Scientific evidence and Bible prophecies.

[Subduction Zone]

Slavery was a legitimate thing in Biblical times.
There were laws for protection of all types of slaves and that included slaves that were bought from other nations. But that part of the law imo was there because God knew that this would happen,,,,,,,,,,, just like divorce was allowed because God knew it would happen anyway.
The law and the prophets was one thing but with Jesus we see God's truth coming where all are equal in Christ and the slave trade is classed as an evil practice even if the institution of slavery is not something specifically spoken against,,,,,,,,,,,,,, just as the other 100 common social practices of the day were not specifically spoken against. That would come in it's day, when people were ready to hear the truth just as other accepted practices also disappeared over time due to the teachings of Christianity.

It would have been "legitimate" only if there was no all powerful God.

 

[paarsurrey]

Even Matthew in Matthew 1 mentions the prophecy about His name being called Emanuel and says that the child (Jesus ) would be named Jesus. This is within a few lines of each other. It is plain that "Emmanuel" was not meant to be a proper name. It is the meaning that is important,,,,,,,,,,,,,, and Jesus is called "God with us" and "Emmanuel" by those who believe it, because that is who He is.

Does the title "Emmanuel", as per the Pauline-Bible*, fit on Jesus if he announced right on the Cross "Eli Eli Lama Sabachthani" translated "My God, my God, why hast Thou forsaken me", please? Right?
#80

Regards
_______________
*Pauline interpretation/creed " Jesus died a cursed death on the Cross"

 

[WonderingWorrier]

Scientific evidence and Bible prophecies.

Is there any scientific evidence that Jesus' prophecy of showing "Sign of Jonah" got
fulfilled, please? Right?

Regards

Bible translators changed the word fish to whale. But whale does not make more sense.

People are being taken away with fish hooks.
"The Lord God hath sworn by his holiness, that, lo, the days shall come upon you, that he will take you away with hooks, and your posterity with fishhooks". Amos.

Three days in the middle of the fish as three days in the middle of death.

The Quran says Jonah could have remained in fish until the
resurrection.

The Bible says money can be found in the mouths of fish.
The Bible also says money answers all things.

Dead people are fish.
Jesus gathered fish.

Jesus and Jonah were vomited back onto the Earth.

 

[paarsurrey]

Scientific evidence and Bible prophecies.

Is there any scientific evidence that Jesus' prophecy of showing "Sign of Jonah" got fulfilled, please? Right?

Bible translators changed the word fish to whale. But whale does not make more sense.

People are being taken away with fish hooks.
"The Lord God hath sworn by his holiness, that, lo, the days shall come upon you, that he will take you away with hooks, and your posterity with fishhooks". Amos.

Three days in the middle of the fish as three days in the middle of death.

The Quran says Jonah could have remained in fish until the
resurrection.

The Bible says money can be found in the mouths of fish.
The Bible also says money answers all things.

Dead people are fish.
Jesus gathered fish.

Jesus and Jonah were vomited back onto the Earth.

Prophecy got fulfilled or not, please? Right?
Did Jesus die a cursed death on the Cross? Right?

Regards

 

[Subduction Zone]

Scientific evidence and Bible prophecies.

Is there any scientific evidence that Jesus' prophecy of showing "Sign of Jonah" got fulfilled, please? Right?

No.

Prophecy got fulfilled or not, please? Right?

No.

Did Jesus die a cursed death on the Cross? Right?

Regards

He died on the cross. I am not sure about the "cursed" part.

 

[WonderingWorrier]

Scientific evidence and Bible prophecies.

Is there any scientific evidence that Jesus' prophecy of showing "Sign of Jonah" got fulfilled, please? Right?


Prophecy got fulfilled or not, please? Right?
Did Jesus die a cursed death on the Cross? Right?

Regards

Prophecy is fulfilled the very moment that it is spoken. Prophecy is not about a future event. Prophecy is just saying how it is. Prophecy is a sign language. Prophecy is building a structure with words. It is a matter of whether people can notice it or not.

It is both a blessing and a curse.

"If ye will not hear, and if ye will not lay it to heart, to give glory unto my name, saith the Lord of hosts, I will even send a curse upon you, and I will curse your blessings: yea, I have cursed them already, because ye do not lay it to heart". Malachi.

 

[paarsurrey]

paarsurrey said: ↑
Scientific evidence and Bible prophecies.

Is there any scientific evidence that Jesus' prophecy of showing "Sign of Jonah" got fulfilled, please? Right?

He died on the cross. I am not sure about the "cursed" part.

And one's arguments, please. Right?

Regards

 

[WonderingWorrier]

He died on the cross. I am not sure about the "cursed" part.

Are you sure about the "He died on the cross" part?

Because it seems he may not have.


Listen to what it says about the crucifixion in Corinthians 1:17-23.

"Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect.

For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.

For it is written, I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and will bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent.

Where is the wise? where is the scribe? where is the disputer of this world? hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world?

For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.

For the Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom:

But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness".



The Quran says it was just made to appear that way.

"That they said (in boast), "We killed Christ Jesus the son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah";- but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for of a surety they killed him not":



If people can't hear the words then they are deaf.

We have been cursed.


So could it be considered as possibly being a cursed death as our friend suggests. I think so.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Are you sure about the "He died on the cross" part?

Because it seems he may not have.


Listen to what it says about the crucifixion in Corinthians 1:17-23.

"Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect.

For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.

For it is written, I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and will bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent.

Where is the wise? where is the scribe? where is the disputer of this world? hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world?

For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.

For the Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom:

But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness".



The Quran says it was just made to appear that way.

"That they said (in boast), "We killed Christ Jesus the son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah";- but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for of a surety they killed him not":



If people can't hear the words then they are deaf.

We have been cursed.


So could it be considered as possibly being a cursed death as our friend suggests. I think so.

I would say that in this matter that the Quran is far less reliable than the Bible. Offshoot religions almost always are less accurate than the original in passing the story on.

 

[Brian2]

It would have been "legitimate" only if there was no all powerful God.

And an all powerful God makes is illegitimate? How?

 

[Brian2]

Does the title "Emmanuel", as per the Pauline-Bible*, fit on Jesus if he announced right on the Cross "Eli Eli Lama Sabachthani" translated "My God, my God, why hast Thou forsaken me", please? Right?
#80

Regards
_______________
*Pauline interpretation/creed " Jesus died a cursed death on the Cross"

Why wouldn't it fit?

 

[Subduction Zone]

And an all powerful God makes is illegitimate? How?

An all powerful God could have added slavery to his no no list and punished anyone that participated in it. He supposedly punished the early Hebrews as a nation many times. Why couldn't he have done so in this matter. It was almost as if he couldn't. In fact history is almost as if there was no God at all.

 

[SkepticThinker]

Those laws have to be seen in the context of the times and in the context of the rest of the law and how God wanted Israel to treat all people.
For a start it is not as bad as you are trying to make it. It is trying to bring some protection into it for the slave in the context of the master not wanting the slave to die or be injured so that he cannot work and owning the slave.
In a time when there were no prisoner of war camps slavery was a good way of dealing with pow s and in a time of no Government social security slavery was a good way to deal with poor people who wanted to survive or who could not pay what they owed.
All peoples in that time had slaves and the law brought some humanity into it.
It is interesting that you would judge the past by today's standards if you think that ethics is a matter of agreement in a social setting. Do you think that your moral code is absolute and 100% correct for all times and places?

I think it's not as good as you are trying to make it.
Owning human beings as property is immoral, no matter the context. One would think an all-knowing, all-powerful, loving creator of the universe would know that. In my opinion, this is just further evidence that fallible human beings wrote the Bible. I don't hold their ignorance against them. But I do hold it towards some God who is supposed to know better and had no problem making moral dictates about everything else under the sun.

 

[paarsurrey]

paarsurrey said: ↑
Does the title "Emmanuel*", as per the Pauline-Bible*, fit on Jesus if he announced right on the Cross "Eli Eli Lama Sabachthani" translated "My God, my God, why hast Thou forsaken me", please? Right?
#80

_______________
*Pauline interpretation/creed " Jesus died a cursed death on the Cross"

Why wouldn't it fit?

It only fits if G-d would have saved Jesus from a cursed death on the Cross. Right?

Regards
________
* "God with us"

 

[WonderingWorrier]

I would say that in this matter that the Quran is far less reliable than the Bible. Offshoot religions almost always are less accurate than the original in passing the story on.

The Quran has things that gained my attention just as the gospels has things that gained my attention. They both contain the same word structure of accurate prophecy that I earlier found in the OT.

But they may not appear as the same unless understood.

Like Muhammad splitting the moon, Moses splitting the sea, and Jesus picking the corn.

Same story.

The separating of the low.

Group1 - Group2 - Group3
Moon - Star - Sun
Sea - River - Stream
Corn - Oil - Wine


Could the Corinthians verses that I showed you be considered as saying the words of the crucifixion are not what they seem to be. As the hiding of wisdom in foolishness?


Could this verse also be considered as saying the words are not what they seem to be?

"Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word". John.


Verses saying people cant hear the words can be found throughout the bible and the quran.

So perhaps Jesus was not killed on the cross. Perhaps it just appears like he did by those who dont understand the words.

 

[Subduction Zone]

The Quran has things that gained my attention just as the gospels has things that gained my attention. They both contain the same word structure of accurate prophecy that I earlier found in the OT.

But they may not appear as the same unless understood.

Like Muhammad splitting the moon, Moses splitting the sea, and Jesus picking the corn.

Same story.

The separating of the low.

Group1 - Group2 - Group3
Moon - Star - Sun
Sea - River - Stream
Corn - Oil - Wine


Could the Corinthians verses that I showed you be considered as saying the words of the crucifixion are not what they seem to be. As the hiding of wisdom in foolishness?


Could this verse also be considered as saying the words are not what they seem to be?

"Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word". John.


Verses saying people cant hear the words can be found throughout the bible and the quran.

So perhaps Jesus was not killed on the cross. Perhaps it just appears like he did by those who dont understand the words.

What supposed accurate prophesies in the Bible? You may be reading things into the Bible that do not exist. If one does that almost any holy book can seem to be true.

 

[WonderingWorrier]

What supposed accurate prophesies in the Bible? You may be reading things into the Bible that do not exist. If one does that almost any holy book can seem to be true.

Prophecies put their words into positions. Thats why people cant hear them.

Heres an example.

The prophecy of the rusty gold and silver.

"Your gold and silver is cankered; and the rust of them shall be a witness against you, and shall eat your flesh as it were fire". Ye have heaped treasure together for the last days. James.


It's because people cant hear the words which has to do with the four metals representing the four directions of the earth and the heavens.

Earth - Group1 - Group2 - Group3
Iron - Brass - Silver - Gold

The Earth and the heavens is the treasury. Not churches where corruption and thieves are.

This verse could have been misunderstood.
"But all the silver, and gold, and vessels of brass and iron, are consecrated unto the Lord: they shall come into the treasury of the Lord". Joshua.



Its Earthly treasure vs Heavenly treasure.

"Lay not up for yourselves treasures upon earth, where moth and rust doth corrupt, and where thieves break through and steal.

But lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break through nor steal". Matthew.


Heavenly treasure:
"And thy heaven that is over thy head shall be brass, and the earth that is under thee shall be iron. Deuteronomy".



Above iron is brass, above brass is silver, and above silver is gold.

Earthly gold and silver is classed as iron because the Earth is represented by iron.

And iron rusts.

So the Earthly gold and silver was just rusty iron but people never saw it happen because they didnt understand the words.

 

[paarsurrey]

"Scientific evidence and Bible prophecies."

Is there any scientific evidence that Jesus' prophecy of showing "Sign of Jonah" got
fulfilled, please? Right?

And it is a wrong notion of the Pauline-Hellenists that the above Prophecy of "Sign of Jonah" was made by Jesus to prove that Jesus was god (dying-rising-Hellenist thought). If Jonah after coming out of the fish could not become god, how could Jesus become god, please. Right?

Regards

 

[Subduction Zone]

@paarsurrey , the problem appears to be that you do not understand what scientific evidence is. Let me help you to understand.

Can you tell me what reasonable test based upon the Bible could possibly refute That the "Sign of Jonah Prophecy" is wrong?

 

[paarsurrey]

@paarsurrey , the problem appears to be that you do not understand what scientific evidence is. Let me help you to understand.

Can you tell me what reasonable test based upon the Bible could possibly refute That the "Sign of Jonah Prophecy" is wrong?

I didn't say that "Sign of Jonah" prophecy is not fulfilled. I hold that the Pauline-Hellenist interpretation of the prophecy is wrong, please. Right?

Regards