to prey?

When adam and eve were created did god believe in insest?

Just some things that concern me.

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The answers to these questions are complex, and cannot sufficiently be addressed here. I suggest you do some research on the history of religion in addition to your discussions here, as they will help much more than reading our half-witted responses to complex questions.

Despite this, I feel compelled to respond to the responses that have surfaced thus far. In recent years, an attempt has been made to disassociate religion from Christianity. Having admitted the erroneous and problematic history of churches based on hierarchies and dogmas that have, indeed, been challenged and thus caused official doctrines to change (such as the change from a eart-centered universe to a heliocentric solar system within a much larger universe of trillions upon trillions of stars within billions upon billions of galaxies) that are a result of us learning more about the world and finding problems with older forms of religion.

Thus, the attempt has been made to say that these erroneous attempts at religion are not the truth, but Christianity--rather, the "true" story of Jesus as God on earth to redeem us and save us from our sins--is the truth. The choice then becomes between religion and the personal relationship with God through Jesus. This is simply dubious at best, a malicious untruth at worst. Religion is not defined by any institution, man-made or not. Religion can be defined as a set of beliefs concerning divinity, truth, supernatural realities, and so on. The story of Jesus, as believed by the evangelical/fundamentalist Christian movement, is a religious movement. Their attempt to convey their story as not mere man-made religion (which was the attacking point of many non-believers, such people as the framers of the United States Constitution and their associates--people such as Thomas Jefferson, John Adams, and Thomas Paine, for example) is an attempt to disassociate themselves from the erroneous, blood-soaked, and embattled institutions of religion. This disassociation is disengenuous and, frankly, bull****.

In short, Christianity is a religion. Their saying that it is not a man-made religion like any other is, if not a lie or an intentional deception, at least a self-deception based in error and sloppy thinking.

You don't need religion or God. You can use your brain to come up with your own answers, and any human-depraving ideology that tells you you are so bad ("sinful") as to need a supernatural redeemer does not have faith in humanity.

Some thoughts to ponder:

Some say that one needs a god for strength. I say that a mind that is able to conjure such a being should already be strong enough not to need a god.

If one needs religion or god(s) to be ethical, then such a person really has no interest in being ethical at all, but rather merely well behaved.

God is Santa for adults. Some of the mature ones know god is not real, but we don't want to deal with the whining that follows spoiling the fantasy.

If God created those who believe in him, he is surely an inept creator

"If there is a just God, what does the doubter have to fear?
If there is an unjust God, what do the faithful hope to gain?"
--Stuart's Wager

I hope that helps

Dodds® said:

Hello all,

I don't follow the bible nor do i believe we were created by a supreme being. I am not here to cause trouble but to try and understand more about religion.

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Not all religions have a god. Furthermore, there are many non-believers here.

Dodds® said:

Why do i have to chose a religion to go somewhere nice when i die? Why do i have to love some man who died many moons ago? When you say were all gods creatures, why? My mum and dad created me not god. I never had a choice.

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Anyone who chooses a religion as a ticket to "heaven" is pathetic and shallow. Why are you under the impression that the world is forcing you to believe in a god?

Dodds® said:

Someone said if I deny gods love or somthing then i go to hell. Is that true? I might be an alright person who doesnt care about going to heaven but somewhere else.

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Do you believe in God? Why are you so concerned about someone elses beliefs when you do not even have clear ones of your own.

Dodds® said:

Why do we have preists and popes? Why are they different to god than any normal person? Why do we pay money in churches when there are more pressing matters in the world. Why do we have churches? Are they just there for the few in local towns of the uk to prey?

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The world needs leaders, because humans are instinctively sheep. You pay the church money because contrary to popular belief, members of the church ARE in fact greedy. Humans are humans.

Dodds® said:

When adam and eve were created did god believe in insest?

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Only a fundemental Christian would tell you Adam and Eve really existed. The reality is that story is symbolic of the idea that God created man.

All in all, I think you need guidance. Not from others, but from your own conscience.

welcome. i think i sum everthing up by saying that you believe what you want to. you can even change anytime you want until you find the one for you. that's what freedom of religion is all about. finding your own way.

Dodds® said:

Why do i have to chose a religion to go somewhere nice when i die? Why do i have to love some man who died many moons ago? When you say were all gods creatures, why? My mum and dad created me not god. I never had a choice.

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* you have to choose a religion not only to go somewhere nice when you die but to have a clear perfect system in your life also.
and you have to know that there is Nothing in this life that have a beginning and no end so as God begin this world so he will end it too just as same as anything else.
about that you have to love someone who died many years a go it's simply because he is the MESSENGER of GOD, the guidance, the light and the word of God.

there is only one God and no one could came with a clear evidence that there is gods not only one GOD and ofcourse he never came in a human form and he will never be because he is more precious than to come in a human form.

if your parents created you so who created them ? thier parents ok .. what about those parents who created them ..

don't think about yourself but think about all those generations and who created them.
ofcourse only God.

Dodds® said:

Someone said if I deny gods love or somthing then i go to hell. Is that true? I might be an alright person who doesnt care about going to heaven but somewhere else.

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* actually, even though your are a good person that will not help you in judgment day.

Dodds® said:

Why do we have preists and popes? Why are they different to god than any normal person? Why do we pay money in churches when there are more pressing matters in the world. Why do we have churches? Are they just there for the few in local towns of the uk to prey?

* Actually, in chrestianity they have preists and pops to gauide other faithless people and also to convert other people to christianity.

they are not different than you but they just have more knowledge about God and they may try to convience any faithless person to remain a christain even though it dosn't make any sense most of the times.

ya ofcourse they will let you pay so they can gather more people and help them to become christians.

churches are there as a symbol for the religion itself because many people stopped already going in there because they don't feel that this religion is making any different in thier life ( maybe because they figure out it was the wrong religion ?? who knows ?? ).

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Dodds® said:

When adam and eve were created did god believe in insest?

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yes, because how will they come with human biengs if they never intercourse with each other ? but once they became a large comunity God forbid it.

Melody said:

Religion is man made and subject to the whim of man. You don't need religion. You need God.

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* you need one God the only God and you need the religion to fulfill this faith.

Melody said:

According to the Christian faith, a belief in the divinity of Christ, recognition of his sacrifice and God's Grace are required for salvation.

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* which is totally un logic ofcourse because Jesus never claimed to be God and he never said that he will sacrifice himself for us and the proof is that he was defending himself ( when they wanted to crucify him as christians believe ).

Melody said:

In the order you've asked --
Because it's a man made religion with a need for a hierarchy.
They aren't.
Because the churches need to be supported and have convinced people that they are ignoring God's law if they don't give their money to the church.
Because people are not reading their bible and are relying on what the church elders say so they believe you must be specially ordained to do communion, heal, etc.

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* they neem money to gain more power and people don't know that because as you said they don't read thier bible and the priests could cheat them.

so we conclude that the problem may not be with the faith but we have to choose the right religion ( which i think it's not christianity ).

ShaunPhilly said:

Thus, the attempt has been made to say that these erroneous attempts at religion are not the truth, but Christianity--rather, the "true" story of Jesus as God on earth to redeem us and save us from our sins--is the truth.

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* NOT

ShaunPhilly said:

Their attempt to convey their story as not mere man-made religion (which was the attacking point of many non-believers

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* It's actually a man-made religion and he is PAUL.

ShaunPhilly said:

In short, Christianity is a religion. Their saying that it is not a man-made religion like any other is, if not a lie or an intentional deception, at least a self-deception based in error and sloppy thinking.

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* until now many schoolars found thousand of errors in the bible itself so ... !!!

Basically, it all comes down to FAITH. I find that faith is the best freedom a man or woman can have.

Everyone is headed to hell. Some find a life boat, but you have to look for it. It really helps if you believe in life boats 'cus you won't look for them if you don't. There are lots of them for those who look. That's the problem with life: no one gets out alive!

Dodds® said:

Why do i have to love some man who died many moons ago?

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Because he was crucified for the things you have done wrong, its still your choice if you accept him or not but if you dont the things you have done wrong you will pay for(hell). Hence the need for Gods gift of salvation. You have broken Gods laws, Jesus has paid your fine - if you repent and accept him.

Dodds® said:

When adam and eve were created did god believe in insest?

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http://www.answersingenesis.org/home/area/tools/cains_wife.asp Answers this question for you.

No one says you have to believe anything. You were given free will and get to choose on your own what to believe... or not believe.

Anyhow, welcome to the forums. It can be educational as well as entertaining to read the posts from the points of view of the variety of beliefs represented here

Hi Dodds

First off forget the questions.
Then for the time being forget the answers you have been given.
Then Read only Mathew Mark Luke and John in the new testament.
Read it as a novel. or story.
Then think about the life of Jesus.
Especially, think about what he did.
What he taught.
What his teaching tells us about how to live our lives.
Then think about what he changed by his teachings.
His promise that our sins could be forgiven.
What we need to do to be forgiven.
What living a Christian life means.

Then think how this has all been kept alive for over 2000 years
Could it have been done with out organisation ( the Church)
Could it have been done with out teaching (priests)
could it have been done with out sacrifice ( people who died to keep the faith alive)
Could it have been done with out work and giving.

Finally think about the total of what you have learned and thought about.
Does it have a message for you? You could now be on the first step on a journey to faith?

It will cost you nothing but Love and a more meaningful life.
In return you will know the Love Of God.

Not a bad deal for a few hours reading and a lot of thinking.

Terry
_______________________________________-
Blessed are the pure of heart, they shall behold their God.

dont listen to anyone but yourself. only you can choose the faith that speaks to you. no one else has that decision. not them and not me. you. netiher them or I have the right to tell you what to do. here in RF you can learn abot many faiths. then, you can pick and choose what you believe is right. you can even make up your own. ^__^

Steve said:

Because he was crucified for the things you have done wrong, its still your choice if you accept him or not but if you dont the things you have done wrong you will pay for(hell). Hence the need for Gods gift of salvation. You have broken Gods laws, Jesus has paid your fine - if you repent and accept him.

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* what if a beautiful little baby was born and he died before they take him to the church?

will he go to hell ?

and how anyone would born with his/her sin ?? is it fair to come to this world holding your sin?

and when you are saying it's your choice when you say :

its still your choice if you accept him or not but if you dont the things you have done wrong you will pay for(hell).

is like when you say it's your choice whether you give your money or i kill you ( after all it's your choice ofcourse ).

i hope you can make these things clear for me because i'm really confused >>> :help:

it is just as confusing to me, The Truth.

The Truth said:

* you need one God the only God and you need the religion to fulfill this faith.

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I disagree. Religion....not God....has been at the root of many atrocities and intolerance throughout history. For a reason. Religion is a man made organization with man made rules.

the truth said:

which is totally un logic ofcourse because Jesus never claimed to be God and he never said that he will sacrifice himself for us and the proof is that he was defending himself ( when they wanted to crucify him as christians believe ).

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Illogical proof. This is your belief...not mine.

the truth said:

so we conclude that the problem may not be with the faith but we have to choose the right religion ( which i think it's not christianity ).

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Hmm...so could I made the same assumption about islam and those who would kill innocent people in the name of that religion? That it's not the problem with the faith (belief in God) but rather the religion? So it's not the right religion?

Melody said:

I disagree. Religion....not God....has been at the root of many atrocities and intolerance throughout history. For a reason. Religion is a man made organization with man made rules.



Illogical proof. This is your belief...not mine.



Hmm...so could I made the same assumption about islam and those who would kill innocent people in the name of that religion? That it's not the problem with the faith (belief in God) but rather the religion? So it's not the right religion?

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Good answers Melody.