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Is Abortion a Religious or Political Position?

Clara Tea

Well-Known Member
Nonsense.

If you have a secular law that gives people special treatment on the basis of religions' tenets, then secular courts will have to rule on:

- what is and isn't a genuine religion
- what is and isn't a genuine tenet of a given religion

... since those questions form the basis of what secular rights and privileges the person is entitled to.

‘Golf Religion’ From Japan Stymied in U.S. (Published 1975)

The Japanese church of golf was ruled not to be a religion (so not tax exempt).
 

Clara Tea

Well-Known Member
Question. People can go to confession if they harm or murder others as long as they have a repent and not do it again.

Since abortion is a one time thing, how would someone be excommunicated but then forgiven by god for murder?

In your view or others familiar with catholic doctrine.

Atonement means that they won't do it again and were sorry that they did it in the first place.

Forgiveness is a fundamental of God. Almost all have been forgiven in the past.

The only sin that God will not forgive is the attack on Iraq. The Christian soldiers who attacked Iraq will go to hell, and there is no way out. This is because it is a very grave sin...the most grave in the entire span of mankind's existence. Revelation lays out the punishments for the war in Iraq (for example, Revelation 15 (seven plagues, including COVID)).
 

Kelly of the Phoenix

Well-Known Member
But now that you didn't make responsible choices to begin with, I would expect you to be responsible enough to carry the child to term and offer it up for adoption and not take away its choice.
A being biologically incapable of having a choice has no choice. I wonder if you ever told schools that you are the decision maker for your child’s health. If you believe you can do what you want with a five year old, why can’t your will supersede a zygote that doesn’t have a brain?
 

Clara Tea

Well-Known Member
Ok, but legally. As per the link in the OP, this is not being accepted as a religious position to exempt one from getting the vaccination. Although it seems a fairly gray area.

There are non-religious arguments against vaccines, too. The process of using lipid nano-particles is very new. The FDA gave EUA (Emergency Use Authorization) originally, because the vaccine was not rigorously tested. There were reports of enlarged hearts from vaccines in teens. The general public is not sure if the experts are right about messenger RNA in mitochondria not affecting DNA or RNA in offspring. Mitochondrial DNA is not in the nucleus of cells.

Many websites have banned discussions of vaccines (against free speech) because it could discourage use of vaccines during a global pandemic (emergencies seem to take precedence over normal freedoms). Politicians shouldn't force vaccines, they should use charisma and facts to sway the public.
 

Clara Tea

Well-Known Member
A being biologically incapable of having a choice has no choice. I wonder if you ever told schools that you are the decision maker for your child’s health. If you believe you can do what you want with a five year old, why can’t your will supersede a zygote that doesn’t have a brain?

Five year olds can't be endangered.
 

Aupmanyav

Be your own guru
"Is Abortion a Religious or Political Position?":
Abortion should not be made into a religious or political position, it is a situation which the society has to deal with proper laws from the side of the government. Countries can take the Indian Abortion Laws as the template.
Abortion in India - Wikipedia
 

Terrywoodenpic

Oldest Heretic
The stance on abortion depends to a large extent on the individual country more than the majority religion.
In the UK the law pays little or no regard to religious views.
nor does parliament in establishing those laws.
The right to abortion is firmly established. Even do it yourself morning after pills are now freely available with out prescription.

Only in Northern Ireland where both the Catholics and Protestants have an anti abortion majority has it been a major issue.
However, even there the UK government has stepped in and confirmed the legality of Abortion during the period that there was no government in place in Stormont.
Abortion is available in Europe under human rights laws, despite some countries objections and obstructions.
 

9-10ths_Penguin

1/10 Subway Stalinist
Premium Member
‘Golf Religion’ From Japan Stymied in U.S. (Published 1975)

The Japanese church of golf was ruled not to be a religion (so not tax exempt).
The case I always think of is this one:

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/gay-teen-wins-fight-over-catholic-prom-1.348831

A student at a Catholic school tried to take a same-sex date to his school prom; the school refused. Did the school act illegally?

- they had a religious exemption for issues related to the tenets of the Catholic faith.
- apart from those exemptions, they were prohibited from discrimination on the basis of sex, gender, or sexual orientation.

... so the case ended up hinging on the question of whether there were any tenets of the Catholic faith that would prohibit taking a same-sex date to a school prom.

The secular court ruled that there weren't, and that the school broke the law.
 

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
Atonement means that they won't do it again and were sorry that they did it in the first place.

Forgiveness is a fundamental of God. Almost all have been forgiven in the past.

The only sin that God will not forgive is the attack on Iraq. The Christian soldiers who attacked Iraq will go to hell, and there is no way out. This is because it is a very grave sin...the most grave in the entire span of mankind's existence. Revelation lays out the punishments for the war in Iraq (for example, Revelation 15 (seven plagues, including COVID)).

Why can't the terrorists of Iraq ask god for forgiveness?

Wouldn't that mean one couldnt go to the priest for Any sin?

If Christ died for all why would some sins be excluded no matter how horrify they are?
 

Terrywoodenpic

Oldest Heretic
Why can't the terrorists of Iraq ask god for forgiveness?

Wouldn't that mean one couldnt go to the priest for Any sin?

If Christ died for all why would some sins be excluded no matter how horrify they are?

Contrary to what a church may say clearly God has the power to forgive any sin.
Some writings in the Bible suggest all sins are not equal and some are what the Catholic church designates as mortal. That is as it may be, but it is not in the churches power to do the judging, that is for God alone.
 

metis

aged ecumenical anthropologist
Some writings in the Bible suggest all sins are not equal and some are what the Catholic church designates as mortal.
But in Catholicism, even a "mortal sin" may be forgiven.

BTW, we more tend to use the words "serious sin" than "mortal sin" nowadays, but some habits die s-l-o-w-l-y.
 

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
Contrary to what a church may say clearly God has the power to forgive any sin.
Some writings in the Bible suggest all sins are not equal and some are what the Catholic church designates as mortal. That is as it may be, but it is not in the churches power to do the judging, that is for God alone.

Its the same question and reasoning. Why are some sins forgiven by god and others are not?
 

Heyo

Veteran Member
Why can't the terrorists of Iraq ask god for forgiveness?

Wouldn't that mean one couldnt go to the priest for Any sin?

If Christ died for all why would some sins be excluded no matter how horrify they are?
According to the RCC any sin can be forgiven except one: not paying tithes.
 

Fool

ALL in all
Premium Member
Sussman-VaccinePregnancy.jpg

Just heard over the radio that religious exemptions will be accepted for vaccination.

So one lady wrote that they used fetal stem cells in testing the Covid 19 vaccine. Therefore since she is against abortion because of her religious beliefs, she is requesting an exemption for being vaccinated.

Is anti-abortion a fundamental religious belief?

Boston College is facing a wave of Catholic parents and students “disgusted” by religious exemptions being denied over a link to aborted fetal tissue used to test the efficacy of coronavirus vaccines.
Boston College faces fury over vaccine exemptions denied over coronavirus abortion link
there is the fix. abortion by religious exemption
 

Terrywoodenpic

Oldest Heretic
Its the same question and reasoning. Why are some sins forgiven by god and others are not?

I am not convinced he is interested in personal sins at all, and neither forgives nor punishes.
I suggest he would find the whole subject extremely petty.

And that he is more likely to judge man on the care he has taken of this world.
 
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