Should a woman have to see a sonogram before receiving an abortion?

[Reverend Rick]

I think we should have all men witness an abortion video before they unzip their pants to have a bit of nookie with someone not their legal wife.

How's that strike you, Rick?

Most men are pigs. Do you really think that would destroy the mood?

 

[Booko]

Most men are pigs. Do you really think that would destroy the mood?

"Noble have I created thee. Why dost thou abase thyself?"

 

[rojse]

Wouldn't any person who decided to have an abortion have thought long and hard about their decision before they begin the procedure? It isn't just a spur-of-the-moment thing, after all. You need to discuss it with the foetus's father, make an appointment, wait in the waiting room at the clinic, sign consensus forms, and so forth. I am sure that any potential mother would have thought about the procedure during all of this waiting time.

 

[Reverend Rick]

Wouldn't any person who decided to have an abortion have thought long and hard about their decision before they begin the procedure? It isn't just a spur-of-the-moment thing, after all. You need to discuss it with the foetus's father, make an appointment, wait in the waiting room at the clinic, sign consensus forms, and so forth. I am sure that any potential mother would have thought about the procedure during all of this waiting time.

I disagree. I believe some of these clinics trivialize the procedure. While it is your choice, (for the mean time), It should be an informed choice with all the options presented, not just the option that the clinic provides. I believe they have a conflict of interest.

 

[rojse]

Even should the clinics trivialise the procedure, the people themselves must make a conscious decision before they turn up to the clinic. They make the decision themselves, before they arrive there, without any trivialisation.

The option that the clinic provides is the one chosen by the aborters, isn't it? It's not as if they have went to the abortion clinic for an ultrasound. There were two options - keep the foetus, or abort it. There is no middle ground in there to choose.

I do believe that this conflict of interest you are concerned about is also present for call services for potential mothers, and some of those call centres are affiliated to religions. Is that also a conflict of interest that you are concerned with?

 

[Reverend Rick]

I do believe that this conflict of interest you are concerned about is also present for call services for potential mothers, and some of those call centres are affiliated to religions. Is that also a conflict of interest that you are concerned with?

Yes, the call services have a conflict of interest as well. I am concerned that a mother might regret her decision that a clinic influenced.

Can you say that you are concerned about the mothers who kept and had their babies that were influenced by the call center? I hope you are not telling me that there are mothers who regret having a child. Can you imagine as a child hearing something like that from your mother?

 

[Storm]

Yes, the call services have a conflict of interest as well. I am concerned that a mother might regret her decision that a clinic influenced.

Can you say that you are concerned about the mothers who kept and had their babies that were influenced by the call center? I hope you are not telling me that there are mothers who regret having a child. Can you imagine as a child hearing something like that from your mother?

Sad but true, Rick. They are out there.

 

[rojse]

I never stated that, and I apologise for accidentally conveying that viewpoint.

You stated your concern about a conflict of interest. That is a fair concern. Probably what I should have said, with a bit more skill in language, is that any area concerned with abortion should have unbiased counsellors. Not only for abortion clinics, but call centres, too. Any counselling service should allow mothers to come to their own decision, not be influenced, no matter how noble their intentions are.

And your answer did not address my first two statements, either.

 

[Reverend Rick]

Wouldn't any person who decided to have an abortion have thought long and hard about their decision before they begin the procedure?

I am sure some do, but not all.

It isn't just a spur-of-the-moment thing, after all. You need to discuss it with the foetus's father, make an appointment, wait in the waiting room at the clinic, sign consensus forms, and so forth. I am sure that any potential mother would have thought about the procedure during all of this waiting time.

Many women do not even tell the father or anyone else.

 

[rojse]

From my experiences of what other people have said about their relationships, both of those statements are incorrect. The female knew who the father was, and told the father that she was pregnant before deciding on the next course of action. One person spent an entire week discussing this matter with his partner before they decided on an abortion. I would hardly call that a spur of the moment event.

Whether the decision itself is spur of the moment or not, the woman still needs to make an apointment, and the time between making the apointment and the event itself is not instantaneous. There is plenty of time to consider the event itself.

All of that said, I have never been directly involved in such a situation, so I would not know for sure. Perhaps someone with previous experience in this area could fill us in.

 

[rojse]

Can you say that you are concerned about the mothers who kept and had their babies that were influenced by the call center? I hope you are not telling me that there are mothers who regret having a child. Can you imagine as a child hearing something like that from your mother?

Reconsidering this idea, I would say that some children adopted out at birth by their parent, not though being orphaned, but by a personal decision by their parent/s, would have heard that from their parent should they have become reunited.

 

[Reverend Rick]

I like to think they loved their child so much that they let the child go to a better life with a family that could provide the things they themselves could not.

My opinions are skewed. I still support a woman's right to choose, but I am disappointed with some of their decisions. My feelings have increased greatly with my first grandson in the picture.

 

[rojse]

I like to think they loved their child so much that they let the child go to a better life with a family that could provide the things they themselves could not.

Would you say that this statement applies to all parents, without reservation?

 

[Reverend Rick]

Would you say that this statement applies to all parents, without reservation?

Of course not. I believe many are like I described, while others are not. Regardless, the child has adoptive parents who want and love the baby.

 

[PureX]

Yes, the call services have a conflict of interest as well. I am concerned that a mother might regret her decision that a clinic influenced.

Can you say that you are concerned about the mothers who kept and had their babies that were influenced by the call center? I hope you are not telling me that there are mothers who regret having a child. Can you imagine as a child hearing something like that from your mother?

Welcome to reality.

People will have regrets. That's the way life is.

 

[PureX]

I like to think they loved their child so much that they let the child go to a better life with a family that could provide the things they themselves could not.

My opinions are skewed. I still support a woman's right to choose, but I am disappointed with some of their decisions. My feelings have increased greatly with my first grandson in the picture.

People will make bad choices. People will make bad decisions. This is the cost of freedom.

 

[Hope]

I think it's emotional sabotage.

Sabotage? More like a kick-in-the-pants to the woman's conscience. And rightly so.

 

[kadzbiz]

Sometimes the decision is hard enough without making it more guiltful.

 

[ladyhawke]

The decision to have an abortion is not an easy one no matter what the circumstances of the woman involved, SHE has to live with her choice everyday for the rest of her life,speaking from personal experience its is a harrowing ordeal without seeing a sonogram,that said..i saw my twins and felt them moving around inside me and was 18wks pregnant when i had my abortion,do i wish i had made a different choice...sometimes..BUT my life then as now is not right and i could not have looked after them and my 9yr old.Life is about choice and sometimes we have to do what is right for ourselves at the time regardless of the repercussions..having a sonogram did'nt make my decision any easier or harder..at the time i felt i had NO choice but to do what i did.

 

[spirittalker101]

Pro-Lifers cry what if that embryo grew up to be a genious?
Pro-Choicers say what if it became a mass murderer?

Pro-Lifers say doesn't everyone deserves a chance?
Pro-Choicers say at what price?

Pro-Lifers look at the removal of an unwanted embryo as murder
Pro-Choicers see a woman standing up for herself and that embryo

Pro-Lifers see an infant born
Pro-Choicers see that baby and worry

Pro-Lifers make sure that baby, if need be, goes up for adoption
Pro-Choicers make sure that the babies have safe homes to live in

Pro-Lifers move on to the next embryo that needs saving
Pro-Choicers help the families when they can't do it because no one else is there.

Just because abortion is part of the choice doesn't make it wrong.
What happens to those babies is more important than if it lives or dies before it is a child.


I wrote that in another forum and didn't get anything back on it. These are fights that I have heard from both sides.

I feel that if the woman wants the abortion, No man should be allowed to stand in her way. Especially if he has nothing to do with the baby in the first place. I would rather see a woman get an abortion then see her give birth and beat the child or leave it for dead in a trash can.