Katzpur
Not your average Mormon
What on earth are you talking about?
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LDS Beliefs and the Bible (6 Discussions)
- Thread starter FFH
- Start date
madhatter85
Transhumanist
Good to hear from you FFH. The woe in Isaiah does apply to one of us, doesn't it? How about joining me at the new thread called "Bible Revelation"? I am inviting all LDS Christians to that thread...since you guys all own a Bible too.The Bible can be your friend! :slap:
http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/biblical-debates/66978-bible-revelation.html
BTW... I thought you may have broken a RF rule. It appears the Book of Mormon may be in violation of rule 7. Do you seem to agree or disagree?
7. Plagiarism
Plagiarism is illegal and never permitted. To quote another author you must always identify the Title, Author, and Publisher. You may insert a short paragraph or one or two sentences from it into your post, showing a link to the source. When using material in this way, you must indicate the significance of the material in your own words. Posts that just show a link and source material will be removed. This rule will be enforced with in our understanding of intellectual property rights and fair use.
no more than you plagarize the bible =)
more like butchering and tearing apart the bible. but w/e, you say the bible is so great yet you only seem to like the new testament.
are you a Gideon?
Gideons International - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Fish-Hunter
Rejoice in the Lord!
FFH quoted a Bible verse and an identical Book of Mormon verse. It appears one of the books copied the other book. It's a copy KAT. Just having some fun with you Katzpur. It's okay to laugh. Check it out because plagiarism is against the rules.
Originally Posted by FFH
Careful, this post sounds like you're calling our past and present prophets false prophets.
I'll counter your scripture with this one...
I think this is entirely appropriate to post in this case.
Isaiah 5: 20
Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!
2 Nephi 15: 20 (Book of Mormon)
Wo unto them that call evil good, and good evil, that put darkness for light, and light for darkness, that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!
Fish-Hunter
Rejoice in the Lord!
I once went to a Gideon recruit meeting and got really mad, and turned over the tables. Please join me on the new thread called Bible Revelation!
http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/biblical-debates/66978-bible-revelation.html
Katzpur
Not your average Mormon
Oh, I see... And when one book in the Bible contains an exact duplicate of something in another book, is that plagiarism? Or weren't you aware that that's the case?
By the way, you didn't give us much of a reprieve, did you? I was just starting to enjoy RF again.
Katzpur
Not your average Mormon
Sounds very "Christian" of you, but not at all surprising.
Fish-Hunter
Rejoice in the Lord!
I thought you would at least ask why? Well, here is the reason. We have friends who are one of the top Gideon leaders on the West Coast. It is a wonderful ministry to distribute Bibles. However, their requirement of being a Gideon is quite worldly. When they recruit you to be a Gideon, they invite you to a nice hotel with a conference center. We were served a prime rib dinner before the Gideon presentation. We noticed we were seated in the middle... and a Doctor was seated in the front row after we arrived and seated (book of James). I went to the Gideon meeting with a door to door ministry friend of mine who is a school teacher. I found out that they only recruit people who have a 4 year (+) college degree or own a successful business. I tried to show them 1 Cor chapter 1...that God chooses the foolish things of the world to shame the wise; therefore their Gideon requirements had no biblical basis. I was very grieved by their worldly standards, but the prime rib dinner was delicious.
The Sin of Partiality - James
2:1 My brothers, [5] show no partiality as you hold the faith in our Lord Jesus Christ, the Lord of glory. 2 For if a man wearing a gold ring and fine clothing comes into your assembly, and a poor man in shabby clothing also comes in, 3 and if you pay attention to the one who wears the fine clothing and say, “You sit here in a good place,” while you say to the poor man, “You stand over there,” or, “Sit down at my feet,” 4 have you not then made distinctions among yourselves and become judges with evil thoughts? 5 Listen, my beloved brothers, has not God chosen those who are poor in the world to be rich in faith and heirs of the kingdom, which he has promised to those who love him? 6 But you have dishonored the poor man. Are not the rich the ones who oppress you, and the ones who drag you into court? 7 Are they not the ones who blaspheme the honorable name by which you were called?
Katzpur
Not your average Mormon
Asking you questions has never proved very fruitful. You have ignored perhaps 99 out of every 100 questions that any Latter-day Saint has asked you. Maybe you can give us some sort of a clue as to how we're supposed to be able to guess which is the 1 in 100 question you're going to be willing to actually respond to.
I'm guessing you waited long enough to enjoy their hospitality, then, before you started vandalizing the place. Jeeze, I'm getting more impressed all the time.
Fish-Hunter
Rejoice in the Lord!
This happened over 12 years ago, so I really don't remember the details. What do you think about James chapter 2?
FFH
Veteran Member
The King James is in error, so I wouldn't consider it a friend of the family.Good to hear from you FFH. The woe in Isaiah does apply to one of us, doesn't it? How about joining me at the new thread called "Bible Revelation"? I am inviting all LDS Christians to that thread...since you guys all own a Bible too.
I threw out my King James, it was all ratty and falling apart at the seems anyway, and only own a truly restored Bible, that being the JST (Joseph Smith Translation)
I'll check it out.
Cute
FFH
Veteran Member
How about that last part of James chapter 2, how does that fit in with your theology ???
James 2
God hath chosen the poor of this world rich in faith—Salvation gained by keeping the whole law—Faith without works is dead.
Christ will call the halt, lame, blind, poor, etc., to the wedding feast, the rich will be too busy making money, I suppose, to take time out for a nice meal with Christ in his realm of existence.
Joseph Smith was reading James chapter 1 verse 5, in the King James, when he decided to pray about which church he should join. He was told, by Christ personally, after Christ appeared to him, that he should join none of the churches in existance at that time, they were all teaching the doctrines of men, mingled with scripture. The King James is no different, it is contains the doctrines of men, mixed with true scripture. It's a sublte deception that leads men away from exaltation with Christ.
"How to recognize pure religion"
James 1
If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God—Resist temptation—Be ye doers of the word—How to recognize pure religion.
5 If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth (criticizes) not; and it shall be given him.
The Lord will not criticize us for asking for help, in knowing the truth, about any given subject, he wants us to be educated in his eternal saving and exalting truths.
Katzpur
Not your average Mormon
You know, FFH, I'm sure all Latter-day Saints would agree with you that the JST is more accurate than the KJV, but you seriously make it sound as if the KJV is a piece of trash. If that were truly the Church's position, I think we'd hear the General Authorities saying so. According to the The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, "The Church uses many translations of the Bible in various languages. In English, the King James Version is used as the official Bible of the Church." If the Church held the KJV in such low esteem as you apparently do, I doubt it would be "the official Bible of the Church."
FFH
Veteran Member
We just use it cuz it's cheaper, have you seen the price of a JST ??? It's like a hundred bucks now, NO JOKE and we're talking a no frills (no tabs, no gold leaf, etc.) Bible. I paid probably 50 bucks for the exact same JST Bible over ten years ago, they've gone up since then obviously, I guess the RLDS (now called the Community of Christ church, who bought them out) is hurting for money too.
Our LDS edition of the King James has most of the important footnotes, but why read a Bible that makes you refer to the corrections in the footnotes. Most never look at the corrections/JST footnotes and therefore read the scriptures in error, WITHOUT realizing how it REALLY should read, that's the who TRAGEDY of the whole thing.
Remember the lady who stood up in conference and yelled something about the JST and she was escorted out ??? I don't know what she said specifically, I wish I could find a link quoting her, but apparently she said something to the affect, "why don't you use the JST ???" Correct me if I'm wrong.
I think it has to do with money, it's just cheaper to make our own LDS edtiion of the King James, with the JST corrections/footnotes.
I don't buy LDS King James Bibles or Book of Mormons anymore, they fall apart too fast, although I still do have a copy of the Book of Mormon, of course, just not an LDS edition of the King James, it totally fell apart and I never purchased another one. I just go online and do research now and compare. There are just too many errors to ignore, in the King James, which causes many to err.
Katzpur
Not your average Mormon
I'm pretty sure that the Community of Christ owns the copyright, for starters.
I know that's what you think, but if the KJV were as corrupt as you seem to think it is, do you really think the brethren would continue to use it as the "official translation" of the Church? Do you seriously think they'd let a little thing like money get in the way of the truth? I know I don't! Heck, the Church could subsidize the cost if money were the issue. I agree that the JST is superior to the KJV, but I just hate to see people in the Church tear down the KJV the way you do.
FFH
Veteran Member
I always post the King James version, from the LDS website, and compare it to the JST, so all can plainly see the errors.
It's something I feel compelled to do, more than anything else here on this forum. Even if I'm ignored, I still post the errors, and there are many.
I'm used to being ignored, I served a mission in Japan, remember ??? Most ignored us completely, it was a tough two years, but at least it was a VERY peaceful two years. I loved it. I had more than enough time to learn and reflect upon the gospel and it's role it would play in the coming years of my life. My testimony became solid as a rock after that experience.
I could have stayed there forever, but I missed Salt Lake and it's great skiing. Funny though, I've only been skiing a few times since returning over 20 years ago. Skiing lost it's allure, after I found knew life in Christ, literally. I know that sounds weird, but it was true, nothing seemed that exciting in this life, after living in Japan and serving a mission there. It was a great blessing to me, and I was totally unworthy and undeserving of such a great blessing, but God blessed me in spite of my weaknesses and sins.
It's something I feel compelled to do, more than anything else here on this forum. Even if I'm ignored, I still post the errors, and there are many.
I'm used to being ignored, I served a mission in Japan, remember ??? Most ignored us completely, it was a tough two years, but at least it was a VERY peaceful two years. I loved it. I had more than enough time to learn and reflect upon the gospel and it's role it would play in the coming years of my life. My testimony became solid as a rock after that experience.
I could have stayed there forever, but I missed Salt Lake and it's great skiing. Funny though, I've only been skiing a few times since returning over 20 years ago. Skiing lost it's allure, after I found knew life in Christ, literally. I know that sounds weird, but it was true, nothing seemed that exciting in this life, after living in Japan and serving a mission there. It was a great blessing to me, and I was totally unworthy and undeserving of such a great blessing, but God blessed me in spite of my weaknesses and sins.
FFH
Veteran Member
Money is definitely an issue in the LDS culture, why would we eat various flavored crystalized cow hoofs (jello) otherwise ???
I don't want a broken Bible, I want the real thing. The Lord took the time to restore it and make it available, so I'm going to use it.
It's all about saving a buck, I grew up in this culture, I know how it is, it's just plain cheaper to produce our own LDS edition with the JST footnotes/corrections. I don't object to this, what I object to is that no one ever pays attention to them (footnotes/corrections).
The JST footnotes in the LDS edition of the King James should at least be highlighted in red.
These errors in the King James are what cause threads like this, not to mention the missing pages ("many plain and precious things") that are no longer in there.
FFH
Veteran Member
Deseret Book link
Joseph Smith's New Translation of the Bible
by Scott H. Faulring, Kent P. Jackson and Robert J. Matthews
Hardcover Book
SKU 4772990 $99.95
This book compares the King James and the JST side by side, it's got the same cover as mine, so it must be the same side by side version I've got, although the description of the book doesn't mention this, so I could be wrong about that. I only paid 40 bucks for mine, over ten years ago, at Deseret Book, now it's 100 obviously.
There are both blatant and subtle errors in the King James that change the original meaning and teachings of the Bible.
Joseph Smith's New Translation of the Bible
by Scott H. Faulring, Kent P. Jackson and Robert J. Matthews
Hardcover Book
SKU 4772990 $99.95
This book compares the King James and the JST side by side, it's got the same cover as mine, so it must be the same side by side version I've got, although the description of the book doesn't mention this, so I could be wrong about that. I only paid 40 bucks for mine, over ten years ago, at Deseret Book, now it's 100 obviously.
There are both blatant and subtle errors in the King James that change the original meaning and teachings of the Bible.
FFH
Veteran Member
Why do you think we started a whole knew religion Katzpur ????
Because the Bible alone does not give us enough info concerning how we might have eternal life with God.
"Men are that they MIGHT have joy"
"Straight is the gate, and narrow is the way, and few there be that find it"
Jesus Christ said these words through scripture inspired by mortal men.
Matthew 7: 14
Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
3 Nephi 14: 14
Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
Because the Bible alone does not give us enough info concerning how we might have eternal life with God.
"Men are that they MIGHT have joy"
"Straight is the gate, and narrow is the way, and few there be that find it"
Jesus Christ said these words through scripture inspired by mortal men.
Matthew 7: 14
Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
3 Nephi 14: 14
Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.