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God's Creation, and Some Misconceptions

joelr

Well-Known Member
nor I when someone LIES.

Source "God", the bible. ..... and it's in print.... (smile), now let's deal with the "WRITTEN" evidence which do not change.
'
191G.


You have to demonstrate someone is lying. Please source a PhD saying those are lies.

Please demonstrate a God wrote the words in the Bible.

An early version of Deuteronomy that was edited to appear as only Yahweh was a God -
"When Elyon gave the nations their inheritance, when he divided all the sons of man, he set the boundaries of the peoples according to the number of the sons of Israel (bny yshr'l). For Yahweh's portion was his people, Jacob was the lot of his inheritance".


"When Elyon gave the nations as an inheritance, when he separated the sons of man, he set the boundaries of the peoples according to the number of the sons of God (bny 'l[hym]). For Yahweh's portion was his people; Jacob was the lot of his inheritance".

The modern version of the OT is based on the Masoretic Text which is from the 11th century. You have no idea how accurate it is.


But if your position is to just randomly say scholars are telling lies just because you don't like what they are saying, I don't see a point in writing? If evidence is meaningless to you and only an ancient mythology can be true then why even discuss it?
 

101G

Well-Known Member
You have to demonstrate someone is lying. Please source a PhD saying those are lies.
Better, God, my Source, who is higher than a person with a phd.
Please demonstrate a God wrote the words in the Bible.
for there is no lies in his WORD.... (smile)
If evidence is meaningless to you and only an ancient mythology can be true then why even discuss it?
who said ancient mythology is TRUE? if it's true, then prove it?
The modern version of the OT is based on the Masoretic Text which is from the 11th century. You have no idea how accurate it is.
as for the Masoretic Text, the bible today is self-correcting. so, that's a poor excuse.

and please in the future, any responses you have of ancient mythology? leave it out.... thanks (smile).for it will be out,

thanks for the reply

101G.

101G.
 

joelr

Well-Known Member
Better, God, my Source, who is higher than a person with a phd.

You have to demonstrate a God actually said those words. Hindus claims a God said their words. Mormons claims a God gave them updates. Islam claims God gave them updates on Christianity/Judiasm. Yet you believe none of them. Well guess what, you are in the same boat.
Until demonstrated you are sourcing no God, but a book written by men.

for there is no lies in his WORD.... (smile)

Maybe not, but in the Bible there are all sorts of lies.

God promises to make Isaac's descendents as numerous as "the stars of heaven", which, of course, never happened The Jews have always been, and will always be, a small minority.22:17-18, 26:4

  1. God promises to bring Jacob safely back from Egypt, but Jacob dies in Egypt (Gen.47:28-29) 46:3
Contrary to the prophecy in 48:21, Joseph died in Egypt, not Israel. Gen.50:24

Deuteronomy
  1. God says that the Israelites will destroy all of the peoples they encounter. But he was unable to keep his promise. 7:1, 7:23-24, 31:3
  2. God's favorite people will never be infertile (neither will their cows!) and will never get sick. (God will send infertility and diseases on the other guys.) 7:14-15
  1. Joshua
  2. God promises to give Joshua all of the land that his "foot shall tread upon." He says that none of the people he encounters will be able to resist him. But later we find that God didn't keep his promise, and that many tribes withstood Joshua's attempt to steal their land. 1:3-5, 3:10, 15:63, 16:10, 17:12-13, 17:17-18, 21:43-45
  1. Judges
  2. God promised many times that he would drive out all the inhabitants of the lands they encountered. But he failed to keep that promise 1:19, 1:21-27, 3:1-5
  3. Isaiah
    1. These verses falsely predict that Babylon will never again be inhabited. 13:19-20
    1. The river of Egypt (identified as the Nile in RSV) shall dry up. This has never occurred. 19:5
    2. "The land of Judah shall be a terror unto Egypt." Judah never invaded Egypt and was never a military threat to Egypt. 19:17
    3. This verse predicts that there shall be five cities in Egypt that speak the Canaanite language. But that language was never spoken in Egypt, and it is extinct now. 19:18
    4. These verses predict that the Egyptians will worship the Lord (Yahweh) with sacrifices and offerings. But Judaism has never been an important religion in Egypt. 19:18-21
    5. These verses predict that there will be an alliance between Egypt, Israel, and Assyria. But there has never been any such alliance, and it's unlikely that it ever will since Assyria no longer exists. 19:23-24
who said ancient mythology is TRUE? if it's true, then prove it?

There you go, my stance exactly. Mythology is NOT LITERALLY TRUE. The Bible IS mythology.
Who said the Bible is true? If it's true then prove it?





as for the Masoretic Text, the bible today is self-correcting. so, that's a poor excuse.
Oh you mean they had to change it to avoid contradictions. So you admit contradictions.
Yes the NLB changes text to fix problems. All they did was admit there are contradictions by changing the word.

If not please tell me the answers to the questions?
Contradictions in the pentateuchal narrative come in a variety of forms, from the smallest of details to the most important of historical claims. On the minor end are ostensibly simple disagreements about the names of people and places. Is Moses’s father-in-law named Reuel (Exod 2:18) or Jethro (Exod 3:1)? Is the mountain in the wilderness where Yahweh appeared to the people called Sinai (Exod 19:11) or Horeb (Exod 3:1; Deut 1:6)? Of somewhat more significance are disagreements about where, when, and even why an event took place. In Numbers 20:23–29, Aaron dies on Mount Hor; according to Deuteronomy 10:6, however, he dies in Moserah. In Numbers 3–4, after Moses has descended from the mountain and is receiving the laws, the Levites are assigned their cultic re- sponsibilities; but according to Deuteronomy 10:8, the Levites were set apart at a site in the wilderness called Jotbath.10 In Numbers 20:2–13, Moses is forbidden from crossing the Jordan because of his actions at the waters of Meribah, when
he brought forth water from the rock; but then according to his own words in Deuteronomy 1:37–38, Moses was prohibited from entering the promised land not because of anything he did, but because of the sins of the people in the epi- sode of the spies. Major contradictions, with important historiographical and theological ramifications, are also present in the text. The premier example of these is the creation story in Genesis 1 and 2: in what order was the world cre- ated? was it originally watery or dry? were male and female created together, or was woman made from man’s rib? is man the culmination of creation, or the beginning? Other examples are equally problematic. For the cult: was the Tent of Meeting in the center of the Israelite camp (Num 2–3) and did Yahweh dwell there constantly (Exod 40:34–38), or was it situated well outside the camp (Exod 33:7), and does Yahweh descend to it only to speak with Moses (Exod 33:8–11)? For prophecy: could there be other prophets like Moses after his death (Deut 18:15), or not (Deut 34:10–12)? These contradictions, from minor to major, are difficult, and frequently impossible, to reconcile.





and please in the future, any responses you have of ancient mythology? leave it out.... thanks (smile).for it will be out,

The Bible is mythology. I will write what I like. As can you. Deal, or don't write f you cannot answer.
Some Persian myths used by the Bible:


Doctrines



fundamental doctrines became disseminated throughout the region, from Egypt to the Black Sea: namely that there is a supreme God who is the Creator; that an evil power exists which is opposed to him, and not under his control; that he has emanated many lesser divinities to help combat this power; that he has created this world for a purpose, and that in its present state it will have an end; that this end will be heralded by the coming of a cosmic Saviour, who will help to bring it about; that meantime heaven and hell exist, with an individual judgment to decide the fate of each soul at death; that at the end of time there will be a resurrection of the dead and a Last Judgment, with annihilation of the wicked; and that thereafter the kingdom of God will come upon earth, and the righteous will enter into it as into a garden (a Persian word for which is 'paradise'), and be happy there in the presence of God for ever, immortal themselves in body as well as soul. These doctrines all came to be adopted by various Jewish schools in the post-Exilic period, for the Jews were one of the peoples, it seems, most open to Zoroastrian influences - a tiny minority, holding staunchly to their own beliefs, but evidently admiring their Persian benefactors, and finding congenial elements in their faith. Worship of the one supreme God, and belief in the coming of a Messiah or Saviour, together with adherence to a way of life which combined moral and spiritual aspirations with a strict code of behaviour (including purity laws) were all matters in which Judaism and Zoroastrianism were in harmony; and it was this harmony, it seems, reinforced by the respect of a subject people for a great protective power, which allowed Zoroastrian doctrines to exert their influence. The extent of this influence is best attested, however, by Jewish writings of the Parthian period, when Christianity and the Gnostic faiths, as well as northern Buddhism, all likewise bore witness to the profound effect: which Zoroaster's teachings had had throughout the lands of the Achaernenian empire.
 

danieldemol

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
are you sure of those number?
It doesn't matter if I have dogmatic certainty in the numbers, what matters is that it was the most likely number according to reason based examination of the genetic and other available evidence.

When we have contradictory stories coming from ancient books saying different things about the early humans we need an independent measure to weigh those books against. And i believe the best independent measure we have is scientific evidence such as in the genetic record.

and yes, it matters if she had been pregnant before the fall intro sin.
Then I believe you have some explaining to do, see post #246

now a question to you.

when God formed Eve, Adam said bone of my bone, and flesh of my flesh, what happen to blood of my blood? was she genetically. from Adam or genetically "of" Adam? can you tell us what happen to them genetically without blood?. I'll be looking for your answer.

101G.
I'm not understanding your question. According to my understanding there is no difference between being "of" or "from" someone.

As for what happens to a person without blood that is a simple one for biology to answer. They would be robbed of the means of delivery for essential nutrients to the cells and oxygen to the brain and would die virtually the moment they were formed.

In my opinion.
 

101G

Well-Known Member
You have to demonstrate a God actually said those words.
just ask him if he did or not......as I said, her do not LIE.
God promises to make Isaac's descendents as numerous as "the stars of heaven", which, of course, never happened The Jews have always been, and will always be, a small minority.22:17-18, 26:4
GINOLJC, to all.
your first ERROR of the DAY. who is a Jew? scripture, Romans 2:28 "For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:" Romans 2:29 "But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God."

now let's see those dependents as numbered of the stars in heaven.... Revelation 7:9 "After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;"

this is why there are IGNORANT MEN in the world today. to certify God Holy Word. "a great multitude, which no man could number", just as the STARS man cannot number, but God can.
  1. God promises to bring Jacob safely back from Egypt, but Jacob dies in Egypt (Gen.47:28-29) 46:3
Contrary to the prophecy in 48:21, Joseph died in Egypt, not Israel. Gen.50:24
your second ERROR of the Day, Genesis 46:3 "And he said, I am God, the God of thy father: fear not to go down into Egypt; for I will there make of thee a great nation:" (now, who is Jacob? a GREAT NATION). Genesis 46:4 "I will go down with thee into Egypt; and I will also surely bring thee up again: and Joseph shall put his hand upon thine eyes." (did he not bring Jacob/a Great Nation out of Egypt, and also his bones safely? LISTEN) Genesis 47:28 "And Jacob lived in the land of Egypt seventeen years: so the whole age of Jacob was an hundred forty and seven years." Genesis 47:29 "And the time drew nigh that Israel must die: and he called his son Joseph, and said unto him, If now I have found grace in thy sight, put, I pray thee, thy hand under my thigh, and deal kindly and truly with me; bury me not, I pray thee, in Egypt:" Genesis 47:30 "But I will lie with my fathers, and thou shalt carry me out of Egypt, and bury me in their buryingplace. And he said, I will do as thou hast said." Genesis 47:31 "And he said, Swear unto me. And he sware unto him. And Israel bowed himself upon the bed's head."

did God promise him to bring him out ALIVE ... NATURALLTY? if so post that Scripture. now listen to God, "I will also surely bring thee up again" did not the NATION of Jacob come out of Egypt? and was not his bone was brought out also? yes, then he came out of EGYPT... "ALSO" as Genesis 46:4 stated. this is where again IGNORANT men just run with a half truth and make it into a whole LIE. did you not know that Jacob is the Nation Israel? ..... see what IGNORANT men say and do without KNOWLEDGE? .. THEY LIE

101G.
 

101G

Well-Known Member
Contrary to the prophecy in 48:21, Joseph died in Egypt, not Israel. Gen.50:24
see post Above.
There you go, my stance exactly. Mythology is NOT LITERALLY TRUE. The Bible IS mythology.
Who said the Bible is true? If it's true then prove it?
again I said ASK God, for all your myth people are DEAD, LOL, LOL, LOL, Meaning your sources are DEAD.

now go and ask them, get out your wigi board, and tara cards..... lol, lol, ,lol.

101G.
 

101G

Well-Known Member
When we have contradictory stories coming from ancient books saying different things about the early humans we need an independent measure to weigh those books against. And i believe the best independent measure we have is scientific evidence such as in the genetic record.
YOU BELIEVE?
It raises other questions too if I recall correctly (its been a while since I read the story admittedly).
But it seems from what I recall that humans were expelled from the garden due to being the offspring of Adam who ate from the tree of good and evil, but if there were other pre-existing offspring who did not eat from the tree of good and evil why would they be expelled? And if not expelled how long would it take them to overpopulate the garden?
DID YOU NOT READ? yes, it been a while you read, or ever read the story. but no matter, Genesis 1:28 "And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth."
replenish the earth, NOT the Garden, for it was already occupied. NOW LISTEN AGAIN, Genesis 2:23 "And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man." Genesis 2:24 "Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh."
they left the Garden, just as Men do today, leave home and start their OWN FAMILY. so, GET OUT OF YOUR FATHER AND MOTHER HOUSE....... (smile) ... LOL, LOL, LOL,

101G.
 

101G

Well-Known Member
Why does it matter whether a story implies a certain individual person had already been pregnant if the truth is that there were likely *never* less than 5,000 to 10,000 humans as demonstrated by genetic evidence?

In my opinion.
that's Good you said, your Opinion, and we will leave it right there at your Opinion, because that's just what it is..... your Opinion.

101G.
 

101G

Well-Known Member
Until demonstrated you are sourcing no God, but a book written by men.
To all, our friend joelr still cannot understand the difference between a DEAD source vs a LIVE source. answer .... REVELATION. all those myths are stagnant, showing no activity. but the WORD of God is "ALIVE" and ACTIVE.

the bible is alive and well, HOW so,101G?. for God LIVES. example IGNORANT men say ...... a man wrote the bible..... ERROR, a man cannot get out of bed if it was not for GOD. but those men of, of, of, God, anointed with the Holy Spirit, who wrote by God and what to say is not their own words but God's own words example, someone might say the apostle Paul said..... so and so.... ERROR, no, he, as all the apostles spoke or wrote what God said, and not what they said. and if one said anything of themselves it was spoken or written by permission of God. so, no man is responsible for the written word of God, but God HIMSELF.

so any ISSUE any man has, it's with God, and not other men.

and YES, God is alive and well, for he is teaching his.... note, HIS people every day. (smile).

101G
 

danieldemol

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
that's Good you said, your Opinion, and we will leave it right there at your Opinion, because that's just what it is..... your Opinion.

101G.
Sure, I have my opinion and you have yours, but I believe if human genetics are studied then the evidence will be in favour of my opinion.

Have you ever studied genetics or at least consulted with those who have studied genetics?

Or did you just assume that your book accurately reflects nature without even bothering to check against nature itself?

In my opinion.
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
To all, our friend joelr still cannot understand the difference between a DEAD source vs a LIVE source. answer .... REVELATION. all those myths are stagnant, showing no activity. but the WORD of God is "ALIVE" and ACTIVE.

the bible is alive and well, HOW so,101G?. for God LIVES. example IGNORANT men say ...... a man wrote the bible..... ERROR, a man cannot get out of bed if it was not for GOD. but those men of, of, of, God, anointed with the Holy Spirit, who wrote by God and what to say is not their own words but God's own words example, someone might say the apostle Paul said..... so and so.... ERROR, no, he, as all the apostles spoke or wrote what God said, and not what they said. and if one said anything of themselves it was spoken or written by permission of God. so, no man is responsible for the written word of God, but God HIMSELF.

so any ISSUE any man has, it's with God, and not other men.

and YES, God is alive and well, for he is teaching his.... note, HIS people every day. (smile).

101G
How would you prove that the Bible is a "live source"? How would you prove that your God lives?
 

101G

Well-Known Member
Sure, I have my opinion and you have yours
NOT concerning scriptures. 101G has no opinion on any Holy scripture.
but I believe if human genetics are studied then the evidence will be in favour of my opinion.
time will tell.
Have you ever studied genetics or at least consulted with those who have studied genetics?
I read the result, and have no opinion, because discoveries are made every day. some positive, and some....... outright, inconclusive.
Or did you just assume that your book accurately reflects nature without even bothering to check against nature itself?
101G assume nothing. everyday.... so to speak, Science is making discoveries that prove the Bible is TRUE.

as I said before, because the bible states, 1 Timothy 6:20 "O Timothy, keep that which is committed to thy trust, avoiding profane and vain babblings, and oppositions of science falsely so called:"

101G.
 

101G

Well-Known Member
How would you prove that the Bible is a "live source"? How would you prove that your God lives?
did U not read my post. REVELATIONS in the SCRIPTURES. the Word of God is as being Pregent, GIVING BIRTH ALWAYS TO NEW REVELATIONS OF WHAT HE HAS ALREADY SAID. the Word of God is Spirit, (Unseen), and it reveals himself every day. that's the difference between science, (observance of the NATURAL Eye) and Faith, (observance of the Spiritual Eye), which is written telling us what to look for "ALREADY" with the NATURAL EYES, meaning the Spiritual already know and science need to find out. and 101G don't need a wigi board, or tara cards to know these things. only the revealing Word of God, the bible. understand something, Science is after the fact, the Word of God is before the Fact. God KNOW, TRUE science tries to find out what God has already said, written.

101G
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
did U not read my post. REVELATIONS in the SCRIPTURES. the Word of God is as being Pregent, GIVING BIRTH ALWAYS TO NEW REVELATIONS OF WHAT HE HAS ALREADY SAID. the Word of God is Spirit, (Unseen), and it reveals himself every day. that's the difference between science, (observance of the NATURAL Eye) and Faith, (observance of the Spiritual Eye), which is written telling us what to look for "ALREADY" with the NATURAL EYES, meaning the Spiritual already know and science need to find out. and 101G don't need a wigi board, or tara cards to know these things. only the revealing Word of God, the bible. understand something, Science is after the fact, the Word of God is before the Fact. God KNOW, TRUE science tries to find out what God has already said, written.

101G
Nope, those are just the empty claims of a person with what appears to be an irrational belief. You do not "KNOW". You only believe. Knowledge is demonstrable. If a person cannot support his claims then he only has beliefs. And your beliefs appear to be very weak. We can show how many of your beliefs are wrong. Do you think that you can support any of your beliefs properly?
 

101G

Well-Known Member
Nope, those are just the empty claims of a person with what appears to be an irrational belief. You do not "KNOW". You only believe. Knowledge is demonstrable. If a person cannot support his claims then he only has beliefs. And your beliefs appear to be very weak. We can show how many of your beliefs are wrong. Do you think that you can support any of your beliefs properly?
ok, is God the First and the Last, yes, or no? your answer please.

101G.
 

101G

Well-Known Member
Who? What God? I do not know of any valid reason to hold such a belief, so depending upon your defintion the answer is probably going to be no.

Do you have any reliable evidence for this God?
probably? meaning you don't know. those who are in darkness leave them there, good day.

101G.
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
probably? meaning you don't know. those who are in darkness leave them there, good day.

101G.
You "don't know" either. You prove that every time that you run away. You are in fact in deeper darkness than I am because I know that some of the things you believe in are wrong.
 

rational experiences

Veteran Member
Humans are mutual equal.

Humans aren't mutual equal.

Lifestyle forced on us dictates why humans aren't mutual equal.

No machine. No science who man says his machine proves him right. As man designed science and mechanics a human.

Lifestyle why humans are no longer mutual or equal.

Lifestyle kills off humanity by those who own it's invention.

Fakery is not creation.
 

Kathryn

It was on fire when I laid down on it.
The bible isn't a science book or a history book for that matter. It's a collection of many different books and letters, written over several thousand years, by many different authors, in several different languages. I just look at what the story is telling me. In the case of the creation story, in my opinion, the creation story is telling me that God created everything.
 
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