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If there is a hell, what percentage of humans should go there?

If there is a hell, what percentage of humans should go there?

  • 99%

    Votes: 6 22.2%
  • 98%

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 97%

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 96%

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 95%

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Other

    Votes: 21 77.8%

  • Total voters
    27

Apostle John

“Go ahead, look up Revelation 6”
I suppose one could say Jesus was a non-Christian while under the Mosaic Law (Romans 10:4) because dead Jesus went to hell - Acts 2:27
Jesus' ransom covers MANY according to Matthew 20:28
Everyone in biblical hell ends up 'delivered up' ( resurrected) out of biblical hell, then, emptied-out hell/grave is cast empty into that symbolic lake of fire defined as the ' second death ' for vacated un-populated biblical hell.
Wicked people end up, Not in any hell, but the wicked are ' destroyed forever ' according to Psalms 92:7; 104:35; Proverbs 2:21-22

Yes, only a ' little flock ' go to Heaven because they are like the people described at Luke 22:28-30; Daniel 7:18 who are called to be saints/holy ones.
Jesus' ' other sheep ' can be part of the humble meek people who will inherit the Earth as Jesus promised - Matt.5:5 from Psalm 37:9-11.
When I wrote non-Christians, I meant today, those that don’t follow the Lord Jesus Christ and the Bible.’destroyed forever’ is interesting, I’ll look up the Hebrew for that.
You are free to believe whatever you want to believe since you have free will.
No disrespect but I think you are following a religion of a past dispensation.

Dispensation
  1. the divine ordering of the affairs of the world.
  2. an appointment, arrangement, or favor, as by God.
  3. a divinely appointed order or age:
e.g. the old Mosaic, or Jewish, dispensation; the new gospel, or Christian, dispensation.

Definition of dispensation | Dictionary.com

Since humanity has now entered a new age, the divine ordering of the affairs of the world is no longer through the Christian dispensation.
I go by strength of evidence.
 

Exaltist Ethan

Bridging the Gap Between Believers and Skeptics
@Trailblazer

As a Baha'i I have a question about your religion. If Hell is just the remoteness of God, then it would make sense that God is the source of all good that happens to a person. Would you say that God is the source of happiness? And if so, how can the atheists and anti-theists still achieve happiness without God? And is it possible to achieve peace, serenity and other good feelings without God, as certain religions have already demonstrated, like Buddhism?
 

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
When I wrote non-Christians, I meant today, those that don’t follow the Lord Jesus Christ and the Bible.’destroyed forever’ is interesting, I’ll look up the Hebrew for that.I go by strength of evidence.
Thank you for your reply.
At Matthew 25:31-34,37 we do know those who Jesus' counts as figurative ' sheep' are saved (delivered / rescued) - Rev. 7:14,9; Isaiah 26:20.
The good news (gospel) of God's Kingdom (thy kingdom come... ) would be declared world wide to the -> nations - Matt. 24:14; Acts 1:8.
Since new people are born each day, then it is Not to every single person but definitely to the: nations - Psalm 2
And because Jesus reads hearts and we can't, then Jesus could choose people with right-hearted leanings at his Glory Time to be a 'sheep'.
Besides ' destroyed forever ' (Psalms 92:7; 104:35; Prov. 2:21-22) I find Jeremiah mentions: perpetual sleep - Jeremiah 51:39 and verse 57.
 

Apostle John

“Go ahead, look up Revelation 6”
Thank you for your reply.
At Matthew 25:31-34,37 we do know those who Jesus' counts as figurative ' sheep' are saved (delivered / rescued) - Rev. 7:14,9; Isaiah 26:20.
The good news (gospel) of God's Kingdom (thy kingdom come... ) would be declared world wide to the -> nations - Matt. 24:14; Acts 1:8.
Since new people are born each day, then it is Not to every single person but definitely to the: nations - Psalm 2
And because Jesus reads hearts and we can't, then Jesus could choose people with right-hearted leanings at his Glory Time to be a 'sheep'.
Besides ' destroyed forever ' (Psalms 92:7; 104:35; Prov. 2:21-22) I find Jeremiah mentions: perpetual sleep - Jeremiah 51:39 and verse 57.
Thank you, The separation of the sheep and the goats judgment is at the end of the Tribulation. The Tribulation will have an impact on people‘s hearts who go through it. The Jeremiah verses are interesting and wonder the spiritual interpretation.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Resurrection Day meaning: Jesus' coming Millennium-Long Day governing over Earth for a thousand years - John 6:40,44
Resurrection Day means something different for members of the Baha'i Faith.

“The Day of Judgment is also the Day of Resurrection, of the raising of the dead. St. Paul in his First Epistle to the Corinthians says:—

Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.—I Cor. xv, 51–53.

As to the meaning of these passages about the raising of the dead, Bahá’u’lláh writes in the Book of Íqán:—

… By the terms “life” and “death,” spoken of in the scriptures, is intended the life of faith and the death of unbelief. The generality of the people, owing to their failure to grasp the meaning of these words, rejected and despised the person of the Manifestation, deprived themselves of the light of His divine guidance, and refused to follow the example of that immortal Beauty. …

… Even as Jesus said: “Ye must be born again” [John iii, 7]. Again He saith: “Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the Kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit” [John iii, 5–6]. The purpose of these words is that whosoever in every dispensation is born of the Spirit and is quickened by the breath of the Manifestation of Holiness, he verily is of those that have attained unto “life” and “resurrection” and have entered into the “paradise” of the love of God. And whosoever is not of them, is condemned to “death” and “deprivation,” to the “fire” of unbelief, and to the “wrath” of God. …

In every age and century, the purpose of the Prophets of God and their chosen ones hath been no other but to affirm the spiritual significance of the terms “life,” “resurrection,” and “judgment.” … Wert thou to attain to but a dewdrop of the crystal waters of divine knowledge, thou wouldst readily realize that true life is not the life of the flesh but the life of the spirit. For the life of the flesh is common to both men and animals, whereas the life of the spirit is possessed only by the pure in heart who have quaffed from the ocean of faith and partaken of the fruit of certitude. This life knoweth no death, and this existence is crowned by immortality. Even as it hath been said: “He who is a true believer liveth both in this world and in the world to come.” If by “life” be meant this earthly life, it is evident that death must needs overtake it.—Kitáb-i-Íqán, pp. 114, 118, 120–21.

According to the Bahá’í teaching the Resurrection has nothing to do with the gross physical body. That body, once dead, is done with. It becomes decomposed and its atoms will never be recomposed into the same body.

Resurrection is the birth of the individual to spiritual life, through the gift of the Holy Spirit bestowed through the Manifestation of God. The grave from which he arises is the grave of ignorance and negligence of God. The sleep from which he awakens is the dormant spiritual condition in which many await the dawn of the Day of God. This dawn illumines all who have lived on the face of the earth, whether they are in the body or out of the body, but those who are spiritually blind cannot perceive it. The Day of Resurrection is not a day of twenty-four hours, but an era which has now begun and will last as long as the present world cycle continues. It will continue when all traces of the present civilization will have been wiped off the surface of the globe.”

Bahá’u’lláh and the New Era, pp. 220-222
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
@Trailblazer

As a Baha'i I have a question about your religion. If Hell is just the remoteness of God, then it would make sense that God is the source of all good that happens to a person.
Yes, I would say that.
Would you say that God is the source of happiness?
I would not necessarily say that God is the source of all happiness. It depends upon what kind of happiness you are talking about. People who live for worldly things might be happy but they are not spiritually happy.

I think God is one source of spiritual happiness, but God is not the source of worldly happiness. The material world is the source of worldly happiness.
And if so, how can the atheists and anti-theists still achieve happiness without God? And is it possible to achieve peace, serenity and other good feelings without God, as certain religions have already demonstrated, like Buddhism?
Peace and serenity sounds like spiritual happiness. I think that atheists and anti-theists can achieve spiritual happiness without God.
However, I believe there is a lot more to life than happiness, there is a higher purpose.
 

F1fan

Veteran Member
Why would a benevolent God do that?
Courts of law do not pat murderers and rapist on the head and cure them of their vices, so why should God do that?
Because God created a universe with people who do these crimes.
The fact that God could do that because He is omnipotent is completely irrelevant. Why should He?
Because we observe these people in reality. If believers are correct in trusting the Bible then that God is accountable for His creation. God must have wanted everything as it is, including murderers and rapists. If God didn't then all He has to do was create humans with a consistenty high moral sense. he didn't.
That is not a dilemma for me, since I know which interpretation is accurate.
The takeaway is that only one is believable.
Yeah, you amongst billions of other believers who disagree with you. None of you believers can present any better argument than the next, so what you believe is irrelevant to we observers. What we care about is extraordinary evidence that is available for anyone to see and understand without special religious assumptions. There is none. That means it IS your dilemma, as you are posting here for some reason. You aren't on a website all by yourself, right? You know others will respond and you will respond right back, so you have skin in the game whether you want to acknowledge it or not.
 

Truthseeker

Non-debating member when I can help myself
Yes, I would say that.

I would not necessarily say that God is the source of all happiness. It depends upon what kind of happiness you are talking about. People who live for worldly things might be happy but they are not spiritually happy.

I think God is one source of spiritual happiness, but God is not the source of worldly happiness. The material world is the source of worldly happiness.

Peace and serenity sounds like spiritual happiness. I think that atheists and anti-theists can achieve spiritual happiness without God.
However, I believe there is a lot more to life than happiness, there is a higher purpose.
Hello, I see you are here. It's 5:00 Pacific time. I'm waiting at Zoom
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Because God created a universe with people who do these crimes.
Why would it be God's fault that people choose to commit crimes.
God also created a universe where people choose to do good things. Do you ever give God credit for those good things?
Because we observe these people in reality. If believers are correct in trusting the Bible then that God is accountable for His creation. God must have wanted everything as it is, including murderers and rapists. If God didn't then all He has to do was create humans with a consistenty high moral sense. he didn't.
If believers are correct in trusting the Bible and the Baha'i Writings then they would know that God gave man free will to choose so God is accountable for what people choose. God does not want murderers and rapists, people choose to be murderers and rapists. God does not have to create humans with a consistently high moral sense. Humans are obligated to develop their own moral sense. That is one reason we have to go through this life.
Yeah, you amongst billions of other believers who disagree with you.
Why would it matter if other believers agree with me? The truth is the truth whether people believe it or not.
None of you believers can present any better argument than the next, so what you believe is irrelevant to we observers. What we care about is extraordinary evidence that is available for anyone to see and understand without special religious assumptions. There is none.
There is none that you can see, but that does not mean there is none.
That means it IS your dilemma, as you are posting here for some reason. You aren't on a website all by yourself, right? You know others will respond and you will respond right back, so you have skin in the game whether you want to acknowledge it or not.
It is not a game if win or lose for me. I just respond to what is posted to me.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
You don't find that this conflicts with Baha'i teachings about the afterlife?
No, I don't think what I said conflicts with Baha'i teachings about the afterlife.

I said:
Peace and serenity sounds like spiritual happiness. I think that atheists and anti-theists can achieve spiritual happiness without God.
However, I believe there is a lot more to life than happiness, there is a higher purpose.


Atheists and anti-theists might experience spiritual happiness in this life, but they will not achieve their higher purpose, which is to know and love God.
That means that when they get to the afterlife they will be up the creek without a paddle, because they won't have what they need to get up the river.
 

cataway

Well-Known Member
I don't know where you are getting all this, but it certainly is not from the Bible.
Sorry to burst your bubble but there will be nobody living on earth except the live people who are born here, and they will live here until they die.

In other words, once you are dead you are dead, and you aren't rising from the grave and coming back to life to live on earth.
The souls of everyone who dies goes to the spiritual world and takes on a spiritual body and lives forever. Some go to heaven and others don't.
have you ever read and studied the bible ? i get the feeling all you have done is listen to some one talk about it
 

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
I don't know, but I don't agree that Jesus resurrected Lazarus from the dead.
ok, so is it that you and/or Bahallua do not believe that account in the Bible? Just as a slight reminder, it does say that Lazarus came out of the tomb with his burial wrappings still on him. The Bible account says he was resurrected (brought back to life) in the flesh -- his original body -- I don't ask you to believe it, I'm just telling you what it says.
 
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