Baha'i and Messengers

[Spirit of Light]

It did not happen that way, Seeker of White Light. Social rules are present even among animals.

Does not atheists believe humans are animals?

 

[Trailblazer]

If we look at history, no society has lasted for ever, even for me who like Baha'i teachings, it seems impossible that society will not change in the future as it has done in the past

The stage which the world is now approaching is the stage of world unity but society will continue to change and evolve throughout all time.

Religion and Social Evolution

 

[Aupmanyav]

Does not atheists believe humans are animals?

Where is the difference? We belong to:
Kingdom: Animalia,
Phyllum: Chordata,
Class: Mammalia,
Order: Primates,
Sub-order: Haplorhini,
Infraorder: Simiformes,
Family: Hominidae,
Subfamily: Homininae,
Tribe: Hominini,
Genus: Homo,
Species: Homo sapiens,
Sub-species: Homo sapiens sapiens. That are modern humans.

 

[Aupmanyav]

No, not that long... Maybe about 1000 years from now a new world order will be in place but humanity will continue to progress after that, for all of time.

In a thousand years or earlier, Bahaollah's message will be forgotten or corrupted, and Allah will be obliged to send another manifestation. But many say Allah has already sent the next, the Mahdi in Mirza Ghulam Ahmad of the Ahmadiyya sect.

 

[lukethethird]

In a thousand years or earlier, Bahaollah's message will be forgotten or corrupted, and Allah will be obliged to send another manifestation. But many say Allah has already sent the next, the Mahdi in Mirza Ghulam Ahmad of the Ahmadiyya sect.

So there it is, Baha'i is yesterday's news, glad that's over with.

 

[Spirit of Light]

Where is the difference? We belong to:
Kingdom: Animalia,
Phyllum: Chordata,
Class: Mammalia,
Order: Primates,
Sub-order: Haplorhini,
Infraorder: Simiformes,
Family: Hominidae,
Subfamily: Homininae,
Tribe: Hominini,
Genus: Homo,
Species: Homo sapiens,
Sub-species: Homo sapiens sapiens. That are modern humans.

The difference is that humans are not animals according to religious teaching.

 

[Trailblazer]

In a thousand years or earlier, Bahaollah's message will be forgotten or corrupted, and Allah will be obliged to send another manifestation. But many say Allah has already sent the next, the Mahdi in Mirza Ghulam Ahmad of the Ahmadiyya sect.

Baha'u'llah's message will never be corrupted because it is protected from corruption by the Covenant of Baha'u'llah. Allah will be obliged to send another Manifestation in no less than 1000 years from 1852 AD, but all future Manifestations will be under that shadow of Baha'u'llah during the present religious cycle which will last 500,000 years.

There will be new and different messages in the future but Baha'u'llah's message will never be forgotten, and the Twin Manifestations, the Bab and Baha'u'llah, will always be known as the Ones who ushered in an entirely new religious cycle, the likes of which humanity had never before witnessed.

 

[Trailblazer]

So there it is, Baha'i is yesterday's news, glad that's over with.

Sorry to disappoint you but it will not be yesterday's news until at least 2852 AD.

 

[Brian2]

Whatever, to love everyone is a beautiful teaching.

To claim that Baha'u'llah taught something better than that is dishonest.

 

[Brian2]

You know that verse where it says here's a Christ and there's a Christ but don't believe them, because when Jesus comes it will be obvious. Then the wars and rumors of wars. There's still wars, so is it already the end? But not now, 150 years ago was it the end?

Like I've said in the past, I'd rather have the Baha'is be right then a literal Christianity, but there's just too much that doesn't fit and hasn't been fulfilled.

Matt 24:14And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in all the world as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come.

The gospel certainly had not been preached to the whole world 150 years ago.

 

[Brian2]

Yet no flesh Jesus has been seen for 2000 years, nor will that flesh be ever seen again.

Science tells us the atoms that made up the body of jesus have now dispersed into other life forms.

Jesus said the flesh amounts to nothing, it I the Spirit (Christ aspect of Jesus) that is our life and what can light our soul.

Regards Tony

Jesus was resurrected in a glorified and incorruptible and immortal body which He still has. He was a human and rose as a human.
I think you are taking John 6:63 out of context and giving it a meaning it did not have.
Actually the Spirit will give life to the mortal bodies of those who have the Spirit dwelling in them. (Romans 8:11)
It is when our body is redeemed ( raised from the dead) that our adoption as God's children is complete.

Romans 8:23 Not only so, but we ourselves, who have the firstfruits of the Spirit, groan inwardly as we wait eagerly for our adoption to sonship, the redemption of our bodies.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Allah will be obliged to send another Manifestation in no less than 1000 years from 1852 AD, but all future Manifestations will be under that shadow of Baha'u'llah during the present religious cycle which will last 500,000 years.

That you have plagiarized from Hinduism. Kaliyuga for 432,000 years. Why would a manifestation be under any shadow? Show me where is that written. Don't make random claims out of ...

Baha'u'llah's message will never be corrupted because it is protected from corruption by the Covenant of Baha'u'llah.

In time, some very quickly and some late, all messages are corrupted. You make claims that perhaps not even Bahaollah made. Bahaollah never said that Krishna and Buddha are manifestations of Allah. His message was corrupted by Abdul Baha and Shoghi. That is what happened to the messages of earlier manifestations as per your own view. They too had their own covenants.

 

[Vinayaka]

I'm reading an article about the Baha'i "teaching" efforts in India...

One vehicle which provided a means whereby Baha'i teachings could be made more comprehensible within the Hindu tradition, and one which developed spontaneously during the mass teaching period, was the bhajan. A bhajan is a rhythmic devotional song that has long been popular among bhakti sects in India.

In the Baha'i bhajans the avatar concept/symbol becomes the Hindu equivalent of the Baha'i concept/symbol of prophet (or manifestation) and is used interchangeably with them despite the fact that in the Baha'i writings the idea of God's incarnation is rejected

Another Hindu avatar figure who made his way into the bhajans was Rama, and his use raises some interesting questions regarding the development of Baha'i mythology/theology not only in India but world wide. As with the Buddha and Krishna, the figure of Rama, so prevalent in the legends and lore of popular Hinduism, receives no mention in the writings of Baha'u'llah. Moreover, as far as this author is aware, he does not appear in the writings of Abdu'l-Baha, nor was he referred to as a Manifestation of God by Shoghi Effendi.

What is significant here is that Rama is placed besides other prophetic figures, all of whom are officially considered manifestations of God in the Baha'i Faith, and such a contextual reference would almost have certainly been understood by many in the audience as a legitimization.

As much of the initial missionary activity in Malwa took place among the lower tribes and castes, it would make sense that the message of eschatological hope associated with the kalkin avatar would be recognized by Baha'i teachers as a meaningful way to spread their message among this segment of the social hierarchy. Also, the eschatological universalism inherent in Baha'i prophetic claims allows for an easy symbolic association. Both of these themes can be found in the following verses of a popular Baha'i bhajan:

Arise O children of India, the kalkin avatar has come; Vishnu's avatar has come with the name Baha'u'llah Nowhere in the entire world can the influence of religion be seen. The wicked have obtained everything; the truthful have lost all. According to the Gita the time of Vishnu's avatar has come...Arise​

Interesting stuff. And I can see why Baha'i were successful in getting converts in rural villages.

I seriously doubt they were very successful. In village India, they'll 'convert' to anything to please the guest. But once that guest is gone, they revert. I remember an anthropology study from my university days, where westerners, concerned about India's population, went to villages and gave out free birth control pills, explaining how they worked, etc. On follow-up trips, they discovered that the pills had transformed into a local form of currency, were being traded, and collected. The entire point of the lesson was on how outsiders may think they understand a small culture, they really don't.

(The reason they weren't being used was because one child, if successful at school, or athletics, can change the life of the family entirely. So each new child is like a lottery ticket.)

Of course in Baha'i statistics, all these villages are counted. It explains why the Baha'i figures show 2 million, and the government of India census has the Baha'i population at less than 5000.

 

[Audie]

You just don't care, do you? Goodbye.

Yet another "response" unhinged from topic.

 

[Audie]

I seriously doubt they were very successful. In village India, they'll 'convert' to anything to please the guest. But once that guest is gone, they revert. I remember an anthropology study from my university days, where westerners, concerned about India's population, went to villages and gave out free birth control pills, explaining how they worked, etc. On follow-up trips, they discovered that the pills had transformed into a local form of currency, were being traded, and collected. The entire point of the lesson was on how outsiders may think they understand a small culture, they really don't.

(The reason they weren't being used was because one child, if successful at school, or athletics, can change the life of the family entirely. So each new child is like a lottery ticket.)

Of course in Baha'i statistics, all these villages are counted. It explains why the Baha'i figures show 2 million, and the government of India census has the Baha'i population at less than 5000.

Maybe they do not have the patience to unpack
a page of turgid prose to find one sentence worth of message, " worth" not referring to
value.

 

[Audie]

What makes you think I was guessing? There you are guessing again.

Note how i didnt say you were guessing.

 

[KWED]

Not every human has opened their heart enough to gain the wisdom to understand message from God or messengers, it is nothing wrong with Baha'i practitioners or the God they believe in. They have a different teaching in some aspects.

So one can only see the evidence for god if one believes god exists.
Makes sense.

 

[KWED]

So, subvert free-will?

The Abrahamic god removes free will anyway.

 

[Spirit of Light]

So one can only see the evidence for god if one believes god exists.
Makes sense.

Well if you dont believe God exist, He could stand in front of you, and you would not believe it was God.
So faith and belief does lead toward understanding and seeing God, yes

 

[KWED]

Well, it does not work like that, as a human being we have a vail in us called ego, until our ego slipp away communication with God is more or less impossible.
God could "stand" next to you and you would not see God, due to ego. So it is actually up to us humans to do the job.

Why did god create us with an ego that prevents us from seeing him?