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Was Jesus a vegetarian?

Green Gaia

Veteran Member
As some of you know, I am a vegetarian and this is something that is very important in my life. While I'm not Christian, I certainly try to follow Jesus' example of love, compassion and mercy and those things are part of the reason I do not consume meat. So, I find it interesting that when I tell people I am vegetarian and the various reasons why I am, I get the most resistance and even outrage from those who claim to follow Jesus' teachings, which is very confusing to me.

But anyway, there are those who believe that Jesus was vegetarian and even if ihe wasn't, he would be one today because of how we treat the animals that end up on the dinner plate. That being said, if it was proven that Jesus was a vegetarian, should all Christians be vegetarians as well?

Also, it has been said to me on more than one occasion that according to the Bible, God gave Man animals to eat and to do with as he pleased and that by not eating them, one is going against the will of God. Any thoughts on this? Do you believe that's true?

Lastly, I know that other religions believe in not eating meat and I'm interested in hearing about those religions and there reasons for being vegetarian, or having a mostly vegetarian diet.
 

Engyo

Prince of Dorkness!
Buddhism is somewhat ambivalent on the subject, depending on which tradition one follows. If I have it right, Buddha said that if an animal had been killed to feed the village, then a monk could partake. They were forbidden to partale of an animal killed expressly for them. Many traditions are strictly vegetarian. In others, while meat-eating is allowed, many practitioners choose vegetarianism anyway.

Another reason - it takes much more land and resources to raise a pound of meat than a pound of grain or vegetables; far more than the additional caloric value concentrated in the meat might suggest.

Personally, I think that the "western" diet is probably too rich in meat. I have spent time studying "biologically appropriate feeding" with my dogs; they are evolved to eat meat, with very small amounts of vegetation thrown in, and almost no grains. When fed this way (instead of commercial dog food) they are healthier, happier and calmer. From an evolutionary standpoint, humans are omnivores, who ate more vegetation and plant life than they did meat (hunting is hard work!). If one chooses to eat meat, then I believe our bodies are best adjusted to a relatively small amount of meat versus plant food sources.
 

blessed

Member
just to prove humans are pretty much 98% herbivore :p i am a vegan and hate any form of animal crulty wicca - an ye harm none do what ye will as for jesus and christiantity it teaches to love mankind love your brother and sister but not cows or pigs or other lifeforms. :p

The following info comes from "The Comparative Anatomy of Eating", by Milton R. Mills, M.D.

Facial Muscles
CARNIVORE: Reduced to allow wide mouth gape
HERBIVORE: Well-developed
OMNIVORE: Reduced
HUMAN: Well-developed

Jaw Type
CARNIVORE: Angle not expanded
HERBIVORE: Expanded angle
OMNIVORE: Angle not expanded
HUMAN: Expanded angle

Jaw Joint Location
CARNIVORE: On same plane as molar teeth
HERBIVORE: Above the plane of the molars
OMNIVORE: On same plane as molar teeth
HUMAN: Above the plane of the molars

Jaw Motion
CARNIVORE: Shearing; minimal side-to-side motion
HERBIVORE: No shear; good side-to-side, front-to-back
OMNIVORE: Shearing; minimal side-to-side
HUMAN: No shear; good side-to-side, front-to-back

Major Jaw Muscles
CARNIVORE: Temporalis
HERBIVORE: Masseter and pterygoids
OMNIVORE: Temporalis
HUMAN: Masseter and pterygoids

Mouth Opening vs. Head Size
CARNIVORE: Large
HERBIVORE: Small
OMNIVORE: Large
HUMAN: Small

Teeth: Incisors
CARNIVORE: Short and pointed
HERBIVORE: Broad, flattened and spade shaped
OMNIVORE: Short and pointed
HUMAN: Broad, flattened and spade shaped

Teeth: Canines
CARNIVORE: Long, sharp and curved
HERBIVORE: Dull and short or long (for defense), or none
OMNIVORE: Long, sharp and curved
HUMAN: Short and blunted

Teeth: Molars
CARNIVORE: Sharp, jagged and blade shaped
HERBIVORE: Flattened with cusps vs complex surface
OMNIVORE: Sharp blades and/or flattened
HUMAN: Flattened with nodular cusps

Chewing
CARNIVORE: None; swallows food whole
HERBIVORE: Extensive chewing necessary
OMNIVORE: Swallows food whole and/or simple crushing
HUMAN: Extensive chewing necessary

Saliva
CARNIVORE: No digestive enzymes
HERBIVORE: Carbohydrate digesting enzymes
OMNIVORE: No digestive enzymes
HUMAN: Carbohydrate digesting enzymes

Stomach Type
CARNIVORE: Simple
HERBIVORE: Simple or multiple chambers
OMNIVORE: Simple
HUMAN: Simple

Stomach Acidity
CARNIVORE: Less than or equal to pH 1 with food in stomach
HERBIVORE: pH 4 to 5 with food in stomach
OMNIVORE: Less than or equal to pH 1 with food in stomach
HUMAN: pH 4 to 5 with food in stomach

Stomach Capacity
CARNIVORE: 60% to 70% of total volume of digestive tract
HERBIVORE: Less than 30% of total volume of digestive tract
OMNIVORE: 60% to 70% of total volume of digestive tract
HUMAN: 21% to 27% of total volume of digestive tract

Length of Small Intestine
CARNIVORE: 3 to 6 times body length
HERBIVORE: 10 to more than 12 times body length
OMNIVORE: 4 to 6 times body length
HUMAN: 10 to 11 times body length

Colon
CARNIVORE: Simple, short and smooth
HERBIVORE: Long, complex; may be sacculated
OMNIVORE: Simple, short and smooth
HUMAN: Long, sacculated

Liver
CARNIVORE: Can detoxify vitamin A
HERBIVORE: Cannot detoxify vitamin A
OMNIVORE: Can detoxify vitamin A
HUMAN: Cannot detoxify vitamin A

Kidney
CARNIVORE: Extremely concentrated urine
HERBIVORE: Moderately concentrated urine
OMNIVORE: Extremely concentrated urine
HUMAN: Moderately concentrated urine

Nails
CARNIVORE: Sharp claws
HERBIVORE: Flattened nails or blunt hooves
OMNIVORE: Sharp claws
HUMAN: Flattened nails
 

Isis

Member
anyone interested in animal rights should read "animal liberation" by peter singer, he's considered the forfront on the topic... and he creates some interesting arguments for vegitarianism.
I believe that humans are naturally more vegitarian than carniverous just fr the fact that our molars are flat and evolved to grind than slice (a predominent traite in vegitarian animals).
I don't think it's morally acceptable for humans to eat meat because we are fully capable of surviving without it. Why kill unnessarily?

whether or not Jeasus was vegitarian, it's a personal choice, it's very difficult to remain vegitarian (especially vegan)in this world, and i definatly respect anyone who sticks to it. I can't eat red meat (not a moral choice, it actually makes me sick to eat it) but I sometimes indulge in chicken or fish... so I guess everything I just said is hypocritical, but I eat what i am served, so I guess i'm buddhist in that sence. (when in rome)
 

Green Gaia

Veteran Member
Isis said:
whether or not Jeasus was vegitarian, it's a personal choice, it's very difficult to remain vegitarian (especially vegan)in this world, and i definatly respect anyone who sticks to it.
I don't think it's difficult, it can certainly be challenging especially at first, but with a little practice and research and willingness to try new things (10 years ago, I never thought I would be eating tofu lol) it's not hard at all, and I think it's fun to find new foods to enjoy. Actually I think it's simpler today to eat a plant-based diet than ever before because there is a greater awareness and market for those items.
Isis said:
I can't eat red meat (not a moral choice, it actually makes me sick to eat it) but I sometimes indulge in chicken or fish... so I guess everything I just said is hypocritical, but I eat what i am served, so I guess i'm buddhist in that sence. (when in rome)
I don't think your hypocritical, we all have to do what we feel comfortable with. For some that is simply cutting back on the amount of animal products they consume, and being careful about where they buy those items, but not giving it up altogether, and if that works for them, I think that's fine. :)
 

blessed

Member
i'm vegan and i dont find it hard :p also if god didn't intend for us to be vegetarian than why create us 98 % herbivore- plus seeing as god made us in his own image (hypothetically speaking) than he/she - God mustn't have intended us to eat animals :p

just something to think about
 

anders

Well-Known Member
I cannot believe that Jesus sat through the Last Supper without eating any lamb. He also probably had a piece himself when feedng the multitudes with fish.
 

Green Gaia

Veteran Member
anders said:
I cannot believe that Jesus sat through the Last Supper without eating any lamb. He also probably had a piece himself when feedng the multitudes with fish.

Is there any evidence of him eating lamb at the last supper or eating the fish with the multitudes? I know you're probably referring to the fact that Last Supper was a Passover meal and the traditional meal was lamb, but there is no mention of this in the Bible.
 

painted wolf

Grey Muzzle
Speaking from an archeological/ paleontological point of view...
Humanity (ie the genus Homo) has been consuming meat for millions of years... evidence goes as far back the Australopithicids and certenaly every species of Homo has eaten meat as well as plant.
It was part of our success... adaptability.
Our closest relations the chimps are meat eaters as well... Large canines are also a form of display and you will find the largest among the vegitarian Babbons and monkeys... they are also useful in stripping the husks of fruit.

Personally my only problem with vegitarianism is that it makes plants less important than animals and in my religion all life is equily sacred. Some of the most sacred things were plants. Sometimes the eating of meat was in part a sacred act... you are closer to something when you depend on it. The buffalo is sacred to the planes tribes for its role as a provider and brother to man.
Among eastern tribes Corn was one of the most sacrid of plants for her sacrifice so that we can live.

we are all related in one circle of life, all dependant on the others.

As for Jesus, I'm obviously not a christian and so the point is moot for me.

wa:-do
 

anders

Well-Known Member
Maize,

Luke 22:8 "...Go and prepare us the passover, that we may eat.", Mark 14:14 "...where I shall eat the passover ..."

I interpret that as full proof that Jesus at least intented to eat the "passover", meaning the lamb's meat.

If he (or one of the disciples) had not eaten the meat, that would have been such an extraordinary breach with the tradition, that I am sure it would have been mentioned.
 

Green Gaia

Veteran Member
painted wolf said:
Personally my only problem with vegitarianism is that it makes plants less important than animals and in my religion all life is equily sacred.

We discussed this issue in the Paganism forum as well, but I want to address it here as well, even though I think you know what I mean lol. :wink: We have to eat something, and many who are vegetarian or vegan are so because they are concerned about the impact their diet has on the whole environment around us, including the animals, and they believe that by eating a vegetarian or vegan diet, they are having the least amount of impact as possible. Although I guess I do look at plants I eat a little differently, however I would not say I don't think they are any less important, if anything, they are MORE important to me personally, because they keep me alive! But it's more like an appreciation for the life-giving qualities they provide my body. I can look at things like broccoli, green leafy lettuce, brussel sprouts, onions, fruits and beans and see the life and energy they have that transfers to me when I eat it, but when I look at a dead animal, all I see is a rotting corpse.
 

Green Gaia

Veteran Member
anders said:
If he (or one of the disciples) had not eaten the meat, that would have been such an extraordinary breach with the tradition, that I am sure it would have been mentioned.

Maybe, maybe not. I'm just posing the very real possibility that Jesus was vegetarian. A few Christian scholars have concluded vegetarianism to be the more consistent ethic with respect to the spirit of Christ's teachings. For example, we have the Ebionites, Athanasius, and Arius. Of the early church fathers we have Clement of Alexandria, Origen, Tertullian, Heronymus, Boniface, St. Jerome, and John Chrysostom. Clement wrote, "It is far better to be happy than to have your bodies act as graveyards for animals. Accordingly, the apostle Matthew partook of seeds, nuts and vegetables, without flesh". One of the earliest Christian documents is the `Clementine Homiles', a second-century work purportedly based on the teachings of St. Peter. Homily XII states, "The unnatural eating of flesh meats is as polluting as the heathen worship of devils, with its sacrifices and its impure feasts, through participation in it a man becomes a fellow eater with devils". Many of the monasteries both in ancient times to the present practiced vegetarianism. For instance, Basilius the Great's order, Boniface's order, Trappists monks, etc. Also, we have the examples provided by the stories around some saints like Hubertus, Aegidius and Francis of Assisi.

Knowledge about how the Essenes, the Nazoreans and Ebionites lived suggests that Christ was probably a vegetarian. The Essenes were Jews who were remarkably similar to the early Christians as evinced in their deemphasis upon property and wealth, their communalism and in their rejection of animal sacrifices. The first Christians were known as the Nazoreans (not to be confused with Nazarenes), and the Ebionites were a direct offshoot from them. All three groups were vegetarian which is suggestive of the central role such a practice once played in Early Christianity.

Paul's need to constantly deal with these vegetarians is also evidence of how prevalent they were and not a few fellow Christians, it would seem, took issue with Paul. Paul, if he is consistent with his words, would have been vegetarian (Corinthians 8:13), notwithstanding his opposition to the Ebionites. According to Clement of Alexandria, Matthew was a vegetarian. Clementine `Homiles' and `Recognitions' claim that Peter was also a vegetarian. Both Hegisuppus and Augustin testify that the first head of the church in Jerusalem after the death of Christ, namely Christ's brother James the Just, was a vegetarian and raised as one! If Jesus's parents raised James as vegetarian then it would be likely that Jesus was also so raised.
 

anders

Well-Known Member
I disagree with your interpretation of 1 Cor. 8:13.
Paul only says that he will abstain from meat if somebody is offended. That must mean that he normally had meat.
 

Green Gaia

Veteran Member
Or had previously had meat, but had since stopped eating it. But like a lot of other verses it's hard to interpert it only one way.
 

lilithu

The Devil's Advocate
Maize said:
But anyway, there are those who believe that Jesus was vegetarian and even if ihe wasn't, he would be one today because of how we treat the animals that end up on the dinner plate.
There is no evidence that Jesus was vegetarian, and except where the scriptures say otherwise, I imagine that he was like other Jewish men of his time, vegetarianism not being a common practice. It certainly would have been unusual enough to make note of it. Nor is there any scriptural evidence that he gave any special consideration to other animals. Could someone point to even one scriptural reference where Jesus extended his message of compassion to anything other than a human being?
 
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