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Bergoglio said: see you in Hell, maybe
- Thread starter Estro Felino
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VoidCat
Pronouns: he/him/they/them
Well he is an adult. Why not? Maybe not in a professional setting but among his friends sure.
I mean, publicly
RestlessSoul
Well-Known Member
VoidCat
Pronouns: he/him/they/them
Honestly i don't see an issue depending on the context and what the circumstances were of the joke. But I'm not one for conventional norms and know folk tend to have high standards for their religious leaders standards they don't expect others or themselves to reach. I think if the norm doesnt have a point it shouldn't exist and to me there is no point to the pope not being allowed to make them unless you count convention. To me I wouldn't care if the pope made a vulgar joke so long as it doesnt degrade anyone.
Edit: also depends if children are present. No vulgar jokes around kids
Edit again: it must be hard to be a religious leader and have standards place on you that others wouldn't place on someone else
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Heyo
Veteran Member
Franciscus himself said he believes atheists can go to heaven. But if you apply the formula, you'd better have good deeds and enough grace if your faith is 0.
Why not? The pope is a man.
metis
aged ecumenical anthropologist
My wife said after listening to it that PF was clearly trying to soothe and reassure her that her son's autistic behavior would not at all likely be a threat to his salvation. If you've dealt with autism, you'd know that the behavior of those who have it can be quite unpredictable and even hostile at times.
I don't know with certainty, but she gave him a cordial goodbye.
My question back to you is why would you assume the worse, which is exactly what you did? I said from the get-go that I didn't know, as my understanding of Italian is limited, which is why I called my wife down to help me not only with the translation but also the context of his response.
metis
aged ecumenical anthropologist
The above is a non-sequitur, thus you really haven't put "two and two together".@pearl
Nevertheless, we have a Vatican that is rumored to be a Freemasonic den, and there is another rumor that says that some Freemasons worship Satan,
Then a Pope, the head of the Universal Church, who is supposed to be Saint Peter's successor, jokes about Hell.
Well...I can put two and two together.
The woman sounded and looked weirded out, in my humble opinion.
She said "maybe we may go to Hell, but you will not, your Holiness".
There is no logic in the pope's words.
I speak Italian so I do know if a particular tonality or intonation is "playful" or has some "malicious element".
After all...mine is a language wich has hundreds of different intonations, and they all depend on what one means to convey.
I surely did not like what he said, but above all the way he said it.
I know what I have perceived. And it was not pleasant.
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metis
aged ecumenical anthropologist
And so does my wife, and she soundly disagrees with you as she said PF's demeanor clearly was to soothe her fears over her child.
VoidCat
Pronouns: he/him/they/them
@Estro Felino and @metis
Does the intonations in Italian change depending on the region? Much like with other languages? Maybe knowing that would help in this conversation?
She told the Pope that he needs no prayer because he is already a saint.
He answers saying it is not true...that he may go to Hell.
But the most shocking thing is that he tells her they may meet again there.
Yes.
Ella S.
*temp banned*
Nobody deserves eternal torment, especially not for some of the rather mundane things considered "mortal sins" by the Catholic Church, like profanity and missing mass.
The Bible agrees with you because the wicked are 'destroyed forever' (Psalms 92:7; Psalms 104:35; Proverbs 2:21-22) so the ' eternal torment ' is 'eternal ruin' ( Douay 2 Thessalonians 1:9 ) The 'destruction' of ungodly people - 2 Peter 3:7 B.
Matthew 7:21
What atheist follows Jesus' instruction found at Matthew 24:13-14; Acts of the Apostles 1:8 to go around telling others about the Good News (Gospel) of God's Kingdom (Daniel 2:44) in the hands of Christ Jesus for a thousand years - 1 Corinthians 15:24-26