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soul
- Thread starter may
- Start date
jewscout
Religious Zionist
Ezek 18:4 - this has to do w/ the souls of Jews who are not observant of Mitzvot and turn away from HaShemmay said:
Eccl 9:10 - again judgment of the evil and righteous
Psalm 6:5 & 146:4 - i fail to see how this is talking about the destination of the soul in the afterlife...these are yet more poems/songs attributed to King David about HaShem which is what psalms is all about
i'll leave John 11:11-14 to the christians to deal w/
CaptainXeroid
Following Christ
I are one of they.jewscout said:
KJV from Bible.com
I fail to see how this proves 'The human soul ceases to exist at death.', so perhaps you could provide some insight as to how you drew this conclusion. Then we would have a reference for a meaningful discussion.
according to some , who claim to follow the bible ,when a person dies they go to heaven or hell ,but according to the bible they just go to the grave,so imortality of the soul is not in line with the bible thats how it looks to me.so what is right then,imortality of the soul or the bible.CaptainXeroid said:I are one of they.
KJV from Bible.com
I fail to see how this proves 'The human soul ceases to exist at death.', so perhaps you could provide some insight as to how you drew this conclusion. Then we would have a reference for a meaningful discussion.
Dinogrrl
peeb!
Then what about the whole 'Jesus conquering the grave' thing? I thought that had to do with the soul /not/ disappearing when the body died, but instead being sent to heaven or hell.
Then again, maybe I shouldn't talk. I have my doubts about the whole Jesus resurrection thing to begin with.
Then again, maybe I shouldn't talk. I have my doubts about the whole Jesus resurrection thing to begin with.
so the question is ,what is the soul
Do we really have an immortal soul? If the soul is actually not immortal, then how could such a false teaching become an integral part of so many of todays religions? Where did the idea come from?
"Dust you are and to dust you will return."GENESIS 3:19
The Hebrew word translated "soul" is ne´phesh, What does ne´phesh mean? According to The Dictionary of Bible and Religion, it "usually refers to the entire living being, to the whole individual." This is borne out by the Bibles description of the soul at Genesis 2:7: "Jehovah God proceeded to form the man out of dust from the ground and to blow into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man came to be a living soul." Note that the first man "came to be" a soul. That is to say, Adam did not have a soul; he was a souljust as someone who becomes a doctor is a doctor. The word "soul," then, here describes the whole person.
Do we really have an immortal soul? If the soul is actually not immortal, then how could such a false teaching become an integral part of so many of todays religions? Where did the idea come from?
"Dust you are and to dust you will return."GENESIS 3:19
The Hebrew word translated "soul" is ne´phesh, What does ne´phesh mean? According to The Dictionary of Bible and Religion, it "usually refers to the entire living being, to the whole individual." This is borne out by the Bibles description of the soul at Genesis 2:7: "Jehovah God proceeded to form the man out of dust from the ground and to blow into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man came to be a living soul." Note that the first man "came to be" a soul. That is to say, Adam did not have a soul; he was a souljust as someone who becomes a doctor is a doctor. The word "soul," then, here describes the whole person.
The body is merely a 'vehicle' for the Sou'ls incarnation on earth.may said:
"Dust you are and to dust you will return."GENESIS 3:19 I see as being relating to the physical body, and not the soul. There is also a matter of the effects of the actions of the person on life, while alive; they don't die, do they ? The actions of the person are a legacy.
The Soul lives on.
Halcyon
Lord of the Badgers
Hi May, i see you are a Jehovah's Witness, so you are waiting for the imminent second coming of Christ and the final judgement, correct? I'm guessing then that the theory behind your posts is that the 'soul' remains within the physical body until such judgement when the dead rise again, yes?
You do realise we decompose though right? And alot of people are cremated. Its going to be quite strange to see living skeletons and clouds of dust walking the earth don't you think?
You do realise we decompose though right? And alot of people are cremated. Its going to be quite strange to see living skeletons and clouds of dust walking the earth don't you think?
CaptainXeroid
Following Christ
IMHO, yes, we have an immortal soul. So, I guess you are saying that in your opinion, the soul is false teaching. Obviously, many people would disagree. Doing a quick search, I'd say the idea that we have soul that is seperate from our corporeal form comes from the Bible. Here's one example.may said:
Regarding matt 10;28 this is refering to our future prospects of everlasting life being dependent on Jehovah God .it does not mean we have a seperate something inside us.
Yes, it is Jehovah who can destroy ones "soul" (meaning in this instance ones future prospects as a living soul) or can instead resurrect a person to enjoy everlasting life.
At Matthew 10:28, Jesus warned his hearers to "be in fear of him that can destroy both soul and body in Gehenna." What does it mean? Notice that there is no mention here of torment in the fires of Gehenna; rather, he says to fear him that can destroy in Gehenna. By referring to the "soul" separately, Jesus here emphasizes that God can destroy all of a persons life prospects; thus there is no hope of resurrection for him. So, the references to the fiery Gehenna have the same meaning as the lake of fire of Revelation 21:8, namely, destruction, "second death."
Yes, it is Jehovah who can destroy ones "soul" (meaning in this instance ones future prospects as a living soul) or can instead resurrect a person to enjoy everlasting life.
At Matthew 10:28, Jesus warned his hearers to "be in fear of him that can destroy both soul and body in Gehenna." What does it mean? Notice that there is no mention here of torment in the fires of Gehenna; rather, he says to fear him that can destroy in Gehenna. By referring to the "soul" separately, Jesus here emphasizes that God can destroy all of a persons life prospects; thus there is no hope of resurrection for him. So, the references to the fiery Gehenna have the same meaning as the lake of fire of Revelation 21:8, namely, destruction, "second death."
cardero
Citizen Mod
Every single owner of a soul has the right and decision to terminate the existence of their own soul. No one has the option or the ability to do this. Why would someone want to discontinue the existence of their soul? Because they tire of existing, we have examples of this in the physical realm. What does this experience of a discontinued soul feel like? Well even May can agree with me that it feels like nothing
Katzpur
Not your average Mormon
I disagree, but then you and I may have entirely different definitions of the word "soul." I believe that a human being consists of a "spirit" and a "physical body." I'm assuming that most of us would agree about what a physical body is. But we don't always see eye-to-eye on what the word "spirit" means. I see the spirit as the thinking, feeling part of man, his will, his consciousness, his identity and personality. When the spirit first enters the physical body (whether at conception or at birth, I'm not certain), man becomes "a living soul." The physical body is subject to disease and death, and ultimately to decay. The spirit leaves the body at death, but in no way ceases to exist. At the resurrection, it will re-enter the body (which, at that time, will be restored to a perfect, immortal state). So I would agree with you to this extent: a human being doesn't have a soul, but is a soul. On the other hard, I definitely can't go along with the idea that the spirit part of man ceases to exist at death. There is simply too much evidence to the contrary.may said:
so where does the bible tell us that we have a spirit such as a shadowy spirit that leaves the body at death ,rather the bible says that we are in Gods memory awaiting the ressurection, when the bible says the spirit goes back to God it just means that our future prospects lie in Gods hands to ressurect usKatzpur said:
Ps. 146:4: "His spirit goes out, he goes back to his ground; in that day his thoughts do perish." (The Hebrew word here translated "spirit" is a derivative of ru´ach. Some translators render it "breath." When that ru´ach, or active life-force, leaves the body, the persons thoughts perish; they do not continue in another realm.)
true blood
Active Member
Body, Soul, Spirit are explained in Gen. during the forming, making and creation of man and everything returns unto it's orginal state, eventually. Body is formed from the elements of the planet. Soul was breathed into the nostrils and the life of the soul is in the blood. Spirit, the image of God (invisibility), was created in man for communication with God.
Katzpur
Not your average Mormon
I don't know about a "shadowy" spirit (sound kind of spooky, actually), but I am convinced that the human spirit lives on after death.may said:
In 1 Peter 3:18-20, it says: "For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit: By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison; Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water."
So why do you think that Jesus visited the spirit in prison and preached to them? If their thoughts perish, as you believe, what was the purpose of that visit?
Katzpur
Not your average Mormon
If this is the case, why can't I find anywhere in Genesis your definition of the spirit being "the image of God (invisibility)" being "created in man for communication with God? In plain English, please explain your understanding of the words "spirit" and "soul." I'd like to be able to understand your point of view; I'm not just being argumentative.true blood said:
Katzpur said:
The Bible states that the disobedient angels are now "spirits in prison," having been thrown into Tartarus and "reserved with eternal bonds under dense darkness for the judgment of the great day." This seems to indicate that they are greatly restricted, unable again to materialize as they did prior to the Flood.1Pe 3:19; 2Pe 2:4; Jude 6 so these spirits are not dead people they are angels .