Paul - An Apostle?

[Triumph]

Because they do not listen to what Jesus said on the topic and form their own conclusions based on their interpretation of symbolism and what they want to call Jesus, not what he said he is.

 

[Triumph]

I think he considered himself a Christian, but also saw a need or maybe wanted to modernize it, he wanted the message/religion to spread beyond Israel and to include more people. And I think he realized that it was not going to work unless some of the laws were changed, especially the circumcision one, he was not going to convince the heathens/gentiles of this and therefore needed an exception to the rule. So my guess is that in order to do this, the "covenant" that circumcision symbolize also needed to change, so it focused on Jesus more than God, and therefore you could be saved by simply accepting Jesus.

I also think this eventually started the split between Christianity and Judaism, as the law suddenly weren't all that important. Which Peter (I think) didn't agree with as that is not what the OT say either, so over time as we know the religions grew apart. But I think in the beginning before all this, they all considered themselves Jews, but some didn't agree with Jesus being the Messiah and some did.

(Obviously just me guessing )

Paul considered himself a Pharisee, a Hebrew of Hebrews sent out by the High Priest, a man he honored, to destroy the church Jesus had established and bring people back into support of the Hebrew Mosaic laws. So Paul was intent on making Gentiles "grafted in Jews". Paul insists that only one race of people are chosen by God while Jesus taught all races are equal none higher than another. Paul said Jesus served Abraham as a High Priest in the temple making sacrifices in honor of Abraham returning from killing kings. That is a Lie as Jesus taught against blood sacrifices and Jesus said he will never be found in a secret chamber.
Matthew 24:26
Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not."

Realize what a secret chamber means. The temple has a room where only a High Priest is allowed into where he makes blood sacrifices, so it is the "secret chamber" of a temple.
Paul says Jesus made blood sacrifices in honor of Abraham as a High Priest and Jesus said he didn't. Paul tries to make Jesus an average High Priest and exalts Melchizedek above Jesus saying Jesus walks in his footsteps. Jesus walked in no High Priests footsteps, never made a blood sacrifice, and taught against what they believed. That is why the High Priest demanded Jesus be killed.
Jesus is also warning in Matt 24:26 that he is not going to be seen in the desert so Paul lied when he said Jesus appeared to him on the road to Damascus because that is in the desert. Jesus is saying do not follow Paul because Paul is a LIAR .

 

[Triumph]

Paul is not the writer of Luke.
It was Luke who said that Paul "met" Jesus, and received a commission from him.
In fact, Luke is the one who provided the information on how the apostles were skeptical about Paul's conversion.
He is the same historian that informed us of Peter's - an apostle - activity, after Jesus' ascension,, as well as the formation, and progress of the Christian congregation.

Also, it is surprising how many people think Luke is an Apostle when he is not. Luke is educated and seeks truth but did not know Jesus personally and seeks to know about him. Luke writes what he is told by all people that claim they know Jesus. Luke is like an honest newspaper reporter that was not present at an event but gathers information to share about what happened by people that say they were there. Luke does not know if what he is told is true or not, he just accurately writes what he is told happened.
Because Paul is charismatic, Luke apparently spends more time with the liar Paul than with the true Apostles.

 

[Triumph]

You wouldn't know about the fruits of the Spirit as in Galatians 5:22-23 without Paul. He also spoke of a crown of righteousness. (2 Tim 4:8) I think we can safely admit he was the real deal.

Paul is a trained religious shyster making a profession out of taking money from people by lying about God but calls his lies "glorifying " God and wonders why the
true Apostles/disciples call Paul a "sinner" for it.
Romans 3:7
For if the truth of God hath more abounded through my lie unto his glory; why yet am I also judged as a sinner?"
Paul's attitude is his lying is getting people to believe a God exists so it does not matter if he lies about God bringing people into Paul's church with guile which means lies and deceit.
The Command of God is not to lie but Paul does not care about truth, Paul cares about tithes and self exaltation. Paul prays with pretense and brags about himself but then said it is not bragging. Paul is a Benjamin wolf in sheeps' clothing scattering the sheep which was Paul's intent from the beginning of his lie that he is an Apostle.

 

[Triumph]

Paul claimed that his, and Peter's apostleship, came from God:

Galatians 2 For God, who was at work in Peter as an apostle to the circumcised, was also at work in me as an apostle to the Gentiles.

Apostle to the Gentiles? What a shyster! Jesus was converting Gentiles from the beginning of his preaching and the true Apostles were helping him.
Peter was leading people away from believing the Jews were a chosen race, and taught against circumcision, as a physical religious ritual and what it spiritually means because Abraham has no covenant with God. Paul taught you have to believe what Circumcision means, people must support Abraham so people become "grafted in Jews". (false Jews because Jews will not accept them). Paul requires people believe the Christ is a son of David but Jesus argued with the temple that the Christ is not a son of Abraham/David. The Christ is a son of God and no man is a God.
Paul does not know what Jesus taught about circumcision so made the effort to ask Peter what Jesus taught about it. When Apostle Peter told Paul it was not done, not supported, the first thing Paul does after leaving Peter is circumcise a Greek man's son in complete defiance to what Jesus taught.
Jesus called the supporters of Abraham, "vipers" because words that kill people come out of their mouth.
Luke 3:7
Then said he to the multitude that came forth to be baptized of him, O generation of vipers, who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come?"
Jews refuse to believe in water baptism for sin removal so Paul takes Gentiles and grafts them into that belief of Blood Sacrifce removes sin, not water baptism. Paul taught baptism is optional, unnecessary for salvation because killing Jesus is what saves you.
Mark 16:16
He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned."
Jesus taught in John 8, if you want Jesus to die then you are not loving God and he also said, "go and learn I desire mercy and not sacrifice"
Paul is not interested in following anything Jesus taught and refuses to have mercy on Jesus wanting Jesus sacrificed for opposing what Paul taught.
Acts 11:2
1And the apostles and brethren that were in Judaea heard that the Gentiles had also received the word of God. 2And when Peter was come up to Jerusalem, they that were of the circumcision contended with him, 3Saying, Thou wentest in to men uncircumcised, and didst eat with them."
Peter was teaching Gentiles and converting them as brethren! But Paul wants people to think only Paul accepts Gentiles into religion and it was Paul's doctrine that accomplishes it. Paul uses guile and is so sure people will believe him anyway that Paul even admits he uses guile. Guile means lies and deceit.
.

 

[74x12]

Paul is a trained religious shyster making a profession out of taking money from people by lying about God but calls his lies "glorifying " God and wonders why the
true Apostles/disciples call Paul a "sinner" for it.
Romans 3:7
For if the truth of God hath more abounded through my lie unto his glory; why yet am I also judged as a sinner?"
Paul's attitude is his lying is getting people to believe a God exists so it does not matter if he lies about God bringing people into Paul's church with guile which means lies and deceit.
The Command of God is not to lie but Paul does not care about truth, Paul cares about tithes and self exaltation. Paul prays with pretense and brags about himself but then said it is not bragging. Paul is a Benjamin wolf in sheeps' clothing scattering the sheep which was Paul's intent from the beginning of his lie that he is an Apostle.

Paul's style of writing is that he often sets up arguments and refutes them himself so that people know what he believes and why. He's making a point.

In context; Paul is arguing against those who believe they can lie for God or do any sin for God. He is saying that God will still take vengeance on them. So you should be more careful how you're quoting Paul.

Romans 3:5-9
5 But if our unrighteousness commend the righteousness of God, what shall we say? Is God unrighteous who taketh vengeance? (I speak as a man)
6 God forbid: for then how shall God judge the world?
7 For if the truth of God hath more abounded through my lie unto his glory; why yet am I also judged as a sinner?
8 And not rather, (as we be slanderously reported, and as some affirm that we say,) Let us do evil, that good may come? whose damnation is just.

 

[Triumph]

Paul's style of writing is that he often sets up arguments and refutes them himself so that people know what he believes and why. He's making a point.

In context; Paul is arguing against those who believe they can lie for God or do any sin for God. He is saying that God will still take vengeance on them. So you should be more careful how you're quoting Paul.

Romans 3:5-9
5 But if our unrighteousness commend the righteousness of God, what shall we say? Is God unrighteous who taketh vengeance? (I speak as a man)
6 God forbid: for then how shall God judge the world?
7 For if the truth of God hath more abounded through my lie unto his glory; why yet am I also judged as a sinner?
8 And not rather, (as we be slanderously reported, and as some affirm that we say,) Let us do evil, that good may come? whose damnation is just.

No one is better at double talk than Paul. He will say something then deny what be said is true. Paul curses everyone that will not believe his gospel but then tells people not to curse making himself as he is being evil appear as if he is righteous. Paul cursed the Angel that told Mary she will have a virgin birth because Paul's gospel is Jesus is a bloodline son of Abraham/David/ Joseph. Jesus is not the son of those men but Paul said Jesus is their son. Paul never said Jesus had a virgin birth because Paul does not believe it. Paul refused to even mention the name of Mary or John the Baptist. Paul knows Jesus has more respect for John than for Paul.
GOD takes no vengeance, ever. Jesus never taught that God has vengeance.
Lords, KINGS of the earth, take vengeance as if they are a God. Jesus said love your enemy so Jesus is not taking vengeance on anyone. The worst God does is not allow eternal life to evil people after they die so they can not continue to be evil.

Paul is so disrespectful of God that Paul tells people that God has "weakness and foolishness" only not as bad as man has.
1 Corinthians 1:25
Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men.

Only a Fool has any foolishness which is inability to make right decisions. Is God incapable at any time on any level to make a correct decision?
No, but Paul wants people to believe God does make mistakes of judgement thus making God a fool.
The creator of the Universe has Zero weakness, none at all, so Paul lies about God in an attempt to compare God to man saying God has man's lowly attributes when God does not.
Paul wants people to believe calling God a fool and weak is not blasphemy because it is Paul calling God weak and foolish and he wants people to be led with guile without thinking about what they agree to believe so they are not burdened with knowing the truth.
Paul said, "For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God."
It takes wisdom to understand when a person is being lied to and we are made in the likeness of God to discern right from wrong and act accordingly in desire to be righteous accepting only truth, rejecting the lies of liars.
See Paul for the lying viper he is and do not follow him.

 

[74x12]

Paul is so disrespectful of God that Paul tells people that God has "weakness and foolishness" only not as bad as man has.
1 Corinthians 1:25
Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men.

Do you know what the "Foolishness" of God is?

It's his messengers. It's his preachers and teachers. In fact Paul is talking about himself in context. He's humbly referring to himself as the "foolishness" of God. As in the foolish instrument that God has chosen to bring the gospel. If you really think God has any foolishness that's a silly idea. Of course not.

1 Corinthians 1:23-27
23 But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness;
24 But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.
25 Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men.
26 For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called:
27 But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty;

So far from being disrespectful to God; Paul is humbly admitting he is foolish and yet still chosen by God.

 

[74x12]

GOD takes no vengeance, ever.

The Biblical God does take vengeance as many scriptures prove. It's an important part of the gospel message. Without it there is no need to repent. Just let people live however they want because God will not punish them.

 

[74x12]

Paul cursed the Angel that told Mary she will have a virgin birth because Paul's gospel is Jesus is a bloodline son of Abraham/David/ Joseph. Jesus is not the son of those men but Paul said Jesus is their son. Paul never said Jesus had a virgin birth because Paul does not believe it. Paul refused to even mention the name of Mary or John the Baptist. Paul knows Jesus has more respect for John than for Paul.

Paul doesn't have to say everything he believes. Paul liked to deliver new revelations and new ideas in his epistles. Not just repeat what was already well known to all Christians. But we know from his close friends that they believed in the virgin birth; so of course Paul did too.

Luke was the good friend of Paul. Luke talks about Mary more than any other gospel and he talks about the virgin birth more than the other gospels do. So you're just wrong. If Paul had not believed the virgin birth then Luke would not have followed him and would not have liked him if he had denied the virgin birth.

That doesn't mean Paul's ideas are wrong either. Paul says Jesus is the Son of God by resurrection and that is true. However that doesn't mean Jesus wasn't also the Son of God by virgin birth. Both revelations are important to understand and receive. Paul never denies the virgin birth even once.

In Romans 1:3 he says Jesus was made the seed of David according to the flesh and that is true.

Jesus was fully human of the seed of Abraham and David by Mary his mother. Indeed he is the "seed of the woman" that was prophesied to bruise the serpents head.

 

[Triumph]

Do you know what the "Foolishness" of God is?

It's his messengers. It's his preachers and teachers. In fact Paul is talking about himself in context. He's humbly referring to himself as the "foolishness" of God. As in the foolish instrument that God has chosen to bring the gospel. If you really think God has any foolishness that's a silly idea. Of course not.

1 Corinthians 1:23-27
23 But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness;
24 But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.
25 Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men.
26 For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called:
27 But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty;

So far from being disrespectful to God; Paul is humbly admitting he is foolish and yet still chosen by God.

1 Only Paul and his followers preach Christ crucified to remove sins. The true church does not because they learned Jesus does not want sacrifice.
Jews did not accept Jesus as the Christ and felt righteous when Jesus died and felt righteous before Jesus died. They knew Jesus was not a sacrifice for anyone's sins. They wanted Jesus dead because he was destroying their religion by leading people away from their Jewish beliefs. The Greeks did not believe in transportation of sins because it is logical to think that way and considered it foolish because it is.
2. God has no foolishness or weakness and it is vile to make any disrespectful measurement of God, the father that created us.
If Paul really loved God and he does not, Paul would never describe God in those terms.
3. God did NOT choose foolish things to confound the intelligent. The true Words of God should NEVER be described as foolish! God does not want His words to be described as words people can not understand. It is Paul that scrambles truth into constant contradictions.
The wise know the true words of God are not foolish.
It is arrogant of Paul to imply only the weak minded will believe the words of God and the intelligent will not !
But it is truth the weak do follow Paul because they cannot discern what that viper actually says. After Paul lied saying he converted when Paul is in the Jewish Temple he refuses to call himself a Christian. Paul tells everyone he is a Pharisee, son of a Pharisee. A converted Christian supporting Jesus would never say that.
Jesus taught against Pharisees because they are liars and killers of innocent people.
Matthew 23:13
But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in

 

[Triumph]

The Biblical God does take vengeance as many scriptures prove. It's an important part of the gospel message. Without it there is no need to repent. Just let people live however they want because God will not punish them.

Note in Genesis 2/4 is where the fake Lord God the Jews invented invents everything already created (by the real God in chapter 1), in just a day. It took a day to dream up that fable of Adam and Eve and the talking serpent to lay the foundation of a religion that will exalt Abraham, the father of that lie as chosen of the God Abraham invents to exalt himself to a throne of rule as Lord. The fictional God he invented needed to be as angry and powerful with vengeance as the other pagan Gods to inspire Abraham's army to fight for him. Even though they claimed only their Lord God had power, going against another tribe of warriors they refused to fight once they found out that pagan leader had sacrificed his child to his fake God to win the battle. They had no faith in the "Lord God" they claimed chose only them and believed the magic of a child sacrifice made to a pagan God was more powerful than their Lord God to protect them. They were LOST with the wrong God, false worship and false beliefs.
Jesus was sent by the real God to remove belief in the fake Lord God the Hebrews worshipped and lead them into the true religion accepted by God.
The Living God has no vengeance and accepts no blood sacrifices, commanding all nations to believe in water baptism for removal of sin.

 

[Triumph]

Paul doesn't have to say everything he believes. Paul liked to deliver new revelations and new ideas in his epistles. Not just repeat what was already well known to all Christians. But we know from his close friends that they believed in the virgin birth; so of course Paul did too.

Luke was the good friend of Paul. Luke talks about Mary more than any other gospel and he talks about the virgin birth more than the other gospels do. So you're just wrong. If Paul had not believed the virgin birth then Luke would not have followed him and would not have liked him if he had denied the virgin birth.

That doesn't mean Paul's ideas are wrong either. Paul says Jesus is the Son of God by resurrection and that is true. However that doesn't mean Jesus wasn't also the Son of God by virgin birth. Both revelations are important to understand and receive. Paul never denies the virgin birth even once.

In Romans 1:3 he says Jesus was made the seed of David according to the flesh and that is true.

Jesus was fully human of the seed of Abraham and David by Mary his mother. Indeed he is the "seed of the woman" that was prophesied to bruise the serpents head.

'
In Romans 1:3 he says Jesus was made the seed of David according to the flesh and that is true."
Science has proven that is absolutely impossible unless Joseph fornicated with Mary before marriage conceiving Jesus in sin.
That is exactly what Paul believes happened.
Mary could have produced a daughter of David but never a son of David because male gender only comes from male seed. Females only have female genetics not male DNA. You either believe God is the father of Jesus creating new male DNA in Jesus or you believe Joseph is the biological father of Jesus. It can not be both.
Jesus is male and Joseph is not his father so Paul is lying saying Jesus is the seed of David. Paul like all the other Pharisees does not believe it when Jesus said the Christ is not a son of Abraham/David. Paul tells people to believe that the Christ is a son of David. That is Paul's doctrine and it is not true because Jesus denies it is true.
Realize something very important. If you believe Jesus is the seed of David then you are denying the Father and Son which defines a person as antichrist.

 

[Triumph]

Paul doesn't have to say everything he believes. Paul liked to deliver new revelations and new ideas in his epistles. Not just repeat what was already well known to all Christians. But we know from his close friends that they believed in the virgin birth; so of course Paul did too.

Luke was the good friend of Paul. Luke talks about Mary more than any other gospel and he talks about the virgin birth more than the other gospels do. So you're just wrong. If Paul had not believed the virgin birth then Luke would not have followed him and would not have liked him if he had denied the virgin birth.

That doesn't mean Paul's ideas are wrong either. Paul says Jesus is the Son of God by resurrection and that is true. However that doesn't mean Jesus wasn't also the Son of God by virgin birth. Both revelations are important to understand and receive. Paul never denies the virgin birth even once.

In Romans 1:3 he says Jesus was made the seed of David according to the flesh and that is true.

Jesus was fully human of the seed of Abraham and David by Mary his mother. Indeed he is the "seed of the woman" that was prophesied to bruise the serpents head.

NO, because Jesus is male and David is NOT God. The issue is male gender as only a MAN has the right to the Davidic throne according to the covenant the Jews believe is true.
The seed from David must create a MALE, a SON of DAVID. Females can only create females from their genetics. It is impossible for Mary to pass any male genetic material into Jesus, it is not physically possible. Jesus is not a SON of David in any way. God would not allow David, a liar, thief, murderer, adulterer and murderer of his own son to have any genetic material in His beloved and perfect Son Jesus!
There is zero proof that Mary is even a bloodline Jew because the tribe of Levi were the military tribe and they took female slaves. Hebrew/Jews also allowed people of any race to convert to their religion. Mary and the parents of Mary could be any race, not Jewish by bloodline at all.
By the way, the tribe of Levi are not allowed to own land or become rulers so being Levi as was her cousin Elizabeth, affirms Mary could not be of the Davidic bloodline because that bloodline is not from the tribe of Levi! David's bloodline tribe was Judah not Levi.

 

[paarsurrey]

Paul - An Apostle?
of whom, please?
(Jesus) Yeshua- the Israelite Messiah never appointed the Hellenist-Paul, one gets to know, please. Right?
If yes, then kindly quote from Yeshua- the Israelite Messiah in this connection, please. Right?

Regards

 

[paarsurrey]

Paul was the only apostle to have written anything down. Paul's epistles are the oldest known Christian writings we have, they predate the gospels, which are works of fiction and possibly based at least in part on Paul's apostleship.

Jesus never appointed Paul his apostle, please. Right?
If yes, then please quote from Yeshua- the Israelite Messiah in this connection, please. Right?

Regards

 

[Colt]

Paul - An Apostle?
of whom, please?
(Jesus) Yeshua- the Israelite Messiah never appointed the Hellenist-Paul, one gets to know, please. Right?
If yes, then kindly quote from Yeshua- the Israelite Messiah in this connection, please. Right?

Regards

Saul never knew Jesus when he was in the flesh. Saul had a conversion experience and became a minister carrying a version of the Gospel as he understood it.

 

[paarsurrey]

Saul never knew Jesus when he was in the flesh. Saul had a conversion experience and became a minister carrying a version of the Gospel as he understood it.

" Jesus when he was in the flesh "

Didn't Jesus have any bones and was made of only flesh during his three years ministry, please? Right?
Kindly quote from Jesus for such a claim and the reason given by Jesus in this connection, please. Right?

Regards

 

[syo]

Was Paul really a true Christian

Yes.

 

[paarsurrey]

nPeace said: ↑
Was Paul really a true Christian

Yes.

Saul/Paul followed some Hellenist Christ and in this sense he might have been a "Christian" but (Jesus) Yeshua- the Israelite Messiah was never a "Christian" and Paul never followed him and or his teachings for sure, I understand, please. Right?

Regards