'Christian'

t3gah is trying to point out that the picture of Christianity a naive reader might get from a disinterested perusal of the Bible might be quite a bit different from current doctrines and practices.

Religion is not static, it has always changed with (and often behind) the times. Popular religion is expedient. It fashions its teachings to support current social values. Certain passages are emphasized, others de-emphasized, re-interpreted or discreetly overlooked.

It's a fair bet that a Martian stumbling upon and reading a Bible might not recognize the religions the Book engendered.

now the fun part for all of you people.

if you know what scriptures pertain to each statement i made post them with chapter/verse along with text or just the scripture citations will be fine.

fun, no?

t3gah,

You've made so many statements about Christians that it would be pointless for any of us to try to address them all. As a matter of fact, I stopped reading about a quarter of the way through, because I kept thinking, "I'm a Christian and I don't believe that!" (I've got to admit that it drives me nuts when somebody who doesn't even know me thinks he can tell me what I believe. I can tell you without hesitation that I am the world's number one authority on what I believe.)

You said,

Christians know and teach that there is no such thing as a "Christian Denomination". You are either adhering to all of the rules Jesus laid out or you are not. Those that don't adhere to them all are not Christians no matter what they or anyone else says. Christians know and teach this fact.

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And yet there is such a thing as a Christian denomination. To be a little more precise, but still not even close to accurate, there are over 30,000 Christian denominations in the world today. That's 30,000 different groups of Christians, most of whom would probably like the idea of all the rest of the world's Christians as seeing eye-to-eye with them, but who recognize that this isn't the case. That's 30,000 different groups interpreting at least one point of doctrine differently than all of the others. Why, then, do you as a non-Christian, feel as if you are in a position to be able to say what all Christians believe? You can't paint us all with a single brush, much as you might want to be able to.

Let us each speak for ourselves, but don't expect anything more than vague generalities when you start with a list like the one you posted.

Kathryn

Hi, Spirit.

I loved your story. It was absolutely beautiful! Thank you for sharing it. :162: I tried giving you frubals, but apparently I'm not spreading them around enough.


Kathryn

Christians know and teach that the apostle Peter is also Satan as Jesus clearly called Peter: Satan, in the New Testament.

Christians know and teach that Jesus is also Moses and Elijah as he, Jesus, clearly showed 3 apostles up in the mountain.

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Christians also teach that Jesus is a door. And a path. And a vine. And that all followers of Jesus are sheep.

Christians also teach that 'thunder' had children: James and John, referred to as "Boanerges" or Sons of Thunder.

Christians apparently use metaphors that some people can't grasp.

t3gah said:

Christians know and teach that people who are true Christians will both go to Heaven or stay on Earth and God is the one that decides this during the resurrection.

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That statement contradicts a statement that you made in your first post, when you said, "Christians know and teach not to use the terms "real Christian" or "true Christian" because either "you are Christian" or "you are not Christian". Christians know and teach that saying "real" and "true" would denote there can be "Denominations" or "other kinds of Christians" and Christians know never to do this." But in that statement you refer to true Christians.

EnhancedSpirit said:

Ruth went to her mail box and there was only one letter. She picked it up and looked at it before opening, but then she looked at the envelope again. There was no stamp, no postmark, only her name and address. She read the letter:

Dear Ruth:
I'm going to be in your neighborhood Saturday afternoon and I'd like to stop by for a visit.
Love Always,
Jesus
Her hands were shaking as she placed the letter on the table. “Why would the Lord want to visit me? I'm nobody special. I don't have anything to offer.” With that thought, Ruth remembered her empty kitchen cabinets. “Oh my goodness, I really don't have anything to offer. I'll have to run down to the store and buy something for dinner.” She reached for her purse and counted out its contents. Five dollars and forty cents. “Well, I can get some bread and cold cuts, at least.” She threw on her coat and hurried out the door.

A loaf of French bread, a half-pound of sliced turkey, and a carton of milk...leaving Ruth with a grand total of twelve cents to last her until Monday.

Nonetheless, she felt good as she headed home, her meager offerings tucked under her arm. “Hey lady, can you help us?”
Ruth had been so absorbed in her dinner plans, she hadn't even noticed two figures huddled in the alleyway. A man and a woman, both of them dressed in little more than rags “Look lady, I ain't got a job, ya know, and my wife and I have been living out here on the street, and, well, now it's getting cold and we're getting kind of hungry and, well, if you could help us, lady, we'd really appreciate it.”

Ruth looked at them both. They were dirty, they smelled bad and frankly, she was certain that they could get some kind of work if they really wanted to. “Sir, I'd like to help you, but I'm a poor woman myself. All I have is a few cold cuts and some bread, and I'm having an important guest for dinner tonight and I was planning on serving that to Him.”

“Yeah, well, okay lady, I understand. Thanks anyway.”
The man put his arm around the woman's shoulders, turned and headed back into the alley. As she watched them leave, Ruth felt a familiar twinge in her heart. “Sir, wait!” The couple stopped and turned as she ran down the alley after them. “Look, why don't you take this food. I'll figure out something else to serve my guest.”
She handed the man her grocery bag. “Thank you lady. Thank you very much!”

“Yes, thank you!” It was the man's wife, and Ruth could see now that she was shivering. “You know, I've got another coat at home. Here, why don't you take this one.” Ruth unbuttoned her jacket and slipped it over the woman's shoulders. Then smiling, she turned and walked back to the street...without her coat and with nothing to serve her guest. “Thank you lady! Thank you very much!”
Ruth was chilled by the time she reached her front door, and worried too. The Lord was coming to visit and she didn't have anything to offer Him. She fumbled through her purse for the door key. But as she did, she noticed another envelope in her mailbox.
“That's odd. The mailman doesn't usually come twice in one day.”
She took the envelope out of the box and opened it.

Dear Ruth:
It was so good to see you again. Thank you for the lovely meal. And thank you, too, for the beautiful coat.
Love Always
Jesus

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This has been the only post worth reading again on this entire thread, so here is another chance.

Enhanced Spirit,Thank you for your wonderful post

Terry
__________________________________
Blessed are the pure of heart, they shall behold their God.

I'd be interested to read the passages that charge Christians to obey their governments. This seems a very spiritually dangerous charge to me.

Eccl. 8: 2 I counsel thee to keep the king’s commandment.

Matt. 22: 21 (D&C 63: 26) Render therefore unto Caesar the things which are Caesar’s

1 Tim 1-2 I EXHORT therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men; For akings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and bpeaceable clife in all godliness and dhonesty

Titus 3: 1 be subject to principalities and powers, to obey magistrates.

1 Pet. 2: 13 Submit yourselves to every ordinance of man.

Thanks Aqualung.

So the question remains, at what point does a Christian decide that the edicts of the state are irreconcilably at odds with those of his faith?

The social and wartime excesses of the past century or so suggest that many tend to err on the side of legal compliance. More instances of atrocities pop to mind than civil disobedience.

I'm not sure. That is a really good question. I'll try to see if anybody I know has any thoughts about taht.

Here's where (in my view). If what the government wants me to do in no way conflicts with religion (my city wants me to water my lawn less due to a drought) I do it. If it tells me to do something or not to do something that conflicts with something that is part of my faith but isn't necessary, I do/don't do it. (LDS thinking polygamy is somethimes acceptable, but that it is not spiritually necessary for people to have more than one wife. I then would follow law.) If the government want me to do something that is in direct oppostition to my beleifs, I woudn't do it. This, however, takes a firm understanding of beleifs. FOr example, I would need a firm beleif that it isn't necessarily wrong to go to war, even if God didn't order the war. That's pretty much what I think about it.

Edit: I actually thought of that on my own, I didn't get help like my previous post implied. Woo Hoo!