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Science and the Quran

Point*of*life

New Member
Sallamu Allkuim,

One of the most amazing miracles of the Quran is the science contained inside it that were unknown to mankind 1400 years ago when it was revealed to Prophet Mohammed(peace upon him). Therefore the Quran does not conflict with science, indeed it rather supports science.

I'll post them one by one, :)

Number 1:The Big Bang Theory

Chapter 21(The Prophets), Verse 30
Have not those who disbelieve known that the heavens and the earth were of one piece, then We parted them, and we made every living thing of water? Will they not then believe?
 

Zxzyx

Member
Number 1:The Big Bang Theory

Chapter 21(The Prophets), Verse 30
Have not those who disbelieve known that the heavens and the earth were of one piece, then We parted them, and we made every living thing of water? Will they not then believe?




Hello

I have to say that the skeptic might say that you are making a vague verse fit a scientific theory.



The verse you mentioned goes on to suggest mountains were put on the earth to stop it moving around like tent pegs but we now know mountains are the result of the earth moving and pushing together at the cracks in the tectonic plates.



Sura 21 goes on to suggest that the heavens are like a canopy. This conjures up the image of the sky scene painted two dimensionally on a sheet. This canopy is then held up by strong support. What kind of support? Sura 13 v1 suggests invisible pillars. Sura 31v 10 suggests the same. This whole description, to me describes a very human idea taken from a time and people who lived in tents. I don’t know any commonly accepted scientific theory that supports these claims.



The next verse in Sura 21 clearly claims that the sun and moon move in their own orbit. I know this is commonly accepted of the moon but not the sun. To an average person a millennia ago or earlier it would seem that the sun was going in an orbit around the earth but now it is commonly accepted that it is the us on earth going round the sun. To be picky the moon’s orbit is not entirely it’s own since it goes where the earth goes.



If the Qur’an is making scientific statements Ill have to say they are not very clear and offer so little information and said in such a poetic language that they could be made to fit a whole number of theories.



I am interested to hear your thoughts on this.

Thanks



Zyzyx
 

Ziroc

Member
Zxzyx said:

If the Qur’an is making scientific statements Ill have to say they are not very clear and offer so little information and said in such a poetic language that they could be made to fit a whole number of theories.
Quran never mention it in details so that later, humans can find it by themselves. God has gave us the clue and now its up to us to discover it. That is why God created us with intelligence, so that humans can explore and reveal the greatness of the All Mighty God, Allah.

Quran also didn't mention it detail, so that people will not get confused by the contents, because Quran was dealing with humans from 14 centuries ago.
 

Ziroc

Member
After all, Quran is not a Biology text book, nor a Physics text book, or even a Mathematics text book, and etc :) .
 

Zxzyx

Member
Hello

You said the Qur’an didn’t explain things in details so as not to confuse people. Surely saying things in a vague way is more confusing. Ill agree that the Qur’an is not a textbook and think it is dangerous to try to extract such information. I see your signature is Islam, the religious of rational and logical thinking. I would say that logical and rational thinking is most likely human thinking. The thing that keeps surprising me about the Bible is the fact that it is not logical by human standards but you can see when the teaching is put into practice it works with amazing results.

Also what is logical about the order in which the Qur’an is set out?

Thanks

Zyzyx
 

john313

warrior-poet
Salaam,

each verse of the Quran has 7 meanings. one can take it at face value or contemplate and look for a deeper understanding. things are vague and figurative on the surface because the people had to be able to visualize things in order to grasp them. there are hadith that have more in depth scientific knowledge, but these were not told to everyone at the time because the people would not understand and they would reject the ideas. Even today when there is scientific evidence from studies on spiritual healing, psychic abilities, and the like, many scientists reject it because it does not fit their preconceived ideas of the universe. Even Einstein did not agree with theories of quantum physics. if these learned scientists reject this great knowledge, that we know to be true based on scientific observation, how can we expect someone 1400 years ago to understand and accept it?
if there was a book revealed today would we be able to understand all the concepts explained to us? would someone 1400 years from now look at it and say "this is nonsense, why didn't God just explain this simple concept to them?" what seems scientifically simple to us would be so far advanced for the majority of people 1400 years ago, that they would reject it and possibly reject faith in anyone who teaches it.

*i had a better response typed up but it got erased when i tried to reply. at least i think it was better :).
 

lilithu

The Devil's Advocate
Point*of*life said:
Sallamu Allkuim,

One of the most amazing miracles of the Quran is the science contained inside it that were unknown to mankind 1400 years ago when it was revealed to Prophet Mohammed(peace upon him). Therefore the Quran does not conflict with science, indeed it rather supports science.

I'll post them one by one, :)
Scientism. By claiming that the Qur'an has knowledge in it that "supports science" you are implicitly arguing that because the Qur'an agrees with science, it is true and should be believed. However, the assumption here is that science is the ultimate arbiter of "truth" and other things are validated to the extent that they agree with science.

As a Muslim, is not the Qur'an the first and foremost authority on "truth"? Do you really need to show that it "agrees" with science in order to justify it?
 

Zxzyx

Member
John

You said 'each verse of the Qur’an has 7 meanings'. The problem I have with this is that unless someone has the teacher edition with all the correct answers in the back, how is anyone supposed to know what they understand is right. I have never heard that theory before but doesn’t it mean that there are literally infinite combinations of understanding the Qur'an. Anyone can therefore twist any passage to fit their own ideas. I find it hard to believe there is no one correct meaning.

Am I getting this right?

Zyzyx
 

john313

warrior-poet
it is my understanding that we are not supposed to know everything while here on earth, therefore we will not understand it completely. i have read hadith that state there are 7 meanings to each verse. it can be understood through common sense. There are many correct meanings, it just depends on the level of understanding of the reader. in another 1400 years i would guess that people will have a better understanding of many of the verses, just as science has helped us understand and see some of the things like the big bang. now we have a new level of understanding because we can learn how it worked according to scientific theories.
 

Cordoba

Well-Known Member
Hello Lilithu:

lilithu said:

As a Muslim, is not the Qur'an the first and foremost authority on "truth"? Do you really need to show that it "agrees" with science in order to justify it?
For Muslims, our main fixed reference is the Qur'an, and as such we don't need to justify it through science.

For non-Muslims however, this is not the case. Presenting the scientific hints in the Qur'an is a sign for reflection.

By the way, the other day I found an article titled "Islam and Unitarians: The Quest for Truth and Justice" which may be of interest:

http://www.islamfortoday.com/cleland05.htm

All the best.
 

Stormygale

Member
The way I see it is, ANY person with a reputation and MIND for scientific understanding, and an inkling of how to intice people into believing in certain things, is capable of creating a Book like the Bible or the Quran. Seriously. If you get enough followers behind a new religion, one so inspired by a Great name as Maham. had, it will fly. Add in this religion flourishing and being passed down a few generations, and it is a sure thing. There are ALOT of great minds in this world, and many of them have just had the luck and the 'no how' to create.
-
Maham. had several wives. Concubines I guess is the better word for it. His writings tell us that Abraham and many of the others lived in the same years. In the King James, this did not conspire. His writings tell us that if you kill 'one unbeliever', that is to say, someone who is an infidel, then you have immediate access to the after life, where, several virgins await your arrival. To me, that just blows the whole religion out of the water. BUT, that is only me, I was not raised in such a religion, so if was not entered into my mind day after day till it made sense. I was however, in a form of an occult, I guess you could say when I was younger. That makes me able to say prime things that deal with 'ways and beliefs' that the common, say, southern Baptist would not understand.
-
I do not make light of the religion here that is tabled. I am delving into an area I do not have right to say. Yet, I would rather have one experienced woman waiting for me in the afterlife, lol, than several unexperienced virgins who play games.....lol...
Anyway, bless you all....
 

Cordoba

Well-Known Member
Stormygale:

It's clear from your post that you need "A Brief Illustrated Guide to Understand Islam":

http://www.islam-guide.com/

P.S. It includes a section titled "The Qur'an on Clouds", which may be of interest to storms and gales!
 
For the non-moslems the mathemathical miracles of Qur'an are more graspable:

The statement of "seven heavens" is repeated seven times. "The creation of the heavens (khalq as-samawat)" is also repeated seven times.

"Day (yawm)" is repeated 365 times in singular form, while its plural and dual forms "days (ayyam and yawmayn)" together are repeated 30 times. The number of repetitions of the word "month" (shahar) is 12.

The number of repetitions of the words "plant" and "tree" is the same: 26

The word "payment or reward" is repeated 117 times, while the expression "forgiveness" (mughfirah), which is one of the basic morals of the Qur'an, is repeated exactly twice that amount, 234 times.

When we count the word "Say," we find it appears 332 times. We arrive at the same figure when we count the phrase "they said."

The number of times the words, "world" (dunya) and "hereafter" (akhira) are repeated is also the same: 115

The word "satan" (shaitan) is used in the Qur'an 88 times, as is the word "angels" (malaika).

...
...
..
.
For the complete list check out this link:

http://www.miraclesofthequran.com/mathematical_01.html
 

Cordoba

Well-Known Member
And that the number of times the words "man" and "woman" are repeated in the Qur'an, 23, is at the same time that of the chromosomes from the egg and sperm in the formation of the human embryo.

The total number of human chromosomes is 46; 23 each from the mother and father.

Is that a coincidence?
 

john313

warrior-poet
Stormygale said:
The way I see it is, ANY person with a reputation and MIND for scientific understanding, and an inkling of how to intice people into believing in certain things, is capable of creating a Book like the Bible or the Quran. Seriously. If you get enough followers behind a new religion, one so inspired by a Great name as Maham. had, it will fly. Add in this religion flourishing and being passed down a few generations, and it is a sure thing. There are ALOT of great minds in this world, and many of them have just had the luck and the 'no how' to create.
-
Maham. had several wives. Concubines I guess is the better word for it. His writings tell us that Abraham and many of the others lived in the same years. In the King James, this did not conspire. His writings tell us that if you kill 'one unbeliever', that is to say, someone who is an infidel, then you have immediate access to the after life, where, several virgins await your arrival. To me, that just blows the whole religion out of the water. BUT, that is only me, I was not raised in such a religion, so if was not entered into my mind day after day till it made sense. I was however, in a form of an occult, I guess you could say when I was younger. That makes me able to say prime things that deal with 'ways and beliefs' that the common, say, southern Baptist would not understand.
-
I do not make light of the religion here that is tabled. I am delving into an area I do not have right to say. Yet, I would rather have one experienced woman waiting for me in the afterlife, lol, than several unexperienced virgins who play games.....lol...
Anyway, bless you all....
Salaam,

it appears most everything you believe about Islam is a lie. you might be getting your information from an "Islamophobic" website that has a purpose of spreading lies and hate. Something about Islam...it was not a new religion when the Prophet(saas) taught it, he taught the same things as all the prophets(Abraham, Moses, Jesus....), it was however a different message than Paul of Tarsus(the "Liar" of the dead sea scrolls and the father of christianity) taught.
 

Zxzyx

Member
john313 said:
Salaam,

it appears most everything you believe about Islam is a lie. he taught the same things as all the prophets(Abraham, Moses, Jesus....), it was however a different message than Paul of Tarsus(the "Liar" of the dead sea scrolls and the father of christianity) taught.

John313
How was Muhammad’s message the same as those of previous prophets and Jesus?

Where are you getting the idea that Paul had a different message to Jesus and that he created Christianity?

Just because someone has a different opinion to you, does that make it a lie?
 
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