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Who/what is Satan

jewscout

Religious Zionist
Dayv said:
First off, I'd like to say I was never bashing anyones faith, but merely trying to get an opinion out of you two (jewscout and may) instead of this constant flow of bible verse. I'd also like to add that this argument of yours may well go on forever, first off b/c you are each using completely different bibles, and second b/c, regardless of which bible you use, as Era mentioned, it's full of self contradictions and obscurities. Like I said before, give us an opinion, not a verse. If you're going to use you're bible, than at least analyze what it's saying and say something in your own words. This constant vomit of verse is driving me nuts!
again i'd like to point out that when talking about a topic it is only prudent to use sources from said topic. If we were debating Atlantic slavery i'd be quoteing from works such as David Northrup, Bernard Moitt, and Eric Williams. I'm debating about the biblical source material dealing with the role of Satan or the devil, ergo it is only prudent for me to use scripture to back up what i'm saying, which the point i've been getting at is that there is no way in which satan can oppose G-d, in fact that satan works for Him.

may on the other hand is saying that based on her interpretation of the scripture satan is infact some other power working against G-d and is using scripture to back up her point as well .
 

EnhancedSpirit

High Priestess
EnhancedSpirit said:
Isaiah 45:7 reads, "I form the light, and I create darkness: I make peace and create evil: I the Lord do all these things." And Isaiah 54:16," Behold I have created the smith that bloweth the coals in the fire, and that bringeth forth an instrument for his work; I have created the waster to destroy." Satan is evil and God was the one who created him.

Our problem is that we look at evil and judge it to be bad. This is what we are to avoid doing. Satan was created to forge our spirit. When something bad happens, it is for a reason. That which does not kill us only makes us stronger. So how can it be wrong?
Let me elaborate. Satan is not a scapegoat. And Satan is different than the devil. Satan is not a ghost or a spirit. Satan is a negative energy that is found only on Earth. Satan is a force of nature like gravity is a force of nature. There are a lot of good people, who during the times of trial will act out as if "the devil made them do it." This is a moment of weakness, when we are affected by Satan. There are others who are drawn to this energy. Most of us are drawn to the higher vibrations of happiness or joy, but we have moments of being drawn to the lower vibrations of jealousy or hatred, or envy or greed.
 
As the saying goes, it's what's inside that counts. To my mind you can be good or just as easily be bad. Simple as. Why complicate things that are a lot simpler than some people would have us believe?
 

AllanV

Active Member
Understanding who or what Satan is, is about understanding what goes on in own mind and in the personality with perceptions and interaction with reactions. Satan is a ruler in a Kingdom that has been overcome by Jesus. A person or group can be translated from the kingdom of Satan into the kingdom of God. But they must overcome as Jesus did and He will show the way in.

All human interaction begins in the mind. Even facial expressions, behavior and emotional state, strength and weakness. Self expression, self indulgence, self belief predominate, but the personality is loaded with faults mostly seen by others. We learn to become comfortable with those things that go on in our own minds but they do not need to be there. There is an added dimension where the personality is subtlety projected and is remembered. Something of one personality is projected from one mind to another and a bonding takes place. Rebelliousness is as witchcraft indicates the human is active from the mind using the will to empower belief to get what it wants and this is wrapped up in a personality.

Satan's power is to bond everyone in the same type of mind with some deception and therefore keeping God out of the mind and the self in. Instead of believing in God a person believes in own self from that perspective entirely. If a person is able to believe in God there is no judgement and the person will attain immortality.
 
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I still believe that the problems of the world are not down to God or Satan or witchcraft or anything like that, but us as human beings. I also believe that regardless of your personal beliefs and opinions, most issues and problems can be overcome. I believe there is a God and I am looking for answers to life's problems through reading the bible,joining this forum and I have also studied with Jehovah's witnesses, although I did not actually become one. Up to the present time I am still hoping to learn more about life, other people and, of course God himself.
 

AllanV

Active Member
When I was young there was no interest at all in religion and I lived my life working, tramping, traveling around and thankfully didn't get into too much trouble.
I have placed myself in a bubble of bliss and don't have any nasty problems in a human sense. Measured against the standard of being perfect and holy and acceptable to God, then there may be a little way to go. I do have neighbors and that is beyond my control because they bring in situations.
There is a battle going on for the mind of man and what has been related isn't opinion it is how it works and it is all in the Bible. All Churches and there are many versions seem to be saying don't do anything play it safe and comfortable. It all becomes a prolonged study and story telling that needs intellectual genius to unravel.

But the answer is there very close but cannot be seen because the human mind cannot understand, fathom or comprehend it. It is a simple matter of finding the way in then everything is known and that person will know more than all the teachers because they will not enter and they will not allow others to either.

Anything to do with the mind is difficult , because we cling to what we think is sane by making excuses while doing things that aren't and try to learn lessons and not repeat the same mistakes. Each generation does exactly that.

Many claim they know what the Kingdom of God is about but have they experienced anything? The mind is interesting because latent and hidden traits only reveal themselves when tested. It is seen all the time with other peoples' behavior but how would you behave or speak when there is opportunity or while under pressure. The Bible relates "be transformed by the renewing of the mind, Be Holy and be perfect and to purify your self and believe in God". There is a way into the sanctuary of God, the Holy Place and "God's request is to know Him". What would this mind be like. It is impossible to comprehend God in the natural mind. Its a bit like looking out into the night sky and trying imagine the size of the universe.

I speak from experience and the way in must be started and then it is shown while proceeding, how to go deeper. If forward momentum continues the nature of Jesus is revealed and this is more gentle than can be comprehended in the natural mind. In this experience the fate of mankind is understood. People do not like to give up their personal power because this revolves around their own self and the world they have created around them. It could be about objects or a weave of stories or lies or the truth the way they see it. All this has to be renounced and memories pushed out of the mind because they have been developed out of a sinful nature.

The problems of the world have not been resolved for thousands of years. The only thing that has changed is the weaponry and the ability to kill many at the push of a button.
Sin is the problem and this word means to miss the mark or to not measure up. The Human mind is flawed and it is separated from God. Mankind is not able to solve anything with the mind it has.
 

Thruve

Sheppard for the Die Hard
I always interpreted him as just a physical description of a will opposing gods will.


Satan's will + God's Will = Love.




Balance?
Yin and Yang?
All the same to me.
 
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AllanV

Active Member
I always interpreted him as just a physical description of a will opposing gods will.


Satan's will + God's Will = Love.




Balance?
Yin and Yang?
All the same to me.

A young electrician friend attempted to balance his Yin and Yang by eating a solitary diet of eggs and apples while working. He ended up in psychiatric care. His parents and family were atheists and they committed him because he believed he was God and like Jesus.
He stayed with my wife, young son and I for a while and didn't seem too bad but he had been grossly medicated with some shock treatment because there was a family history of hormonal imbalance.

In my on going quest to know God it is now realized that if the Bible is followed closely then the hormonal balance shifts and the aggressive and in fact all human traits are covered over by the nature of Jesus. It is a little frightening reaching that level and the demonic fixtures of the mind and Satan's influence in the self are both then understood.
 

Thruve

Sheppard for the Die Hard
A young electrician friend attempted to balance his Yin and Yang by eating a solitary diet of eggs and apples while working. He ended up in psychiatric care. His parents and family were atheists and they committed him because he believed he was God and like Jesus.
He stayed with my wife, young son and I for a while and didn't seem too bad but he had been grossly medicated with some shock treatment because there was a family history of hormonal imbalance.

In my on going quest to know God it is now realized that if the Bible is followed closely then the hormonal balance shifts and the aggressive and in fact all human traits are covered over by the nature of Jesus. It is a little frightening reaching that level and the demonic fixtures of the mind and Satan's influence in the self are both then understood.

I interpreted the second paragraph as you agreeing with me. Yes? lol?
 

AllanV

Active Member
I interpreted the second paragraph as you agreeing with me. Yes? lol?

I see the balance you are equating, but words have different meanings to different people and cultures. I work in mechanical engineering and there are all manner of branches in the technology and it can be difficult getting the language correct.

Purified Man's will + God's will = Love

The self purified from Satan's influence. Biology with the sensory input takes control of the will to keep the life strong for survival and then Satan's influence in the mind produces the acting out mostly for self survival in the interaction of life. It is difficult because most don't see themselves as being that bad or good and learn to accept the person they are, becoming offended at the thought of change. The one advocating it comes under attack and seen as a threat. For example the death of Jesus and the apostles and the prophets.

The general Christian belief is that there is nothing more to do individually. Guess what they are controlled by in their personality especially the leadership. I can accept my plight and the action that needs to be taken.

I haven't knowingly followed Yin or Yang but a deep fast and only saying those words that agree with the thoughts coming into the new mind transform the heart or soul center and change the energy coming off the heart and this then overflows outwardly to those who are able to receive.

The fathers will and my will are one are the words Jesus spoke but Satan's influence is on the self and essentially keeps it impure. The idea is to purify the self and in the process which is frightening as it nears completion, Satan's hold is revealed.
 

Thruve

Sheppard for the Die Hard
I see the balance you are equating, but words have different meanings to different people and cultures. I work in mechanical engineering and there are all manner of branches in the technology and it can be difficult getting the language correct.

Purified Man's will + God's will = Love

The self purified from Satan's influence. Biology with the sensory input takes control of the will to keep the life strong for survival and then Satan's influence in the mind produces the acting out mostly for self survival in the interaction of life. It is difficult because most don't see themselves as being that bad or good and learn to accept the person they are, becoming offended at the thought of change. The one advocating it comes under attack and seen as a threat. For example the death of Jesus and the apostles and the prophets.

The general Christian belief is that there is nothing more to do individually. Guess what they are controlled by in their personality especially the leadership. I can accept my plight and the action that needs to be taken.

I haven't knowingly followed Yin or Yang but a deep fast and only saying those words that agree with the thoughts coming into the new mind transform the heart or soul center and change the energy coming off the heart and this then overflows outwardly to those who are able to receive.

The fathers will and my will are one are the words Jesus spoke but Satan's influence is on the self and essentially keeps it impure. The idea is to purify the self and in the process which is frightening as it nears completion, Satan's hold is revealed.

Yes. You pretty much summed it up for me. I love you. You need more likes,
 

AllanV

Active Member
Yes. You pretty much summed it up for me. I love you. You need more likes,
God has revealed this to me and I can only repeat with words what has been shown the best that is possible. And yes the goal is Love and this is the commandment. But I am not as dedicated as I should be. There is further to go.
 
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