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images of Russia - Ukraine war

Truthseeker

Non-debating member when I can help myself
It's My Birthday!
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metis

aged ecumenical anthropologist
It's one of the reasons why I felt that non-violent non-cooperation would have been a better approach.
 

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
It's one of the reasons why I felt that non-violent non-cooperation would have been a better approach.
IOW, you'd surrender to Putin.
Sure, it would result in less death on both sides.
But unlike you, Ukrainians value independence
far more. They're also serving to discourage
Putin from invading more countries.
 

metis

aged ecumenical anthropologist
What exactly does that mean?
Pretty much what Gandhi orchestrated to end the Raj.

There's no way to know if that would work against Putin's Russia, but at the least hundreds of thousands or millions of Ukrainians wouldn't likely suffer and die as much as we're seeing. Remember, governments do come and go.
 

Debater Slayer

Vipassana
Staff member
Premium Member
Pretty much what Gandhi orchestrated to end the Raj.

There's no way to know if that would work against Putin's Russia, but at the least hundreds of thousands or millions of Ukrainians wouldn't likely suffer and die as much as we're seeing. Remember, governments do come and go.

Gandhi also believed that Jews should have succumbed to Hitler without resistance. I find his pacifist dogma to be overly idealistic and extremely harmful.

It's good that Ukrainians know better than Gandhi and haven't surrendered to a violent despot.
 

Father Heathen

Veteran Member
Pretty much what Gandhi orchestrated to end the Raj.
Gandhi was an *******, though.

Racist view of africans, told Jews to go willingly to death camps, terrible father and husband, supported the horrid caste system, and slept with naked girls to "test himself".
 

metis

aged ecumenical anthropologist
Gandhi also believed that Jews should have succumbed to Hitler without resistance. I find his pacifist dogma to be overly idealistic and extremely harmful.

It's good that Ukrainians know better than Gandhi and haven't surrendered to a violent despot.
So, how are the civilian Ukrainians doing, and do you really think Putin is going to give up and stop the killing until he gets his way? My point is that neither strategy doesn't always lead to success.

So, imo, it boils down to that which we think is morally right.
 

metis

aged ecumenical anthropologist
I'm ignorant to this history tidbit.
It's when Gandhi and his followers used non-violence that led the Brits to abandon their Raj [occupation] in India.

BTW, an excellent book that covers this in much detail is "Gandhi & Churchill: The Epic Rivalry That Destroyed an Empire and Forged Our Age" by Arthur Herman.
 

Father Heathen

Veteran Member
So, how are the civilian Ukrainians doing, and do you really think Putin is going to give up and stop the killing until he gets his way? My point is that neither strategy doesn't always lead to success.

So, imo, it boils down to that which we think is morally right.
It's morally right for them to defend their freedom, democracy, and sovereignty. Allowing despots to act with impunity would set a horrible precedent.
 

Father Heathen

Veteran Member
What's wrong with the caste system?

I like it personally

It's arbitrary, classist, and discriminatory.

Your caste determines what jobs you can have and who you're allowed to associate and socialize with, lower castes are treated like **** and breaking caste boundaries can be met with violence.

It's like racism but the races are make believe.
 

The Hammer

[REDACTED]
Premium Member
It's arbitrary, classist, and discriminatory.

Your caste determines what jobs you can have and who you're allowed to associate and socialize with, lower castes are treated like **** and breaking caste boundaries can be met with violence.

It's like racism but the races are make believe.

If one is allowed to move amongst the classes (easily or not) I see no issue personally.
 

The Hammer

[REDACTED]
Premium Member
From my understanding, it's tied into reincarnation and birthright.

Caste system is discriminatory and oppressive.

I'll agree to disagree. The caste system can be used oppressively, but so can the way we have our society stratified (poor, working class, middle class, etc). And to move from one to the other, while possible, is extremely difficult.

We just have our own caste system, and call it something different.
 

sayak83

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
Gandhi also believed that Jews should have succumbed to Hitler without resistance. I find his pacifist dogma to be overly idealistic and extremely harmful.

It's good that Ukrainians know better than Gandhi and haven't surrendered to a violent despot.
This discussion has somehow gone into Gandhi. I will request all posters to read carefully what he said on the topic
Between Cowardice and Violence | Gandhi's views on Peace, Nonviolence and Conflict Resolution
But I do agree that Gandhi's advice that Jews and others resist Hitler nonviolently is absurd.
 
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