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Why do people believe in Creationism despite its lack of testable predictions?

Why do people believe in Creationism despite a lack of testable predictions?

  • People do not understand why testable predictions are important

    Votes: 16 48.5%
  • Creationism has merit despite its lack of testable predictions

    Votes: 2 6.1%
  • Something else

    Votes: 15 45.5%

  • Total voters
    33

Ceridwen018

Well-Known Member
DreGod07 said:
Well, does religion address the why?

For that matther, Does religion adress the "how"?

Religion attempts to address the "Why" not the "how," and that's the whole problem.

I voted that people just simply do not understand why testable predictions are important. A lot of people today are basically illiterate when it comes to the scientific method, and problem solving.

The problem here is that the "how" that science has discovered (evolution) does not fit with the "why" that the religious want to hold on to. So, they tried to make up their own "how" in creationism. Unfortunately, this is called "suspension of reality," not to mention the fact that their creationism still doesn't succeed in producing a "how" at all.

Like any religious belief, no one is saying that people shouldn't be allowed to believe in creationism if they really want to. Creationists just need to realize that creationism is NOT science (by any definition of the word), and neither is it consistent with reality.
 

Dirty Penguin

Master Of Ceremony
Religion attempts to address the "Why" not the "how," and that's the whole problem.

I voted that people just simply do not understand why testable predictions are important. A lot of people today are basically illiterate when it comes to the scientific method, and problem solving.

The problem here is that the "how" that science has discovered (evolution) does not fit with the "why" that the religious want to hold on to. So, they tried to make up their own "how" in creationism. Unfortunately, this is called "suspension of reality," not to mention the fact that their creationism still doesn't succeed in producing a "how" at all.

Like any religious belief, no one is saying that people shouldn't be allowed to believe in creationism if they really want to. Creationists just need to realize that creationism is NOT science (by any definition of the word), and neither is it consistent with reality.

I agree.

I haven't really noticed the science community out to prove religion wrong or right. From my observation scientist usually stay clear of religion when informing the people of their findings.
 

roli

Born Again,Spirit Filled
You assume we are out to prove or disprove the existance of God when we try to explain evolution to you? Why is that? I have not come a cross a scientist that was set out to disprove the existance of a god.

It's not a question of being set out to do it,it evolves, no pun intended, into a mindset that is apparent only to creationsists, I guess, are you saying, the evolutionary arena has never developed a mindset against creation, God.
Then I guess your right ,I'm wrong ,with all the articles that I have read of scientists who claim to be or have once been devote atheists, are/were not out to directly or indirectly debunk God in some way shape or form.


......alright than !!
 

camanintx

Well-Known Member
It's not a question of being set out to do it,it evolves, no pun intended, into a mindset that is apparent only to creationsists, I guess, are you saying, the evolutionary arena has never developed a mindset against creation, God.
Then I guess your right ,I'm wrong ,with all the articles that I have read of scientists who claim to be or have once been devote atheists, are/were not out to directly or indirectly debunk God in some way shape or form.


......alright than !!

The purpose of science is to develop accurate and useful explanations of the world around us. If religion pushes an explanation that is neither accurate or useful, then it will find itself opposed by science whether the scientists intend to or not.
 

roli

Born Again,Spirit Filled
Firstly are there any testable predictions made by Creationism?

If there aren't why do people still believe in Creationism?
a) A lack of understanding of why testable predictions are so important?
b) There is sufficient merit in the structure of Creationism to warrant belief in it even in the abscence of testable predictions?
c) Something else?

It's called faith. the same thing we all utilize day in and day out.
Eating unfamiliar foods,driving our cars,flying in planes, depositing our money.
We seem to do so many things in one given day without insisting on emperical evidence,facts, statistics on probabilities or any formal testable perdictions made.

I don't see anyone in a given day jacking their cars up everyday before and after work,examining their brakes,lug nuts etc, that is just one aspect of life.
We are a people that take things for granted everyday, we beleive,trust and have faith in so much of what we can not always see or prove to be reliable or varifiable. We live 24/7 on assumptions,speculation,unsubstantiated hypothesis and guess work at best.Logic and reason come into play and make every situation just as the last ,making it easier to assume that all will be well as it always has.
There is no difference in creation or God, the same faith that we use daily to function in life is the same faith God requires of us to come to him,it's when we do this that he is proven,varified and substantiated in what he says regarding creation.

Maybe if we were more apt to use these testable perdiction methods on a second by second basis, everyday, such things the terrible events of 911 could have been prevented.
Although truth, highly unlikely of it ever being fully carried out by man, because this is not the people we are,we live life on the basis of what happened last time or what others said or on what others have done before, we live by faith which is reliance,confidence, trust.
 

Dirty Penguin

Master Of Ceremony
The purpose of science is to develop accurate and useful explanations of the world around us. If religion pushes an explanation that is neither accurate or useful, then it will find itself opposed by science whether the scientists intend to or not.

Couldn't have said it better myself.......

Thank you.....
 

Dirty Penguin

Master Of Ceremony
It's not a question of being set out to do it,it evolves, no pun intended, into a mindset that is apparent only to creationsists

But how does this become the problem of those who approach the world and life from a scientific point of view? It is in the mind of creationist that big bad bully science it out to get them. Which again leads be back to saying....We have legitamate questions that the bible nor any theologian can answer......

What would you have us do since the bible nor any theologian can answer these questions? Should we have faith and trust that God will reveal the answers to us? Think hard before you answer that.......................OK long enough..........What would you say if I told you that maybe IT IS God that is allowing us to discover what the book can't answer....Would that satisfy your curiosity? If the answer is yes then your attempts to wear out this forum of creationism vs. evolution is futile..... If your answer is NO then you may need to explain how you know what you God is thinking....(just my opinion)....

See, we can agree that a flu virus can evolve and adapt. Thousands of christians line up at the clinic or their doctors office to receive their complimentary flu shot every year hoping not to catch it. We understand how this virus works and some of its strains that has helped scientist develop a treatment. And it is people like you who reap the benefits but turn your nose up when we say "it's because we understand the evolutionary process and how it adapts we are better equipped to handle this virus..."

I guess, are you saying, the evolutionary arena has never developed a mindset against creation, God.
Then I guess your right ,I'm wrong ,with all the articles that I have read of scientists who claim to be or have once been devote atheists, are/were not out to directly or indirectly debunk God in some way shape or form.

Is this ALL of the science community that profess the theory of evolution or is this a select few? I personally have not read anything from a scientist where he or she has put a spot lot on your way of life. If you have found such an article that hasn't already been refuted by a fellow scientist please share. I can tell you, more often than not, you will see some creationist trying to speak on evolution and not know what in the world they're talking about. I saw today on youtube a guy who had a bachelors degree in chemistry speaking on evolution as though it was his true field of study. What next, butchers who on the weekends build rockets for NASA?
 

Ceridwen018

Well-Known Member
roli said:
It's called faith. the same thing we all utilize day in and day out.
Eating unfamiliar foods,driving our cars,flying in planes, depositing our money.
We seem to do so many things in one given day without insisting on emperical evidence,facts, statistics on probabilities or any formal testable perdictions made.

This is wrong. When I step onto a plane, I have faith/hope that it will not crash in transit, but it is not blind faith. My faith in the plane is based on evidence, such as the probability that the plane will crash (determined by statistically calculating how many planes crash each year over how many flights take off in total) which is very small, the fact that this particular plane has passed mechanical and technical inspections, and that my pilot has completed rigorous aviation training. All the evidence suggests that this flight should be unconventional and safe, and so I have trust that it will be so based on that hard evidence.

When you choose to believe in the supernatural, you are doing so based on blind faith, because there is no evidence to suggest that it is true. In fact, you could argue that the evidence points away from the supernatural.

The fact remains that creationism does not contain any testable hypotheses, and therefore is pretty much as far from science as you can get.
 

sandandfoam

Veteran Member
Why do people believe in Creationism despite a lack of testable predictions?

Same reason some people think Elvis is living in Wales.
 

yossarian22

Resident Schizophrenic
It's called faith. the same thing we all utilize day in and day out.
Eating unfamiliar foods,driving our cars,flying in planes, depositing our money.
We seem to do so many things in one given day without insisting on emperical evidence,facts, statistics on probabilities or any formal testable perdictions made.
There are statistics for every single thing you have mentioned.
Off the top of my head, 1 in every 500 car trips ends in a fatal accident. Thats an old number.
I don't see anyone in a given day jacking their cars up everyday before and after work,examining their brakes,lug nuts etc, that is just one aspect of life.
Mechanical failure rate is not the leading cause of accidents; response time is. Speed limits are, for the most part, useless.
There is no difference in creation or God, the same faith that we use daily to function in life is the same faith God requires of us to come to him,it's when we do this that he is proven,varified and substantiated in what he says regarding creation.
There is a huge difference between extrapolation and blind faith. One is seated in reality.

Maybe if we were more apt to use these testable perdiction methods on a second by second basis, everyday, such things the terrible events of 911 could have been prevented.
Probably not. Why do you think there are so many conspiracy theories about 9/11? People have trouble accepting the fact that they can be killed by the inherent disorder and randomness of the world
 

Darkness

Psychoanalyst/Marxist
roli said:
It's called faith. the same thing we all utilize day in and day out.
Eating unfamiliar foods,driving our cars,flying in planes, depositing our money.
We seem to do so many things in one given day without insisting on emperical evidence,facts, statistics on probabilities or any formal testable perdictions made.

This is not an analogous comparison. We know approximately how many car crashes there are, we know from experience that hardly anyone dies from unfamiliar foods, we know that hardly any planes crash, and that our money is basically safe when we deposit it. All of these are educated guesses on our part. I used to be afraid of windshield wipers, but from experience, I learned that they will not harm me. I did not simply have faith they wouldn't harm me.

What reliable evidence do we have for God's existence? The Greeks thought there were gods on Mount Olympus, Christians believe Jesus is God, Muslims only worship Allah. Which God are we to believe in. Imagine if we had this sort of disinformation in our daily life about Europe, which no one in America has ever seen. Some reporters say Europe is totally barren and that only plants live there. Another reporter says Europe is full of Africans and another says Europe was conquered by the Japanese. Would you not have ample reason to doubt the very existence of Europe?

Note: My analogy might not be correct. Anybody, please correct me if it is not.
 

Aasimar

Atheist
Well, is it logical to suppose that science can ever disprove a Creator?

And although scientific method may be able to go a long way towards proving certain theories, it fails miserably in the "why" department, imho.

That's right, and where there's no scientific theory, insert "God" and PRESTO! explanation.

Ever occur that we just don't why?

Why is the universe around? Dunno.
Any magical beings around that created it? Dunno.
 

roli

Born Again,Spirit Filled
This is wrong. When I step onto a plane, I have faith/hope that it will not crash in transit, but it is not blind faith. My faith in the plane is based on evidence, such as the probability that the plane will crash (determined by statistically calculating how many planes crash each year over how many flights take off in total) which is very small, the fact that this particular plane has passed mechanical and technical inspections, and that my pilot has completed rigorous aviation training. All the evidence suggests that this flight should be unconventional and safe, and so I have trust that it will be so based on that hard evidence.
Who said believing in God is blind faith ,you obviously have'nt expereinced God's hand in your life nor comprehended the world around you and you apparently have'nt heard some of your own evolutionists ,atheists and agnostic scientists claim the probabilities of the complexities of this universe and all life coming together by random chance are out of this world, this includes Dawkins, but I'm sure we'll never hear the reservations he had with the age old evolutionary theory regarding random chance and natural selection.
I would pull quotes from some famous scientists concerning their own doubts concerning the theory of evolution but we would be playing tennis until Jesus returns.
The assumption of such stats that you rely on are only that,they are not fact ,so you remain in faith relying in the percision of the mechanics, the equipment,slight chance of fatality, oh, then there is the enviromental conditions to contend with.

That evidence is circumstantial at best, specifically at the moment of inspection.
I suggest you look around you and consider the same probabilities of creation by intelligent design that you just stated you adhere to and stop insisting on proof for God, something that you yourself can't even possess to function on a daily basis.

When you choose to believe in the supernatural, you are doing so based on blind faith, because there is no evidence to suggest that it is true. In fact, you could argue that the evidence points away from the supernatural.
Not only have I had an ecounter with God through the power of his Holy Spirit, but the evidence of nature,the human eye,the atmosphere 7 percise mixture of gases, carbon formation, the positioning of the sun and the moon from the earth ,the axis of the earth in proportion to the sun, the hydrological cycle, the hummingbird itself is a wonder to many scientists, the heart beat.
Next time you take a breath thank the God lord for giving it to you, it could be your last, you just don't know, we all just don't know what awaits us around any given corner.
If that is not living according to blind faith ,this conversation is over.

The fact remains that creationism does not contain any testable hypotheses, and therefore is pretty much as far from science as you can get
If you call evolving from inanimate matter testable ,:banghead3
 

Mike182

Flaming Queer
Firstly are there any testable predictions made by Creationism?

If there aren't why do people still believe in Creationism?
a) A lack of understanding of why testable predictions are so important?
b) There is sufficient merit in the structure of Creationism to warrant belief in it even in the abscence of testable predictions?
c) Something else?

c) something else... but i am only speaking for myself.

i believe in the divine creation of the universe, though i don't subscribe to any one particular mythos about said creation.

my belief in creationism is not actually based on anything to do with creation, it is based upon my religious experience of God in other areas of my life, and from that i have extrapolated a belief in creationism as the next logical step from accepting my belief in God.
 

blackout

Violet.
I see from my own experience (as well)
that the living universe is creative
(& "creatively interactive").
My whole "reality experience" is as alive
as I am alive in it.
We create endlessly new realities together.

I don't know anything about the hidden mysteries of origin.
The best I could do would be to speculate.
(but even that does not interest me all that much)

Certainly in MY experience,
nothing of direct PERSONAL import/illumination
has ever come to me via a test tube.
(save maybe a homemade bong assembled from... oh never mind.)

But I will say difinitively that God (the Living Universe),
is a creative "force"...
the very fabric of life itself...
the fabric of all creation...
and the master weaver both.
We weave together.

I will vote "something else"
 

Dirty Penguin

Master Of Ceremony
Imagine if we had this sort of disinformation in our daily life about Europe, which no one in America has ever seen. Some reporters say Europe is totally barren and that only plants live there. Another reporter says Europe is full of Africans and another says Europe was conquered by the Japanese. Would you not have ample reason to doubt the very existence of Europe?

Note: My analogy might not be correct. Anybody, please correct me if it is not.

I get it. Until we are able to verify we have no way of doubting the information given. This is another reason why I say science stays clear of religion. Scientist aren't set out put to prove that God does not exist. Religion has given us nothing to test. On the other hand scientist has collected huge amounts of data and as I said earlier the best some creationist can do is send some one with a bachelores degree in chemistry to refute evolution.

YouTube - Earth is 6,000 Years Old

Check this guy out. This stuff is truely funny.
 
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