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A relationship with God.

an anarchist

Your local anarchist.
I don’t require scientific evidence to reinforce my faith in God, it is ultimately irrelevant to me. I’ve dived into Christian apologetics before, I used to need it to reinforce what I believe. But I have developed a relationship with God, rendering useless the need to prove God.
People who follow God(s) (however you view God), do you feel like you have a relationship with them? How can you best describe this relationship? Is your relationship sufficient proof of God’s existence for yourself?
I want to describe what I mean by a relationship with God, as I feel like perhaps this isn’t something theists (myself included), or atheists, fully grasp. Then I want you to describe your relationship with your God.
My relationship with God feels very similar to my relationships with people. God feels present, and is interactive with me. The more effort I put into the relationship, the closer we grow. When I stop talking to Him, we drift. It is the same as my relationships with humans. Though with God there is reverence and fear, something I don’t have for my fellow humans. My God has taught me a lot through His word and through life itself. He has guided my footsteps from the very moment I walked. I was lucky to start developing my relationship with God at an early age, and it only matures as time goes on. He has taught me to call on Him when I am in need. He has shown that He will protect me from myself and others. Such is my relationship with God.
If my happiness was dependent on another human being, the relationship would be considered toxic. My happiness is dependent on my relationship with God, but it is not toxic.
A couple atheists were asking me how I could believe in (my specific interpretation of) God if I could see that science might be contrary to what I believe. It is because of this relationship I have with Him. It is important and (in my belief) real.
 
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F1fan

Veteran Member
When you say you have a relationship with God, as a mortal being, what exactly is it you are relating to, and what part of your mortal being engages with what you say is God?

Could it all be imagined?
 

an anarchist

Your local anarchist.
When you say you have a relationship with God, as a mortal being, what exactly is it you are relating to, and what part of your mortal being engages with what you say is God?

Could it all be imagined?
I believe I have a soul. I believe my soul is what engages with God, as I believe the soul is in part God. I relate to God’s morality. Not that I am a moral person, far from it, but rather that God can make me moral like Him through a relationship with God. So we relate through morality.
It could very well be imagined. It’s important for me though that I let this God be reality for me. The belief empowers me, I might say that if I’m empowered by my beliefs, the truth behind it may not matter so much.
I recognize I could just be a lucky guy, and there was no God when I cried for help in desperate times. People who cry out to God for help die every day. So perhaps I’m just lucky.
 

Kenny

Face to face with my Father
Premium Member
I don’t require scientific evidence to reinforce my faith in God, it is ultimately irrelevant to me. I’ve dived into Christian apologetics before, I used to need it to reinforce what I believe. But I have developed a relationship with God, rendering useless the need to prove God.
People who follow God(s) (however you view God), do you feel like you have a relationship with them? How can you best describe this relationship? Is your relationship sufficient proof of God’s existence for yourself?
I want to describe what I mean by a relationship with God, as I feel like perhaps this isn’t something theists (myself included), or atheists, fully grasp. Then I want you to describe your relationship with your God.
My relationship with God feels very similar to my relationships with people. God feels present, and is interactive with me. The more effort I put into the relationship, the closer we grow. When I stop talking to Him, we drift. It is the same as my relationships with humans. Though with God there is reverence and fear, something I don’t have for my fellow humans. My God has taught me a lot through His word and through life itself. He has guided my footsteps from the very moment I walked. I was lucky to start developing my relationship with God at an early age, and it only matures as time goes on. He has taught me to call on Him when I am in need. He has shown that He will protect me from myself and others. Such is my relationship with God.
If my happiness was dependent on another human being, the relationship would be considered toxic. My happiness is dependent on my relationship with God, but it is not toxic.
A couple atheists were asking me how I could believe in (my specific interpretation of) God if I could see that science might be contrary to what I believe. It is because of this relationship I have with Him. It is important and (in my belief) real.
Thank you for sharing your heart!

I love the analogy of your relationship with people. The more you put into the relationship, the closer we grow.

For me, with my relationship with the God that I worship and follow, I love the fact that the pursuit is more Him towards me that me towards Him. An amazing love that even when I was separated, He was reaching out.

Ultimately, I don't need to "prove" that I have a wife. It is sufficient that I know I have a wife and that we have a relationship.

Again, thanks for sharing your viewpoint.
 

F1fan

Veteran Member
I believe I have a soul. I believe my soul is what engages with God, as I believe the soul is in part God. I relate to God’s morality. Not that I am a moral person, far from it, but rather that God can make me moral like Him through a relationship with God. So we relate through morality.
It could very well be imagined. It’s important for me though that I let this God be reality for me. The belief empowers me, I might say that if I’m empowered by my beliefs, the truth behind it may not matter so much.
I recognize I could just be a lucky guy, and there was no God when I cried for help in desperate times. People who cry out to God for help die every day. So perhaps I’m just lucky.
So you think souls and God are real, but you aren't sure. So what if you are mistaken?
 

an anarchist

Your local anarchist.
So you think souls and God are real, but you aren't sure. So what if you are mistaken?
Hmm, that’s what the cliche pascal wager is all about, right? If I’m wrong, well I suppose I’ll “waste” my singular mortal life serving something not real. But even then, I don’t think it would be a waste living a life of a religious man, if it helps me find happiness.
 

rational experiences

Veteran Member
I never had a God relationship as a human as I didn't believe in just human preaching. Equal humans telling me just a human belief.

I asked myself as I own myself and use my owned human brain that hadn't existed before. My mind came from sperm and an ovary. Correct human review.

I said if spirit by human man teaching was real prove it. Asked where I ask in my own head.

Humans either a man or a woman.

A man's voice said in my brain hearing if you want it proved live the human spiritual life.

Basic advice is do as little harm as possible without fanatical preaching.

Man's voice means my human father.

He him his human quotes man defined by penis ownership.

So doing a review human behaviour Muslim men said they had sex after death. Only biology owns sexual conditions blood engorged bio chemical sex responses.

I asked why. Pretty basic reason to ask.

Life as biological life is heavenly image voice recorded. A humans scientific teaching only. Machines human built human mind controlled designed by humans prove it's real.

Transmitted by machine recorded voice image.

Known.
Of course my father the natural spiritual human had not invented the sciences.

Science is about pre existing mass terms used by humans as science.

My human brother had designed causes.

Reason a human biology is owner human biological conscious.

It made sense why I heard a non physical presence in my life speaking...as biology spiritual is no longer present in my life.

Father's human DNA holy life water sacrificed out of biology. Taught.

Origin father mother owned. Our biology life supported living water oxygenated taken to contradict nuclear gas heavens flame fallout.

Biology human mainly just water.

It was understood before. Taught before. Our spiritual families human memories keep us safe if we listen to them and not our ego.

By human brain bio chemistry inheritance.

As too many humans today still exhibit personal human egotism claiming balanced spirituality when they aren't.

God states are human science taught. Gases and nuclear history when no human biology existed was God.

As we live in the presence thinned evaporated water mass removal returned...ground life oxygenated.

If you believe in the eternal God it's presence is on the other side of space. Caused holding separated God bodies from the eternal by burst burning.

The heavens took into its dense gas space so the heavens contacted the eternal.

Where we came from direct.

As human science theories only by use a human brain did not invent my living presence by thinking and talking.

I was shown the eternal body does not speak nor judge like humans do. It was in father's memory only seeing my mother come direct out of spirit.

Not at his side. Animals were at his side by term before him. And then science maths direct to thinking the heavens around him....as he stood on the God science ground himself.
 
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RestlessSoul

Well-Known Member
I believe I have a soul. I believe my soul is what engages with God, as I believe the soul is in part God. I relate to God’s morality. Not that I am a moral person, far from it, but rather that God can make me moral like Him through a relationship with God. So we relate through morality.
It could very well be imagined. It’s important for me though that I let this God be reality for me. The belief empowers me, I might say that if I’m empowered by my beliefs, the truth behind it may not matter so much.
I recognize I could just be a lucky guy, and there was no God when I cried for help in desperate times. People who cry out to God for help die every day. So perhaps I’m just lucky.


I don't think you're lucky, I think you're blessed.
 

F1fan

Veteran Member
No harm done AND I learned a lot AND I'm happy

So, what if you are mistaken?
Well I'd be curious how many other believers are in my camp of being mistaken. I have to acknowledge that it's not just a matter of being a theist or atheist, but what version of theist a person is. If conservative Christians are correct, and if Muslims are correct, these Gods are not going to be happy that others believed in the wrong God any more than some didn't believe in any God.

So, can any of us really be sure enough to feel comfortable? Hell no.

I think the phrasing of "having a relationship with God" can help soothe the uncertainty and anxiety a theist has because this implies they are engaging with a real, independent being, not an idea that are responsible for creating in their mind. It's a way of avoiding the inner conflict and doubt.

This is all an inherited effect of a religious history that humans evolved into, and still have as an intellectual and emotional burden in many ways.
 
I think that actually I don't have a direct relationship with the biblical God. I guess I never did it.

Not that I didn't try, but I think He just don't like me. (This is a sad consequence of not being a good looking dude)

I have even been a guitar player in a church band. I had a terrible ending while doing so.

Every time in the past, when I made a good work like helping the homeless, that very same day something bad happened to me. This experience repeated itself so meany times that I quit helping others.

Right here, I want to say something wrong about the God of the Bible and I can't. Man! I don't know why I can't do such a simple task. On the contrary, I ended writing in his favor.

I don't considered Him my Father..

I know I have learnt a lot since I reviewed the biblical writings, I can see what others miss in the Bible, and had helped me a lot when is about the different branches of science, history, car repair, whatever...

At the end of the day, I think my relationship is with the biblical writings, His words, His works, His ways...
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
Well I'd be curious how many other believers are in my camp of being mistaken. I have to acknowledge that it's not just a matter of being a theist or atheist, but what version of theist a person is. If conservative Christians are correct, and if Muslims are correct, these Gods are not going to be happy that others believed in the wrong God any more than some didn't believe in any God.

So, can any of us really be sure enough to feel comfortable? Hell no.

I think the phrasing of "having a relationship with God" can help soothe the uncertainty and anxiety a theist has because this implies they are engaging with a real, independent being, not an idea that are responsible for creating in their mind. It's a way of avoiding the inner conflict and doubt.

This is all an inherited effect of a religious history that humans evolved into, and still have as an intellectual and emotional burden in many ways.

I am rather amazed that even today Christians make a terrible black and white fallacy when they use Pascal's wager. They usually use it against atheists thinking that it is a slam dunk, they always forget about the thousands of other possible gods out there. And since it is easy to show creationists using their beliefs to justify poor treatment of others it is easy to reply that if there God is the wrong God that he might have it in more for Christians than he does for atheists.
 

rational experiences

Veteran Member
All human's own one species life. The human life only living inside a natural exact where it is and as it is heavens mass.

Human theists are liars. Pretty basic human advice.

You pretend thoughts human owned to force them to be displaced from natural living purpose as self survival. By the time you stop spruiking your ego you dont even answer naturally. As natural life advice.

Humans invented Ai. The machine by human only God mass changed chosen conversion terms as theists. Naming it Satanism. As godism isn't real. As natural is.

Just because you force group bully tactics on life does not in any format make you correct. You're an equal human first is exact.

So there isn't any other story. As when you say exact terms first it means exact terms first. Equal human. No story.

Once no theism was tolerated after all the human suffering you caused theist lying human scientists.

Maybe humanity will get a reminder what a liar you are before you destroy all life on earth.
 

F1fan

Veteran Member
I believe I have a soul. I believe my soul is what engages with God, as I believe the soul is in part God. I relate to God’s morality. Not that I am a moral person, far from it, but rather that God can make me moral like Him through a relationship with God. So we relate through morality.
What I notice about this is how you are just repeating what we hear in a Christian church. None of this has any factual basis, so I wonder why you decided to adopt and accept what your church said, and now believe it's true. Have you ever stopped and pondered why you behave this way?

It could very well be imagined. It’s important for me though that I let this God be reality for me. The belief empowers me, I might say that if I’m empowered by my beliefs, the truth behind it may not matter so much.
I recognize I could just be a lucky guy, and there was no God when I cried for help in desperate times. People who cry out to God for help die every day. So perhaps I’m just lucky.
Have you considered that there are other ways to empower your thinking about how you value yourself? Does it not trouble you that your self-value depends on ideas that you acknowledge might not be true? This seems to put you in a position where you have anxiety, and have to work to maintain the religious illusions, especially when your life situation is stressful and miracles do not come true?
 

F1fan

Veteran Member
I am rather amazed that even today Christians make a terrible black and white fallacy when they use Pascal's wager. They usually use it against atheists thinking that it is a slam dunk, they always forget about the thousands of other possible gods out there. And since it is easy to show creationists using their beliefs to justify poor treatment of others it is easy to reply that if there God is the wrong God that he might have it in more for Christians than he does for atheists.
It all depends on holding onto a set of assumptions that the church says is true. And not only are there no facts these assumptions are true, they aren't consistent with what we know of real life. And as you note, there are competing beliefs to Christianity.

I think the attraction for so many to religious illusion is because it offers an immediate place for the ego to retreat to in tough time of life stress. It offers a scenario of value for the self that the self can use, and this is beneficial because trying to create value for ourselves requires work, and we win and lose. I don't see many fols feel very confident nor have an earned self-worth. For a believer to fall back on the idea that "God loves me" allows a person an illusion to rely on when they fail themselves.

I've had depression and serious life challenges before and I can understand how being distracted from this harsh reality helps cope. The bottom line for me is that I prefer to be rooted in what is real and true and be lost in some sort of illusion as i see others do. I see many believers who really seem to believe their beliefs are true and I can't understand why a person would opt to live in such a deep illusion and not be able to see what is real versus what is illusion. Much of this has an evolved and biological component, so it seems evident many believers have no real option. It's just the way their brains work, and they can't see beyond the ideas they believe are true.
 

pearl

Well-Known Member
God feels present, and is interactive with me.

God is always present. I must always be conscious of being in His presence. Especially when things are going wrong in my life. I do not look for proof since faith requires no proof, if I assume it possible to understand or define God, it is not God whom I understand. I am comfortable with God being an incomprehensible Mystery.
 

F1fan

Veteran Member
Thank you for sharing your heart!

I love the analogy of your relationship with people. The more you put into the relationship, the closer we grow.

For me, with my relationship with the God that I worship and follow, I love the fact that the pursuit is more Him towards me that me towards Him. An amazing love that even when I was separated, He was reaching out.
How did you first hear about this God?

Is it Vishnu? Or Shiva, perhaps? Who is your God? Do you think other Gods exist?

Ultimately, I don't need to "prove" that I have a wife. It is sufficient that I know I have a wife and that we have a relationship.
Wives have the advantage of actually existing, and anyone with working senses can verify your wife exists. If you tell your friends and neighbors you have a wife, but in 20 years no one has ever seen her, they might question whether she really exists. But you still have a plausible claim since we all know that wives exist in reality.
 

Kenny

Face to face with my Father
Premium Member
As my tag says, this is strictly my faith's viewpoint.

How did you first hear about this God?

Is it Vishnu? Or Shiva, perhaps? Who is your God? Do you think other Gods exist?

I'm sure many people have given Him a name but He has revealed Himself as Father.

Do other gods exist? Certainly. For that matter, we can be our own god. But He is the Creator of all that exists.

Deep inside, I guess I always knew there was a God. As the scripture I mentioned said, all I have to do is look at creation and deep inside I knew that it wasn't a "accident" waiting to happen. It was created with purpose.

I think we all want to know that we have a purpose.

I first met Him at age 28 when after hours and hours of questioning I gave my life to Jesus Christ.

Wives have the advantage of actually existing, and anyone with working senses can verify your wife exists. If you tell your friends and neighbors you have a wife, but in 20 years no one has ever seen her, they might question whether she really exists. But you still have a plausible claim since we all know that wives exist in reality.

True. But there are some nuances. If I said "I have a wife" and you see lipstick on my cheek, see me buying roses on my anniversary, see a child that I call my son and another my daughter, you may know that a wife exists but you just never saw her in 20 years.

So we can look at creation and know there is a God even if we can't see Him.

Of course, Jesus said, " John 20:29 Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed."
 
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