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What’s up with God? Is He really sending us tests?

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
This is primarily for believers in the Abrahamic God: Jews, Christians, Muslims and Baha’is, but anyone else can jump in if they want to.

What’s up with God? Is He really after us, sending us tests and difficulties (as Baha’is refer to them) in order to teach us lessons and help us grow stronger? If that is true, how am I supposed to love a God who causes me suffering constantly? I would not love a husband who beat me constantly. I would leave him. The problem is I cannot escape God.

For years I have been hearing the Baha’is telling me tests are for my own benefit and I should be thankful to God for the tests because they help me grow stronger and make me more spiritual. Of course they don’t know any of that, they just believe it, but they probably wouldn’t believe it if they had walked a mile in my moccasins for as many years as I have been walking the same mile over and over again.

Or maybe there are other Baha’is who are able to rise to the occasion, endure many tests and thank God for them, remaining happy. The problem with that is if they are happy despite their tests they are not really suffering are they? I guess they never thought of that. The hidden but not so hidden message is that if you can endure the tests and still be happy you will not suffer. The problem is that is overly simplistic because not all tests are of the same magnitude and all humans are not the same in their capacity to endure them, so to say we should all be able to endure them and still be happy is judgmental to say the least.

Or maybe God is not “sending” is tests, maybe this is just life. Nevertheless if God is responsible for our fate then He is not off the hook because He has a hand in everything that happens to us, unless it was caused by a choice we made for which we are responsible, since we have free will to choose.

Much of the time I do not want to keep living in this material realm of existence because I know there is something much better in the spiritual world. If something bad is not presently happening, it is just around the corner, so I am always waiting for the other shoe to drop, and unless something changes, it won’t be long before it drops. Doesn’t God believe in giving people a break?

It is very difficult to believe that God is loving and benevolent given all the suffering I see in the world. This is my struggle, to understand God and why people (not just me) have to suffer so much if God is loving and benevolent. I want to believe that God is loving and benevolent but I cannot just believe that because it is written in the Bible, the Qur’an and the Writings of Baha’u’llah. I need more than that. I need evidence.
 

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
This is primarily for believers in the Abrahamic God: Jews, Christians, Muslims and Baha’is, but anyone else can jump in if they want to.

What’s up with God? Is He really after us, sending us tests and difficulties (as Baha’is refer to them) in order to teach us lessons and help us grow stronger? If that is true, how am I supposed to love a God who causes me suffering constantly? I would not love a husband who beat me constantly. I would leave him. The problem is I cannot escape God.

For years I have been hearing the Baha’is telling me tests are for my own benefit and I should be thankful to God for the tests because they help me grow stronger and make me more spiritual. Of course they don’t know any of that, they just believe it, but they probably wouldn’t believe it if they had walked a mile in my moccasins for as many years as I have been walking the same mile over and over again.

Or maybe there are other Baha’is who are able to rise to the occasion, endure many tests and thank God for them, remaining happy. The problem with that is if they are happy despite their tests they are not really suffering are they? I guess they never thought of that. The hidden but not so hidden message is that if you can endure the tests and still be happy you will not suffer. The problem is that is overly simplistic because not all tests are of the same magnitude and all humans are not the same in their capacity to endure them, so to say we should all be able to endure them and still be happy is judgmental to say the least.

Or maybe God is not “sending” is tests, maybe this is just life. Nevertheless if God is responsible for our fate then He is not off the hook because He has a hand in everything that happens to us, unless it was caused by a choice we made for which we are responsible, since we have free will to choose.

Much of the time I do not want to keep living in this material realm of existence because I know there is something much better in the spiritual world. If something bad is not presently happening, it is just around the corner, so I am always waiting for the other shoe to drop, and unless something changes, it won’t be long before it drops. Doesn’t God believe in giving people a break?

It is very difficult to believe that God is loving and benevolent given all the suffering I see in the world. This is my struggle, to understand God and why people (not just me) have to suffer so much if God is loving and benevolent. I want to believe that God is loving and benevolent but I cannot just believe that because it is written in the Bible, the Qur’an and the Writings of Baha’u’llah. I need more than that. I need evidence.
Rather, it is Satan who challenged Job ( Job 2:4-5 ) and by way of extension Satan challenges (tests) us.
'Touch our 'flesh'..... ( loose physical health ) and we would Not serve God.
Both faithful Job and Jesus under adverse conditions proved Satan a liar and so can we.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Rather, it is Satan who challenged Job ( Job 2:4-5 ) and by way of extension Satan challenges (tests) us.
'Touch our 'flesh'..... ( loose physical health ) and we would Not serve God.
Both faithful Job and Jesus under adverse conditions proved Satan a liar and so can we.
I do not believe there is such a being called Satan. Rather I believe that Satan as referred to in the Bible is symbolic for our selfish material nature. This lower nature in man is symbolized as Satan—the evil ego within us, not an evil personality outside. In a sense it is our selfish material nature tests us so that is what was testing Job. That is also what was testing Jesus in these verses:

Matthew 16:23-26 But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men. Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me. For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it. For what is a man profited, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul?

The way I interpret those verses is that Jesus was not talking to a real entity called Satan, because I do not believe there is any such entity. Rather, Jesus was saying to Peter that the things that are not of God but are rather of men (selfish desires) are offensive to Him. Then Jesus tells His disciples to deny their selfish desires and to follow in His Way.because whoever lives for their selfish desires will lose his eternal life, but whoever sacrifices his life for the sake of Jesus and God will gain eternal life. It is the soul that gets eternal life, not the body.

Jesus was saying to deny our selfish desires, things we want that are not of God, and to follow in His Way.
If we live for self and the worldly things we gain the world but we lose our soul in the sense that we lose eternal life. Eternal life refers to a “quality” of life, nearness to God, which according to Jesus comes from believing in Him.

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

But this is a separate matter from what I was talking about in my OP. I believe we are tested by God, but I am not so sure if God is sending us the tests or if that is just part and parcel of living in this material world. Either way, God is responsible for these tests since God created the material world.
 

Kenny

Face to face with my Father
Premium Member
What’s up with God? Is He really after us, sending us tests and difficulties (as Baha’is refer to them) in order to teach us lessons and help us grow stronger? If that is true, how am I supposed to love a God who causes me suffering constantly? I would not love a husband who beat me constantly. I would leave him. The problem is I cannot escape God.

If I understand "tests" as being sending suffering constantly or a husband beating a wife constantly I would say that God didn't send it. (As a Christian)

Or maybe God is not “sending” is tests, maybe this is just life. Nevertheless if God is responsible for our fate then He is not off the hook because He has a hand in everything that happens to us, unless it was caused by a choice we made for which we are responsible, since we have free will to choose.

I don't think God is responsible for our fate either. In my scriptures it basically says that God gave control of the earth to man with choice. I believe it is mostly our choices that bring suffering--although I do believe there are evil spirits too that prompt people.

It is very difficult to believe that God is loving and benevolent given all the suffering I see in the world. This is my struggle, to understand God and why people (not just me) have to suffer so much if God is loving and benevolent. I want to believe that God is loving and benevolent but I cannot just believe that because it is written in the Bible, the Qur’an and the Writings of Baha’u’llah. I need more than that. I need evidence.

So, in our Kingdom living understanding, God gave all the tools back to mankind (power and authority) to help overcome the evil and difficulties when, out of love, Jesus died on the cross and then was risen from the dead.

But we still have choice and we still have do implement the tools He gave us.
 

stvdv

Veteran Member: I Share (not Debate) my POV
What’s up with God? Is He really after us, sending us tests and difficulties
I rather call them challenges, opportunities, but yes, that is what seems to be a thingy for God

Sai Baba said "test is my taste", He loved to put us to the test

Understandable, if you see life as a spiritual school

Any school has exams/tests, God-school too
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
If I understand "tests" as being sending suffering constantly or a husband beating a wife constantly I would say that God didn't send it. (As a Christian)
Then where do you think tests and difficulties come from, or do you think there is no such thing?
I don't think God is responsible for our fate either. In my scriptures it basically says that God gave control of the earth to man with choice. I believe it is mostly our choices that bring suffering--although I do believe there are evil spirits too that prompt people.
I believe we have free will so I believe that some of our suffering is the result of the choices we make, but there are certain things to which man is forced and compelled, such as death, sickness, loss of a job, accidents and injuries and other misfortunes; these are not subject to the will of man, nor are things that happen to us because the choices of other people. Man is not responsible for these things but he is compelled to endure them because God created the world this way.
So, in our Kingdom living understanding, God gave all the tools back to mankind (power and authority) to help overcome the evil and difficulties when, out of love, Jesus died on the cross and then was risen from the dead.
But we still have choice and we still have do implement the tools He gave us.
Implementing the tools covers the suffering that is brought about as the result of our moral choices but it does not cover any of the suffering that is not the result of our moral choices.
 

1213

Well-Known Member
...It is very difficult to believe that God is loving and benevolent given all the suffering I see in the world. This is my struggle, to understand God and why people (not just me) have to suffer so much if God is loving and benevolent. ...

I believe the reason for suffering is that people rejected God and therefore were expelled to this first death. Here we can learn what evil truly means. Luckily this is only a short lesson and those who are righteous, can go back to life. Also, in Biblical point of view this is like Matrix, through a body we can experience things while soul is in safe and can’t be destroyed by anything of this world.

And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.
Matt. 10:28

That is why I don’t see evil as a problem, just something we have to experience, because people wanted to know evil. I think it was loving thing from God to allow us to have this lesson, all though it can be painful.
 

Spirit of Light

Be who ever you want
This is primarily for believers in the Abrahamic God: Jews, Christians, Muslims and Baha’is, but anyone else can jump in if they want to.

What’s up with God? Is He really after us, sending us tests and difficulties (as Baha’is refer to them) in order to teach us lessons and help us grow stronger? If that is true, how am I supposed to love a God who causes me suffering constantly? I would not love a husband who beat me constantly. I would leave him. The problem is I cannot escape God.

For years I have been hearing the Baha’is telling me tests are for my own benefit and I should be thankful to God for the tests because they help me grow stronger and make me more spiritual. Of course they don’t know any of that, they just believe it, but they probably wouldn’t believe it if they had walked a mile in my moccasins for as many years as I have been walking the same mile over and over again.

Or maybe there are other Baha’is who are able to rise to the occasion, endure many tests and thank God for them, remaining happy. The problem with that is if they are happy despite their tests they are not really suffering are they? I guess they never thought of that. The hidden but not so hidden message is that if you can endure the tests and still be happy you will not suffer. The problem is that is overly simplistic because not all tests are of the same magnitude and all humans are not the same in their capacity to endure them, so to say we should all be able to endure them and still be happy is judgmental to say the least.

Or maybe God is not “sending” is tests, maybe this is just life. Nevertheless if God is responsible for our fate then He is not off the hook because He has a hand in everything that happens to us, unless it was caused by a choice we made for which we are responsible, since we have free will to choose.

Much of the time I do not want to keep living in this material realm of existence because I know there is something much better in the spiritual world. If something bad is not presently happening, it is just around the corner, so I am always waiting for the other shoe to drop, and unless something changes, it won’t be long before it drops. Doesn’t God believe in giving people a break?

It is very difficult to believe that God is loving and benevolent given all the suffering I see in the world. This is my struggle, to understand God and why people (not just me) have to suffer so much if God is loving and benevolent. I want to believe that God is loving and benevolent but I cannot just believe that because it is written in the Bible, the Qur’an and the Writings of Baha’u’llah. I need more than that. I need evidence.
May it be that some of the suffering we as human beings does not come from God, but from other human beings or even our own ego? When you feel the suffering, do you sometimes ask your self. What cased me to feel this suffering now? And looking back either the same say or in to your past, was it something that happend, or something someone said that made you feel suffering?

When it comes to God sending tests, Yes i do be live he does. but never bigger tests than you will be able to push trhough it at some point. Then the question arise, why do we humans experience the same test or suffering over and over again? May it be that the test was ment for you to understand you was on a wrong track and need to find a new approach to what you doing? Was it something in the past you did, thought or said that made this suffering arise? (in asia they would probably call it a form of karmic reaction)
 

night912

Well-Known Member
What's up with God? I don't know, some say that Jesus is up there with him along with human souls. Others say that God is the only thing up there until the day of rapture.

Just wanted to lighten the mood so that some people are not too moody. :D
 

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
I do not believe there is such a being called Satan. Rather I believe that Satan as referred to in the Bible is symbolic for our selfish material nature. This lower nature in man is symbolized as Satan—the evil ego within us, not an evil personality outside. In a sense it is our selfish material nature tests us so that is what was testing Job. That is also what was testing Jesus in these verses:
Matthew 16:23-26 But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men. Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me. For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it. For what is a man profited, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul?
The way I interpret those verses is that Jesus was not talking to a real entity called Satan, because I do not believe there is any such entity. Rather, Jesus was saying to Peter that the things that are not of God but are rather of men (selfish desires) are offensive to Him. Then Jesus tells His disciples to deny their selfish desires and to follow in His Way.because whoever lives for their selfish desires will lose his eternal life, but whoever sacrifices his life for the sake of Jesus and God will gain eternal life. It is the soul that gets eternal life, not the body.
Jesus was saying to deny our selfish desires, things we want that are not of God, and to follow in His Way.
If we live for self and the worldly things we gain the world but we lose our soul in the sense that we lose eternal life. Eternal life refers to a “quality” of life, nearness to God, which according to Jesus comes from believing in Him.
But this is a separate matter from what I was talking about in my OP. I believe we are tested by God, but I am not so sure if God is sending us the tests or if that is just part and parcel of living in this material world. Either way, God is responsible for these tests since God created the material world.

You're Not alone in thinking Satan is Not a being or spirit person.
However, remember Satan is Not his name but a 'title' given to him. We don't know his name.
So, the ' get behind me, Satan...' said to Peter was that Peter was 'resisting' what must take place.
* Satan means: Resister
* Devil means: Slanderer
* Serpent means: Deceiver
* Dragon means: Destroyer
ALL of the ^above^ fits the description of who is referred to as Satan the Devil.
 

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
I believe the reason for suffering is that people rejected God and therefore were expelled to this first death. Here we can learn what evil truly means. Luckily this is only a short lesson and those who are righteous, can go back to life. Also, in Biblical point of view this is like Matrix, through a body we can experience things while soul is in safe and can’t be destroyed by anything of this world.
And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.
Matt. 10:28.........................

I wonder why you say the soul can't be destroyed _____________
Matthew 10:28 B is clear: the soul can be destroyed.
Ezekiel 18:4,20 lets us know the soul that sins dies. ( No immortal soul / person )
However, Not destroyed in biblical hell because biblical hell is the temporary stone-cold grave.
KJV translated the word Gehenna into English as hell or as hell fire.
At Matthew 10:28 the English word translated as hell was from the word Gehenna.
Gehenna was just a garbage pit outside of Jerusalem where things were: destroyed.
So, it is No wonder that Psalms 92:7 and Psalms 104:35 says the wicked will be: destroyed forever.
We are offered to ' repent ' if we don't want to ' perish ' ( meaning be destroyed ) - 2 Peter 3:9
 

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
May it be that some of the suffering we as human beings does not come from God, but from other human beings or even our own ego? When you feel the suffering, do you sometimes ask your self. What cased me to feel this suffering now? And looking back either the same say or in to your past, was it something that happend, or something someone said that made you feel suffering?
When it comes to God sending tests, Yes i do be live he does. but never bigger tests than you will be able to push through it at some point.................................................

I find James 1:13 to be of interest because it informs us that God does Not cause or send bad things to happen.
Rather, if need be God is here to help us with needed strength to endure - Philippians 4:13
True, God does allow or permit things to happen - Hebrews 12:7-11
But permit or allow does Not mean God sends..........
It is Satan as the Tempter, but God can deliver us from the wicked one - Matthew 6:13
 

Spirit of Light

Be who ever you want
I find James 1:13 to be of interest because it informs us that God does Not cause or send bad things to happen.
Rather, if need be God is here to help us with needed strength to endure - Philippians 4:13
True, God does allow or permit things to happen - Hebrews 12:7-11
But permit or allow does Not mean God sends..........
It is Satan as the Tempter, but God can deliver us from the wicked one - Matthew 6:13
You could of course be correct in your thought here :) But i think that if a believer do as they have been described to do according to the teaching they follow, God or if you allow me to say Allah will bless the action, words or thoughts of the believer.
But if the believer stray away from what the teaching ask of us, then in my understanding we will experiece suffering of some kind. What i cant say for certain is if this suffering is directly from God or if it is in some other way put upon human beings,
 

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
You could of course be correct in your thought here :) But i think that if a believer do as they have been described to do according to the teaching they follow, God or if you allow me to say Allah will bless the action, words or thoughts of the believer.
But if the believer stray away from what the teaching ask of us, then in my understanding we will experience suffering of some kind. What i cant say for certain is if this suffering is directly from God or if it is in some other way put upon human beings,

I would say it's the ' some other way put upon human beings ' as found at Job 2:4-5.
Satan (Not God) challenged Job and by way of extension Satan challenges all of us.
' Touch our ' flesh'....' (meaning loose our physical health) and we would Not serve God under adverse conditions.
Both Job and Jesus under very bad conditions proved Satan a liar and so can we.
 

Spirit of Light

Be who ever you want
I would say it's the ' some other way put upon human beings ' as found at Job 2:4-5.
Satan (Not God) challenged Job and by way of extension Satan challenges all of us.
' Touch our ' flesh'....' (meaning loose our physical health) and we would Not serve God under adverse conditions.
Both Job and Jesus under very bad conditions proved Satan a liar and so can we.
Personally i see what you call Satan as human Ego, or nafs as it is called within sufism
 

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
Personally i see what you call Satan as human Ego, or nafs as it is called within sufism
To me, it is Not me calling Satan as a spirit person but Jesus who knew Satan as a spirit person, fallen angel.
In Scripture, Jesus was Not speaking to a human Ego, No human Ego could offer Jesus all earth's kingdoms or world governments to Jesus in exchange for an act of worship.
 

Spirit of Light

Be who ever you want
To me, it is Not me calling Satan as a spirit person but Jesus who knew Satan as a spirit person, fallen angel.
In Scripture, Jesus was Not speaking to a human Ego, No human Ego could offer Jesus all earth's kingdoms or world governments to Jesus in exchange for an act of worship.
Its ok to see this differently :) So i have nothing to say to contadict your belief
 

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
Its ok to see this differently :) So i have nothing to say to contadict your belief
I am here to say what I find to be what the Bible really teaches, or what we can learn from the Bible.
I find just as the Bible says: there are genuine 'wheat' Christians and fake 'weed/tares' Christians.
What I post I believe to be what first-century 'genuine' Christianity teaches.
Right now what is especially important to me is about the 'living'.
I think we are nearing a soon coming ' time of separation ' to take place on Earth - ( Matthew 25:31-33,37)
Those counted as 'righteous' ones will be able to continue to live on Earth, live to see calendar Day One of Jesus' coming 1,000-year governmental reign over Earth. This means there is coming ' healing ' for earth's nations - Revelation 22:2
This is why we are all invited to pray the invitation of Rev. 22:20 for Jesus to come !
Come and undo all the damage Satan and Adam brought upon us, upon mankind.
Isaiah 35th chapter gives us a beautiful paradisical word picture of what is coming to happen.
 
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