Your Suffering

[TransmutingSoul]

Yes, her breast cancer is said to have been caused by her constant worries
The cancer she died from was liver cancer that had spread from her breast cancer to the liver

I see this is confirmed in many scriptures, have you found verses in the Quran in support?

Here are a couple of Baha'i Writings that confirm mental aptitude is an aid

Bahá’u’lláh says:—
"Verily the most necessary thing is contentment under all circumstances; by this one is preserved from morbid conditions and lassitude. Yield not to grief and sorrow: they cause the greatest misery. Jealousy consumeth the body and anger doth burn the liver: avoid these two as you would a lion". (Tablet to a Physician)

And ‘Abdu’l-Bahá says:—

“Joy gives us wings. In times of joy our strength is more vital, our intellect keener. … But when sadness visits us our strength leaves us.”

‘Abdu’l-Bahá writes of another form of mental healing :—

"that it results from the entire concentration of the mind of a strong person upon a sick person, when the latter expects with all his concentrated faith that a cure will be effected from the spiritual power of the strong person, to such an extent that there will be a cordial connection between the strong person and the invalid. The strong person makes every effort to cure the sick patient, and the sick patient is then sure of receiving a cure. From the effect of these mental impressions an excitement of the nerves is produced, and this impression and this excitement of the nerves will become the cause of the recovery of the sick person. (Some Answered Questions, p. 294.)

I see It would be good for you to share some Muslim thoughts on healing.

All the best, regards Tony

 

[Spirit of Light]

I see this is confirmed in many scriptures, have you found verses in the Quran in support?

Here are a couple of Baha'i Writings that confirm mental aptitude is an aid

Bahá’u’lláh says:—
"Verily the most necessary thing is contentment under all circumstances; by this one is preserved from morbid conditions and lassitude. Yield not to grief and sorrow: they cause the greatest misery. Jealousy consumeth the body and anger doth burn the liver: avoid these two as you would a lion". (Tablet to a Physician)

And ‘Abdu’l-Bahá says:—

“Joy gives us wings. In times of joy our strength is more vital, our intellect keener. … But when sadness visits us our strength leaves us.”

‘Abdu’l-Bahá writes of another form of mental healing :—

"that it results from the entire concentration of the mind of a strong person upon a sick person, when the latter expects with all his concentrated faith that a cure will be effected from the spiritual power of the strong person, to such an extent that there will be a cordial connection between the strong person and the invalid. The strong person makes every effort to cure the sick patient, and the sick patient is then sure of receiving a cure. From the effect of these mental impressions an excitement of the nerves is produced, and this impression and this excitement of the nerves will become the cause of the recovery of the sick person. (Some Answered Questions, p. 294.)

I see It would be good for you to share some Muslim thoughts on healing.

All the best, regards Tony

Sufism speak about having a pure heart that lead to good health and virtue
A very good book on sufi healing is this one.
So yes how we think and or worries about something clearly do lead to good health or very bad health and sickness.

Text from the link

They are magicians and mystics, messengers and wonder workers, saints and healers in the name and on behalf of God. They draw on a tradition that goes back thousands of years. Their motivation of healing is their vocation and comes deep from the heart. Because with their healing methods, they prefer to work secretly, voluntarily and without payment, not to be named or to be honored. Their motto is: „For every illness there’s a remedy“. Here they do not only use physical remedies, but also mental and emotional ones. Faith is first and foremost the basis and condition for a healing process. The cultivation of certain virtues like thankfulness, forgiveness, beneficence, etc. is also helpful. In the prayer and healing circles of the Sufis, one can feel the deep power of word and prayer. In order to stay or to become healthy, the Sufis use special healing food and oils. They know the secrets of the magic of words and numbers and create special formulas and amulets for healing purposes. They also attach great importance to fasting, they cultivate music, dance, and humor. The Sufi art of healing must only be considered holistically; its nature is versatile and rich.

SUFI HEALING: including miraculous thoughts, prayers and meditations for protection and healing - Kindle edition by d'Albert, Yan. Health, Fitness & Dieting Kindle eBooks @ Amazon.com.

 

[Trailblazer]

It is all about our own frame of reference, how we choose to see suffering. We see it as bad, or we can see it as good, after all you are correct, it is God given.

It becomes our choice to blame, or thank God for the bounty of suffering. It depends on what we see the purpose of life is.

How people think and feel about suffering is not a choice but you can believe it is a choice if you want to.
The purpose of life is not to suffer and suffering 'necessary' to fulfill one's purpose in life. That is not even a Baha'i teaching, it is cherry-picking the Writings to suit your personal beliefs. Moreover, people who are suffering constantly cannot do much to fulfill their purpose in life, for obvious logical reasons. (Please note that this is not about me, it is about suffering in general.)

“Joy gives us wings! In times of joy our strength is more vital, our intellect keener, and our understanding less clouded. We seem better able to cope with the world and to find our sphere of usefulness. But when sadness visits us we become weak, our strength leaves us, our comprehension is dim and our intelligence veiled. The actualities of life seem to elude our grasp, the eyes of our spirits fail to discover the sacred mysteries, and we become even as dead beings.” ‘Abdu’l-Bahá, Paris Talks, pp. 109-110

Not everyone is a Baha'i who believes that suffering is a bounty from God. Those are just your beliefs.
Not everyone can choose to see suffering as good, but you could never understand that unless you were in their shoes.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Not everyone is a Baha'i who believes that suffering is a bounty from God. Those are just your beliefs.

Yes they have that choice, it is but part of this world, not the next, Susan.

"However afflictive your sufferings may be, stay ye undisturbed, and with perfect confidence in the abounding grace of God, brave ye the tempest of tribulations and fiery ordeals.

‘Abdu’l-Bahá, Selections from the Writings of ‘Abdu’l-Bahá, p. 73

" If we suffer it is the outcome of material things, and all the trials and troubles come from this world of illusion."

‘Abdu’l-Bahá, Paris Talks, p. 109

Suffering is thus an Illusion, temporary and how we see that is part of life, is indeed faith.

Regards Tony

 

[CBM]

Before I answer, I want to differentiate between evil and suffering and point out that anything I’m going to say is regarding suffering and not evil.

Everything is attributable to God, including suffering.
It is Jewish tradition that before a soul comes to earth, he sees his life as it will be and agrees to enter his/her body with full knowledge of the suffering it is set to endure.

I tend to see suffering as a form of alchemy.
It has the capacity to bring our potential greatness into reality, helping us evolve spiritually thereby bringing us closer to God.
Obviously the question is - can’t we do that without suffering?
I believe some times we can, but it’s up to us. When we don’t, it will sometimes prompt a wake up call.
And sometimes we can’t. Our soul simply must go through the suffering for reasons way beyond our understanding.
I believe reincarnation holds the key to many of these questions.

I also believe that turning to God as His child and trusting that He wants what’s best for us and that he can alleviate our suffering is sometimes the key to personal redemption.

Prayer (whether in its typical form or not) propels us to a higher level, refining our soul the way additional suffering might, and therefore making the suffering no longer necessary.

But of course it doesn’t always work that way.
Because we cannot understand everything at all, I don’t think any hard and fast answers can be given.

When we see others suffering it’s a call for us to help others. (It’s never appropriate to pass judgment.)

Perhaps if we would be given complete clarity to truly understand suffering and it’s purpose, we would be passive observers instead of actively working to make the world a better place.

 

[Trailblazer]

Yes they have that choice, it is but part of this world, not the next, Susan.

"However afflictive your sufferings may be, stay ye undisturbed, and with perfect confidence in the abounding grace of God, brave ye the tempest of tribulations and fiery ordeals.

‘Abdu’l-Bahá, Selections from the Writings of ‘Abdu’l-Bahá, p. 73

" If we suffer it is the outcome of material things, and all the trials and troubles come from this world of illusion."

‘Abdu’l-Bahá, Paris Talks, p. 109

Suffering is thus an Illusion, temporary and how we see that is part of life, is indeed faith.

Regards Tony

Who are you to say that other people have a choice? How do you know that? Only God is all-knowing.

a) Not everyone is a Baha'i.
b) Not everyone is able to make the same choices 'you believe' they should make.
c) You have a personal opinion which is based solely upon your 'certain' Baha'i beliefs.
d) You cherry-pick the Writings in order to support your platform.

Not everyone has the same capacity, Baha'u'llah wrote that. Our individual capacities are prescribed by God.

“And now, concerning thy question regarding the creation of man. Know thou that all men have been created in the nature made by God, the Guardian, the Self-Subsisting. Unto each one hath been prescribed a pre-ordained measure, as decreed in God’s mighty and guarded Tablets. All that which ye potentially possess can, however, be manifested only as a result of your own volition. Your own acts testify to this truth.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 149

Regarding free will, I am able to think for myself and have my own opinions. I don't need to use the Baha'i Writings to back up everything I think and believe.

I do not believe we are free to think or do anything we want to, but I believe that we can make certain choices based upon our desires and preferences. Our desires and preferences come from a combination of factors such as childhood upbringing, heredity, education, adult experiences, and present life circumstances. We cannot do everything we might want to do because we either don't have the ability or the capacity.

 

[blü 2]

Why do you suffer?

"Suffering" isn't a category I use for my own experiences. Into each life some rain must fall &c but that's built into being alive.

 

[McCallister]

Why do you suffer?

Who is responsible for your suffering when you do suffer?

Who has the ability to end your suffering?

I’m pretty sure it’s me that causes it. That and adhd and I don’t think I’m like as neuro typical as some people.

 

[robocop (actually)]

Why do you suffer?

Who is responsible for your suffering when you do suffer?

Who has the ability to end your suffering?

I suffer when I need and lack the ability to make the world right.

 

[Truthseeker]

How people think and feel about suffering is not a choice but you can believe it is a choice if you want to.
The purpose of life is not to suffer and suffering 'necessary' to fulfill one's purpose in life. That is not even a Baha'i teaching, it is cherry-picking the Writings to suit your personal beliefs. Moreover, people who are suffering constantly cannot do much to fulfill their purpose in life, for obvious logical reasons. (Please note that this is not about me, it is about suffering in general.)

“Joy gives us wings! In times of joy our strength is more vital, our intellect keener, and our understanding less clouded. We seem better able to cope with the world and to find our sphere of usefulness. But when sadness visits us we become weak, our strength leaves us, our comprehension is dim and our intelligence veiled. The actualities of life seem to elude our grasp, the eyes of our spirits fail to discover the sacred mysteries, and we become even as dead beings.” ‘Abdu’l-Bahá, Paris Talks, pp. 109-110

Not everyone is a Baha'i who believes that suffering is a bounty from God. Those are just your beliefs.
Not everyone can choose to see suffering as good, but you could never understand that unless you were in their shoes.

View attachment 53839

I like the picture with the quote.

 

[Jainarayan]

Why do you suffer?

Who is responsible for your suffering when you do suffer?

Who has the ability to end your suffering?

1. Attachment, thinking this is real.
2. Me.
3. Me.

 

[Meow Mix]

Why do you suffer?

Who is responsible for your suffering when you do suffer?

Who has the ability to end your suffering?

"I am moved by fancies that are curled
Around these images, and cling:
The notion of some infinitely gentle
Infinitely suffering thing.

Wipe your hand across your mouth, and laugh;
The worlds revolve like ancient women
Gathering fuel in vacant lots."

(T.S. Eliot -- Preludes)

I have suffered, but do I fortunately don't suffer a lot these days; even despite a major disability. But I suspect that's not what you're asking, so I will answer the question that I think is being asked: why do we suffer?

Because I think the universe is amoral, and humans are creatures that have evolved at the bottom of the gravity well of a G2V main sequence star in a relatively metal-rich area of the Milky Way. I don't think the universe was made for us, but rather we have adapted through natural (and then cultural, and then technological) means to the universe. As our powers are limited, this isn't going to be perfect; so we will suffer.

Sometimes people are responsible for suffering, sometimes it is a brute fact of the universe.

So the worst part of all of this in my worldview is that there is no cavalry that will save us, no monumentally powerful being that will swoop in and end the suffering.

But the best part is that it's up to us, and we can do a lot when we put our minds to it. While being on our own can be frightening, it can be encouraging if we find the strength.

 

[Trailblazer]

I don't think the universe was made for us, but rather we have adapted through natural (and then cultural, and then technological) means to the universe. As our powers are limited, this isn't going to be perfect; so we will suffer.

I believe this world was made for humans, by a God that doesn't give a twit about human or animal suffering.
Sure, we can mitigate some of the suffering but not all of it, so we are left to wonder why an allegedly loving God created such a world. Oh, I know the religious apologetic, suffering makes you stronger and more spiritual, but you can take that where the sun don't shine even if it is true for some people sometimes. I cannot help but think about before they became stronger and people who don't get stronger. The religionists can spare me the religious mantra that it is people's own fault they don't benefit from suffering because I am not in the mood to hear their garbage right now.

 

[Trailblazer]

1. Attachment, thinking this is real.
2. Me.
3. Me.

Why do you blame yourself for everything? I feel really bad for you.

But you just inspired me to start a new thread, maybe tomorrow.

 

[Meow Mix]

I believe this world was made for humans, by a God that doesn't give a twit about human or animal suffering.
Sure, we can mitigate some of the suffering but not all of it, so we are left to wonder why an allegedly loving God created such a world. Oh, I know the religious apologetic, suffering makes you stronger and more spiritual, but you can take that where the sun don't shine even if it is true for some people sometimes. I cannot help but think about before they became stronger and people who don't get stronger. The religionists can spare me the religious mantra that it is people's own fault they don't benefit from suffering because I am not in the mood to hear their garbage right now.

A while back I was really into transhumanism, and one of the terms that I keep from that fad was abolitionism: the idea that humans have the strength (and, for those with the values, the moral impetus) to abolish as much suffering as possible. I think this is a noble goal.

 

[Trailblazer]

A while back I was really into transhumanism, and one of the terms that I keep from that fad was abolitionism: the idea that humans have the strength (and, for those with the values, the moral impetus) to abolish as much suffering as possible. I think this is a noble goal.

That is the goal of the Baha'i Faith, what we have been enjoined to so. I believe suffering will be greatly mitigated in the future.

 

[Meow Mix]

That is the goal of the Baha'i Faith, what we have been enjoined to so. I believe suffering will be greatly mitigated in the future.

I am happy to call Baha'i people allies in this endeavor ^.^

 

[Regiomontanus]

Why do you suffer?

Who is responsible for your suffering when you do suffer?

Who has the ability to end your suffering?

I suffer through the anguish I feel when I see environmental destruction and suffering wildlife. The planet is in crisis. I identify strongly with Isaac the Syrian:


"What is a merciful heart? It is a heart on fire for the whole of creation, for humanity, for the birds, for the animals, for demons, and for all that exists. By the recollection of them the eyes of a merciful person pour forth tears in abundance. By the strong and vehement mercy that grips such a person’s heart, and by such great compassion, the heart is humbled and one cannot bear to hear or to see any injury or slight sorrow in any in creation. For this reason, such a person offers up tearful prayer continually even for irrational beasts, for the enemies of the truth, and for those who harm her or him, that they be protected and receive mercy. And in like manner such a person prays for the family of reptiles because of the great compassion that burns without measure in a heart that is in the likeness of God"

Spiritual quotes of Saint Isaac the Syrian


We are squandering Creation.

 

[Trailblazer]

I am happy to call Baha'i people allies in this endeavor ^.^

And we need all the allies we can get.

 

[SalixIncendium]

Why do you blame yourself for everything? I feel really bad for you.

But you just inspired me to start a new thread, maybe tomorrow.

Why do you assume @Jainarayan was blaming anyone?

Blaming requires judgment. I see no judgments in the post you quoted.