Problems at Church

[JayHawes]

I was just wondering, do any Christians here or anyone who visits a Christian Church have any problems with what their Church does, or what goes on in it, or maybe a question of doctrine?

 

[sojourner]

I would say that most of us do. The Church is made up of fallible human beings, who clash with each other at times.

 

[Mister_T]

I was just wondering, do any Christians here or anyone who visits a Christian Church have any problems with what their Church does, or what goes on in it, or maybe a question of doctrine?

Yes I do. Which is part of the reason why I'm not attending any at the moment.

 

[Lindsey-Loo]

I was just wondering, do any Christians here or anyone who visits a Christian Church have any problems with what their Church does, or what goes on in it, or maybe a question of doctrine?

Nope, I'm pretty much good with everything that is done in my congregation. I have a few questions, but nothing major. If I didn't agree with something, I would leave.

 

[JayHawes]

I dont think its a good idea to look for a perfect Church, and that if you disagreed with something to leave. If we always run when things go wrong nothing will be fixed. Why not stay and fight for what you know is right (or wrong)?

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

I was just wondering, do any Christians here or anyone who visits a Christian Church have any problems with what their Church does, or what goes on in it, or maybe a question of doctrine?

The mind boggles at what you might be referring to......:cover:

I think it is as important to be as comfortable in your Church,
as it is to be comfortable in your skin.

I do have some views different to those held by the mainstream of my church...
It doesn't bother them and so it doesn't bother me.

 

[!Fluffy!]

I would say that most of us do. The Church is made up of fallible human beings, who clash with each other at times.

i am with sojourner on this.

 

[Lindsey-Loo]

I dont think its a good idea to look for a perfect Church, and that if you disagreed with something to leave. If we always run when things go wrong nothing will be fixed. Why not stay and fight for what you know is right (or wrong)?

I would discuss with my elders of course. But if i truly felt my church was doing something that is not scriptural, and they refused to hear me out, then I would leave.

I wouldn't just pack up and go without telling them why.

But of course, I love my congregation, they love me, and everything seems to be scriptural there, so I really don't see myself ever leaving.

 

[athanasius]

I was just wondering, do any Christians here or anyone who visits a Christian Church have any problems with what their Church does, or what goes on in it, or maybe a question of doctrine?

I have never had to worry about a question of doctrine. However I have visited other Catholic churches that do not celebrate the liturgy in line with the Catholic Churches teachings. Shameless meaningless acts such as irrreverent music and instruments, Mimes, use of illicit and sometimes invalid matter in the bread used for Mass, and dancing is brought into the Sacred Holy Sacrifice of the Mass in some parishes that abuse the Churches offcial teaching on worship. In fact, the Pope(Benedict 16th) will soon be coming out with a reaffirment on offical giudlines to what tis acceptable in the liturgy. In it he will also make changes that are aimed at getting parishes back to the reverence and solemnity of the mass and hopefully will help do away with the abuses. That is the only problem I have ever seen in my own church.

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

I have never had to worry about a question of doctrine. However I have visited other Catholic churches that do not celebrate the liturgy in line with the Catholic Churches teachings. Shameless meaningless acts such as irrreverent music and instruments, Mimes, use of illicit and sometimes invalid matter in the bread used for Mass, and dancing is brought into the Sacred Holy Sacrifice of the Mass in some parishes that abuse the Churches offcial teaching on worship. In fact, the Pope(Benedict 16th) will soon be coming out with a reaffirment on offical giudlines to what tis acceptable in the liturgy. In it he will also make changes that are aimed at getting parishes back to the reverence and solemnity of the mass and hopefully will help do away with the abuses. That is the only problem I have ever seen in my own church.

That is an interesting observation and one that I would personally go along with in my own Church. Not so much for dogma reasons... but mainly because I do not care for The happy clappy style in church. It may well be a Joyful style of service and it may well have its place... however I prefer A service to be quiet and reverential. I Have no problem with hymns or psalms sung to an Organ or Piano. Guitars and saxophones are just too much.

Informal services of worship that do not include a Communion can follow any pattern they chose... I will not be attending them, so it will not be my choice.

For these reasons I prefer what we call Anglo-Catholic churches. I do not have trouble with the monthly communion service that include some Child input as this is a process of inclusion and learning.

We have recently installed what we call "Prayer mats" for when we have a young children's service. during quiet periods of the service they are required to sit on the mats and keep silent. It worked like a dream. even with those that have behaviour problems.

 

[Mister_T]

I dont think its a good idea to look for a perfect Church, and that if you disagreed with something to leave. If we always run when things go wrong nothing will be fixed. Why not stay and fight for what you know is right (or wrong)?

Because if I stand up for what I feel is right, then I will surely be looked down upon as one of the "lost" because I am not part of the collective mind. What I feel is right goes against their core values and beliefs. There are some sermons I can't sit through because of the negative message being preached.

I'd rather not deal with that negetivity, so I just don't attend.

 

[!Fluffy!]

I have never had to worry about a question of doctrine. However I have visited other Catholic churches that do not celebrate the liturgy in line with the Catholic Churches teachings. Shameless meaningless acts such as irrreverent music and instruments, Mimes, use of illicit and sometimes invalid matter in the bread used for Mass, and dancing is brought into the Sacred Holy Sacrifice of the Mass in some parishes that abuse the Churches offcial teaching on worship. In fact, the Pope(Benedict 16th) will soon be coming out with a reaffirment on offical giudlines to what tis acceptable in the liturgy. In it he will also make changes that are aimed at getting parishes back to the reverence and solemnity of the mass and hopefully will help do away with the abuses. That is the only problem I have ever seen in my own church.

omg MIMES!?:cover:

 

[!Fluffy!]

Because if I stand up for what I feel is right, then I will surely be looked down upon as one of the "lost" because I am not part of the collective mind. What I feel is right goes against their core values and beliefs. There are some sermons I can't sit through because of the negative message being preached.

I'd rather not deal with that negetivity, so I just don't attend.

The last time i went to the church my husband attends every week, i literally ran out the door because of this. it was the weirdest feeling i have ever had in a church, and had more to do with the messenger than the message. it was that ever so slight twist of a verse here and a verse there and i finally couldn't take it.

sometimes i wish i could just retire to an eastern orthodox monastery and tend a garden or something...

 

[JayHawes]

That is an interesting observation and one that I would personally go along with in my own Church. Not so much for dogma reasons... but mainly because I do not care for The happy clappy style in church. It may well be a Joyful style of service and it may well have its place... however I prefer A service to be quiet and reverential. I Have no problem with hymns or psalms sung to an Organ or Piano. Guitars and saxophones are just too much.

Informal services of worship that do not include a Communion can follow any pattern they chose... I will not be attending them, so it will not be my choice.

For these reasons I prefer what we call Anglo-Catholic churches. I do not have trouble with the monthly communion service that include some Child input as this is a process of inclusion and learning.

We have recently installed what we call "Prayer mats" for when we have a young children's service. during quiet periods of the service they are required to sit on the mats and keep silent. It worked like a dream. even with those that have behaviour problems.

I understand that many of us prefer different styles of worship in the service. But the bible says


Ps 47:1To the chief Musician, A Psalm for the sons of Korah. O clap your hands, all ye people; shout unto God with the voice of triumph.
Ps 47:6Sing praises to God, sing praises: sing praises unto our King, sing praises.

Ps 35:27Let them shout for joy, and be glad, that favour my righteous cause: yea, let them say continually, Let the LORD be magnified, which hath pleasure in the prosperity of his servant."

Praising God is supposed to be joyous, not quiet as though God has not done anything for you. Like the Prophet Jeremiah said "its like fire shut up in my bones" Jer 20:9. When the presense of God enters some people just can't sit down, and be quiet, they have to praise God for what he has done, and for who he is.

Ps 150:1Praise ye the LORD. Praise God in his sanctuary: praise him in the firmament of his power.
Ps 150:2Praise him for his mighty acts: praise him according to his excellent greatness.
Ps 150:3Praise him with the sound of the trumpet: praise him with the psaltery and harp.
Ps 150:4Praise him with the timbrel and dance: praise him with stringed instruments and organs.
Ps 150:5Praise him upon the loud cymbals: praise him upon the high sounding cymbals.
Ps 150:6Let every thing that hath breath praise the LORD. Praise ye the LORD

Theres nothing wrong with guitars or saxophones, those who play them, specialize at that instrument, and if they choose to praise God by playing that instrument (or dancing, or being joyous) why would any Christian object to it?

...................................................................
Heb 10:25Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together:run: , as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.

 

[JayHawes]

Because if I stand up for what I feel is right, then I will surely be looked down upon as one of the "lost" because I am not part of the collective mind. What I feel is right goes against their core values and beliefs. There are some sermons I can't sit through because of the negative message being preached.

I'd rather not deal with that negetivity, so I just don't attend.

What kind of negative messages?

But also, the rejection you had at one Church does not justify you not attending any Church. For although we will never find a perfect Church, we are commanded not to forsake the assembling of ourselves together. So if a problem does arise in any other Church, find scriptural proof, and take it to the pastor, if the pastor rejects the bible, then i can see a reason. However (not to say that you did) if you stay quiet and dont voice why you feel or dont feel a certain way, :thud: you'll be just like this smilly face.

 

[JayHawes]

The last time i went to the church my husband attends every week, i literally ran out the door because of this. it was the weirdest feeling i have ever had in a church, and had more to do with the messenger than the message. it was that ever so slight twist of a verse here and a verse there and i finally couldn't take it.

sometimes i wish i could just retire to an eastern orthodox monastery and tend a garden or something...

Sometimes we may not notice that our interpretation of a verse is slightly twisted so when we here the untwisted truth, we run. Now i am not saying that the messanger didn't twist the truth....but Jesus was accused of twisting the truth. And becuase of this he was crucified. People dont like the truth, or the untwisting of what they though wasn't twisted...but we should learn to listen and not reject everything, and to study as Paul commanded (2 TImothy 2:15). I am appauled at the amount of people who dont read the bible, dont study it and reject messages preached, and still will not study to understand what, how or why the preacher said what he did.

Joh 8:47 -He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.

Joh 8:48 -Then answered the Jews, and said unto him, Say we not well that thou art a Samaritan, and hast a devil?Joh 8:49Jesus answered, I have not a devil; but I honour my Father, and ye do dishonour me.

Just like them, when we disagree with what convicts us, we accuse the messanger of something, maybe his past is dirty....but we ignore the message preached, why?

2ti 4:3 -For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;(they listen to what they want to listen to) 2ti 4:4 -And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

I understand that many of us prefer different styles of worship in the service. But the bible says


Ps 47:1To the chief Musician, A Psalm for the sons of Korah. O clap your hands, all ye people; shout unto God with the voice of triumph.
Ps 47:6Sing praises to God, sing praises: sing praises unto our King, sing praises.

Ps 35:27Let them shout for joy, and be glad, that favour my righteous cause: yea, let them say continually, Let the LORD be magnified, which hath pleasure in the prosperity of his servant."

Praising God is supposed to be joyous, not quiet as though God has not done anything for you. Like the Prophet Jeremiah said "its like fire shut up in my bones" Jer 20:9. When the presense of God enters some people just can't sit down, and be quiet, they have to praise God for what he has done, and for who he is.

Ps 150:1Praise ye the LORD. Praise God in his sanctuary: praise him in the firmament of his power.
Ps 150:2Praise him for his mighty acts: praise him according to his excellent greatness.
Ps 150:3Praise him with the sound of the trumpet: praise him with the psaltery and harp.
Ps 150:4Praise him with the timbrel and dance: praise him with stringed instruments and organs.
Ps 150:5Praise him upon the loud cymbals: praise him upon the high sounding cymbals.
Ps 150:6Let every thing that hath breath praise the LORD. Praise ye the LORD

Theres nothing wrong with guitars or saxophones, those who play them, specialize at that instrument, and if they choose to praise God by playing that instrument (or dancing, or being joyous) why would any Christian object to it?

...................................................................
Heb 10:25Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together:run: , as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.

The traditional singing the psalms to chant is a beautiful experience that has sadly lapsed from most churches. People don't even understand pointing these days.

However the Psalms are actually a Jewish tradition But as they tend to only have a chanter these days. I don't think any one sings them in this fashion any more. " O clap your hands, all ye people; shout unto God with the voice of triumph."

A traditional Catholic Latin mass Is a Joy to witness.
As is a full sung Anglo Catholic Communion service.

It does not take clapping and an orchestra or dancing in the isles.
to create a joyous worship. Or to be inspired By Gods spirit.

But if that is what some people feel they need. so be it. amen.

 

[Mister_T]

What kind of negative messages?

Where do I begin? Every Sunday all you hear is how they're supposedly going to Heaven and how all other groups of people are supposedly going to Hell and how they want to oppress and conform people to become part of the collective mind that is their church. The whole time I keep thinking to myself "Who do you think you are?"

Not to mention if you're not an exact copy of them, they'll shun you. Or if you have a differing thought or opinion, they will harass you endlessly until you conform to their thinking. If you're different from them, they look down upon you and and consider themselves better. No thanks.

But also, the rejection you had at one Church does not justify you not attending any Church. For although we will never find a perfect Church, we are commanded not to forsake the assembling of ourselves together. So if a problem does arise in any other Church, find scriptural proof, and take it to the pastor, if the pastor rejects the bible, then i can see a reason. However (not to say that you did) if you stay quiet and dont voice why you feel or dont feel a certain way, :thud: you'll be just like this smilly face

My faith has taken somewhat of a nose dive as of late. Church would be counter productive and a waste of mine and the pastor's time. I'd rather not be a hypocrite. Voicing my opinion would get me a ban or a forced withdrawl for sure.

Plus I don't feel the need to affiliate with any church to have a relationship with God. I can do that myself.

 

[Aqualung]

I was just wondering, do any Christians here or anyone who visits a Christian Church have any problems with what their Church does, or what goes on in it, or maybe a question of doctrine?

Not anymore, but in the past I had lots of disagreements with my churches. Especially the Quaker church. The baptist church was okay, until I found out the pastor was using the sensitive information his members told him (in his capacity as pastor) to blackmail them into doing unfavourable things. The Lutheran church I had the least amount of disagreement with, but probably only because I was so young.

 

[Scuba Pete]

I left my congregation over a year ago now. It seemed that many believed in WWJB (Who Would Jesus Bomb) and I just can't be a part of that. I have been to 20+ churches since then, but have not found a home. Go figure.