No more babies being delivered at NY hospital

[Shadow Wolf]

The thing is, Shadow. I'm just talking about medical ethics not whether to take the vaccine or not. Whoever takes the vaccine or not is their thing "and" that doesn't exclude I would hope most people check with their doctors (IF appropriate) before jumping the gun. The argument isn't for or against vaccines just something ideally people should do when they are told to take something that benefits their health and in this case others.

Everyone who is eligible has been suggested they get the vaccine.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Yes. This should be for all people who are concerned whether they have preexisting conditions or not. Its alright to say "hey, let me think about this more than just CDC data A" before jumping to get the vaccine.

There's no reason. The vaccines are generally safe, with the risk of severe side effects being tremendously lower than the chances of a severe covid infection. CDC, WHO, NHS, it's not like it's only one agency has studied these or encouraging people to get it.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Everyone who is eligible has been suggested they get the vaccine.

Any expert can suggest anything but if a person is concerned healthy or not they should go to their doctor not what CDC and WHO tells them to do.

Most people are relatively healthy (generalizing) so they wouldn't "need" to but ideally and morally it would be a good idea to check with people who know you before the data authoritative source or not. At the end of all our medical products in the US says "check with your doctor first." I don't see the pandemic any different in these regards.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

There's no reason. The vaccines are generally safe, with the risk of severe side effects being tremendously lower than the chances of a severe covid infection. CDC, WHO, NHS, it's not like it's only one agency has studied these or encouraging people to get it.

CDC, WHO, and NHS all have similar information. Since CDC is in the states I refer to that.

They are genuinely safe, I'm saying ideally a person would go to a doctor before they take a med, vaccine, or treatment someone suggests them. IF CDC/WHO/NHS told me to take a medication because it works, I'd say no. It's not that they aren't experts-they are just not experts in "my" situation.

But yes, healthy people are pretty much safe but I'm not saying they are not.

 

[Alienistic]

Yes, because like the vaccination the antibodies the body produces, either by being sick or vaccinated, wanes over time.

Some hospitals are allowing medical professionals that can show they’ve tested positive for covid exempt from vaccination due to natural immunity. Based upon new research that is led to believe that natural immunity is very effective, while they are still uncertain how long this lasts or when and if it will wane. So the waning period still is uncertain.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Most people are relatively healthy (generalizing) so they wouldn't "need"

Again, that mentality has FAILED. It DOES NOT work! Even the young and healthy fall critically ill, chronically ill, and die.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

It's not that they aren't experts-they are just not experts in "my" situation.

You aren't a special. Your situation doesn't set you apart.

 

[F1fan]

We have a lot of hypocrites. Like all the democrats talking without masks on until the camera show up.

I know the single incident you are referring to. It was a group of Democrats talking before a press conference. Of course as we know Democrats have an excellent track record for using safety measures so have been a safer group to hang our with versus republicans who were dropping like flies at that time. It was a bad optic, but only because there have been so many misinformed citizens making Covid a political issue. That you even bring this up is political.

Now contrast this with the policy hypocrisy of republicans. One one hand they assert they are pro life because they are prohibiting women from getting legal abortions after six weeks. Yet they also oppose mask mandates and vaccinations which will certainly save lives. Their policies about the pandemic have actually cost lives to be lost. They can't have it both ways.

So you should think through your examples better before you play Hypocrite Jeopardy.

We do have some republicans who really care and have gotten people out of Afghanistan in spite of the administration.

I think those guys were showboating and playing for the cameras. They definitely caused the military and state department some stress by playing cowboy.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

You aren't a special. Your situation doesn't set you apart.

I never said it did. You're adding to it than what I actually said.

Replace my situation with Joe Sno.

The point is the same. Go to docs that know you if you're concerned. Don't take things for granted.

Whatever personal stuff you're adding is irrelevant

 

[F1fan]

If they worked, it wouldn't be temporary. Hence why we upgraded to masks and vaccines and boosters.

Jeez you really don't understand how any of this works.

To make a lockdown work premamnetly would mean to close everything down, EVERYTHING, for two weeks to stop all spread in the USA. We would also have to close all travel in and out of the nation almost completely. People could leave any time and any number. But ALL people coming in would have to do what Taiwan does and make every person quarantine for two weeks and ensure no Covid. Taiwan is a small 25 million people nation, and they were able to essentially make Covid a non-issue for their nation. But they have VERY strict protocols that NOONE can deny. The government sets the rules and no citizen or tourist can deny what they say. And they had almost zero Covid.

The USA can't do this effectively. The economy would suffer catastrophically.

The lockdowns in the USA were meant to buy time until a vaccine was developed. This was widely reported.

Your doctor would tell you what's appropriate for you based on what he learned. You can trust what your doctor says, get a second opinion, and/or evaluate for yourself if that's what you need abet it not be something serious. The patients usually have some say in their healthcare choices. No doctor (and expert for that matter) would put their knowledge ahead of their patient's. That's basic medical ethics.

Yeah, the vaccinations are pretty black and white. Doctors are going to suggest you get it, unless you have a medical problem. But we aren't talking about people with medical problems, we are talking about right wingers trying to find excuses to not cooperate with society and avoid they civic duty.

Speak of the arguments not me. I've been in hospitals a good lot of my life and second opinions and criticisms led me to "not be dead."

Well if a doctor tells you to avoid vaccines and use crystal power for healing, that's a bad doctor. Good doctors will tell you to get vaccinated and not be another victim he has to try to keep alive.

Ask "your" doctor. Scientist and experts say Advil works fine. Your doctor says take Asprin. Who will you listen to?

Pfizer or Moderno, pick one and be vaccinated.

I never said they were not effective. You (guys) can repeat "vaccines are safe" till the cows come home but I never disagreed.

My point is don't take anything for granted.

You don't seem to value good advice either.

I also said that relatively healthy people don't need to ask their doctors but its a good idea (as experts say) if they are concern ask their doctor before jumping to take the vaccine (med, whatever).

Then do it. Jesus. You keep trying to drag your feet on it. You're like a kid avoiding eating his vegetables and he's sitting at the table 3 hours after everyone has finished.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I never said it did. You're adding to it than what I actually said.

You did.

It's not that they aren't experts-they are just not experts in "my" situation.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

The lack of respect here for all of the unvaccinated medical staff who have risked and given their lives in helping hundreds of millions of people throughout a hostile and stressful situation is mind blowing... over a vaccine mandate. When they’ve been doing this way before a vaccine even existed and have been while one has existed.

It truly is sad that these medical employees are being called selfish, destructive to society, should have no access to medical care themselves, should be not considered human or taken seriously in anything, to go with all of the other negative things everyone here has said about them.

Yes, and most of these people view themselves as "progressives", "liberals", "socialists", etc. who would argue passionately that healthcare is a basic human right, people have a right to a job, etc. I would laugh about it if these people weren't threatening to destroy my life, or wishing for it to be destroyed.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

You did.

Where did I say I was special?

Using me as an example?

I can't take your word for it.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Where did I say I was special?

Using me as an example?

I can't take your word for it.

You said they aren't experts in your situation. Your situation is nothing special or unique. Maybe different from the average, but nothing that sets you apart from others in regards to getting vaccinated, and certainly nothing they haven't seen before.

 

[F1fan]

Some hospitals are allowing medical professionals that can show they’ve tested positive for covid exempt from vaccination due to natural immunity. Based upon new research that is led to believe that natural immunity is very effective, while they are still uncertain how long this lasts or when and if it will wane. So the waning period still is uncertain.

That makes sense, it will be an ongoing study.

But since I've had both the vaccine and Covid as a vaccinated person, I'm glad I was vaccinated because it was a nasty experience being sick with Covid. As an athlete I'm still having problems breathing. This is why I was intent to avoid being exposed. I attended a friend's wedding and her anti-vax uncle had Covid and infected over 60 of us. It is not just the flu, as some claim. The uncle has been having a difficult time recovering himself.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

You said they aren't experts in your situation. Your situation is nothing special or unique. Maybe different from the average, but nothing that sets you apart from others in regards to getting vaccinated, and certainly nothing they haven't seen before.

I'm still confused. I make no excuses. I will not vaccinate. Just it makes sense that a person would talk with Their expert if they "feel they need" to healthy or not.

Your doctor dialogue is too simplistic for a regular doc appt (in the US). A good doctor wouldn't just "encourage" if you came there for reasons concerning your health and healthcare decisions. They'll have a full discussion.

 

[F1fan]

Yes, and most of these people view themselves as "progressives", "liberals", "socialists", etc. who would argue passionately that healthcare is a basic human right, people have a right to a job, etc. I would laugh about it if these people weren't threatening to destroy my life, or wishing for it to be destroyed.

Not when the issue is a lack of beds available due TO so many unvaxxed leaving no room in the inn. Blame the tribe of the unvaxxed for killing themselves by requiring more hospital beds that are available for them. Plus the overwhelming demand on healthcare professionals means they are burning out and quitting. Sounds like karma to me.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Not when the issue is a lack of beds available due TO so many unvaxxed leaving no room in the inn. Blame the tribe of the unvaxxed for killing themselves by requiring more hospital beds that are available for them. Plus the overwhelming demand on healthcare professionals means they are burning out and quitting. Sounds like karma to me.

Karma? What does karma have to do anything? I haven't gotten one of those vaccines and I'm not sick at all, and never was. I can't even recall the last time I've had any sort of virus. Why should I be punished for anything?

And who cares about hospital beds when there's not going to be much hospital staff with these mandates.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

@Shadow Wolf

IF CDC/WHO/NHS told me to take a medication because it works, I'd say no. It's not that they aren't experts-they are just not experts in "my" situation.

CDC expert isn't my doctor. That's my point.

 

[F1fan]

Karma? What does karma have to do anything? I haven't gotten one of those vaccines and I'm not sick at all, and never was. I can't even recall the last time I've had any sort of virus. Why should I be punished for anything?

Well protect yourself and avoid being in public except when you have to. There are many unvaxxed people who are exposed to Covid and then have huge regrets about.

And who cares about hospital beds when there's not going to be much hospital staff with these mandates.

It could be you if you catch Covid and have to get hospital care.