Truth: either God exists or He don't.

[Pilgrim Soldier]

Sorry, but this is a logical failure on your part.

And I need to remind you that you are the one that claims God is a liar. The early Christian geologists that refuted the flood knew that God was not a liar. That is why they knew there was no flood.

They know Jack ****, the truth is invisible. You can't show me and I can't show you and nobody can prove anything to anyone. We live in the age of relativism, where everything is subject to individual scrutiny and we all draw different conclusions about everything.
This brave new world that you applaud, has done away with truth and replaced it with anything goes and everything is equally valid

 

[ratiocinator]

Funny as hell, you've wasted many hours looking at the evidence and all you can do is slander. Why don't you tell us just one single thing you disagree with and why.

Well, what you posted in #963 is pretty typical. Namely, to pretend that scientists think we got to be they way we are entirely randomly. Some sites I've seen have even done calculations of probabilities based on that nonsense. It's a misrepresentation (straw man) argument. They can't deal with the real science so they make up a caricature and argue against that.

 

[Pilgrim Soldier]

No, you posted a video by liars and idiots. That is not evidence.

Try again.

Again, you have no evidence against them so the only thing left to do is slander

 

[Subduction Zone]

They know Jack ****, the truth is invisible. You can't show me and I can't show you and nobody can prove anything to anyone. We live in the age of relativism, where everything is subject to individual scrutiny and we all draw different conclusions about everything.
This brave new world that you applaud, has done away with truth and replaced it with anything goes and everything is equally valid

I could show you if you were willing to learn.

Let go of your fear, Luke.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Again, you have no evidence against them so the only thing left to do is slander

Nope, that is a falsehood on your part. I did not slander. But unfortunately you would need to learn to understand this. And right now you appear to be too afraid to learn.

 

[Pilgrim Soldier]

Well, what you posted in #963 is pretty typical. Namely, to pretend that scientists think we got to be they way we are entirely randomly. Some sites I've seen have even done calculations of probabilities based on that nonsense. It's a misrepresentation (straw man) argument. They can't deal with the real science so they make up a caricature and argue against that.

Doesn't science teach that you need to put water over heat to boil it. So even science teaches that something needs to cause something to go bang. But now you're saying that something did cause it but we just don't know what it was.
The absurd part is when they say that highly complex life just happened spontaneously without any intelligent being causing it to assemble in a highly complex and intelligent way. If you saw the odds of this you'd be shocked have a look at this if you have the courage to face it

 

[ratiocinator]

Again, you have no evidence against them so the only thing left to do is slander

Yet again: the video is from an organisation that requires their people to ignore the evidence: "By definition, no apparent, perceived or claimed evidence in any field, including history and chronology, can be valid if it contradicts the scriptural record." (AiG Statement of Faith) And I'm not going to waste another hour of my life looking at more of their BS - especially to argue with somebody who has obviously spent no time at all learning about real science and real evidence.

 

[Pilgrim Soldier]

I could show you if you were willing to learn.

Let go of your fear, Luke.

In other words, "abandon reason and let me take you on a magical mystery tour"

 

[Subduction Zone]

Doesn't science teach that you need to put water over heat to boil it. So even science teaches that something needs to cause something to go bang. But now you're saying that something did cause it but we just don't know what it was.
The absurd part is when they say that highly complex life just happened spontaneously without any intelligent being causing it to assemble in a highly complex and intelligent way. If you saw the odds of this you'd be shocked have a look at this if you have the courage to face it

From the sciences we learn that some events need a cause. We also learn that some do not. You have a very poor understanding of the sciences and jump to incorrect conclusions as a result.

 

[Pilgrim Soldier]

Yet again: the video is from an organisation that requires their people to ignore the evidence: "By definition, no apparent, perceived or claimed evidence in any field, including history and chronology, can be valid if it contradicts the scriptural record." (AiG Statement of Faith) And I'm not going to waste another hour of my life looking at more of their BS - especially to argue with somebody who has obviously spent no time at all learning about real science and real evidence.

You're saying you don't believe the evidence because it's not what you've been programmed to believe. In other words you can't break out of that vicious circular R thing

 

[Subduction Zone]

In other words, "abandon reason and let me take you on a magical mystery tour"

No, you are the one that believes in magic. your God magicked the world into existence in your beliefs.

I want you to learn how to test your ideas properly. You refuse to do so with your god beliefs.

I know, knowledge is scary.

 

[ratiocinator]

Doesn't science teach that you need to put water over heat to boil it. So even science teaches that something needs to cause something to go bang. But now you're saying that something did cause it but we just don't know what it was.

We've been over cosmology, haven't we? Haven't several people explained to you the different hypotheses? Why go back to this simplistic nonsense?

The absurd part is when they say that highly complex life just happened spontaneously without any intelligent being causing it to assemble in a highly complex and intelligent way. If you saw the odds of this you'd be shocked have a look at this if you have the courage to face it

I suggest you learn something about evolution by natural selection.

 

[Subduction Zone]

You're saying you don't believe the evidence because it's not what you've been programmed to believe. In other words you can't break out of that vicious circular R thing

No, it is simply not evidence.

Once again you are too afraid to even discuss the subject. When you post garbage like you just did we do not assume that you are a liar. You are merely very ignorant and afraid. You do not understand how those people are liars and are afraid to learn.

 

[Trailblazer]

How/why does the Mona Lisa serve as evidence of a painter? Why is an apple tree not evidence for the same painter who painted the Mona Lisa?

The Mona Lisa is evidence that there is a painter, but the apple tree is not evidence that there is a painter.
Creation is not evidence that there is a God because there is no proof that God is responsible for creation. Creation could have come into being by another means.

 

[ratiocinator]

You're saying you don't believe the evidence because it's not what you've been programmed to believe.

No. I'm saying that you know nothing about science and evidence and seem way, way too frightened to even let the simple facts you've been shown here sink in, and your source is from people who have agreed that no evidence must be allowed to override their blind faith.

It really is the height of hypocrisy to accuse others of not believing things because it's not what they've been "programmed to believe" or to ask people to spend time on your videos when you have obviously spent no time at all trying to understand what science really has to say, what evidence is, and how it has been used.

 

[Trailblazer]

Jesus is coming back in the clouds, just as He promised and you will see Him and bow down and worship Him and beg for mercy.
You're talking about His second coming, which will happen. Jesus didn't give us a specific date, so try again pal

Give it up for lost. Jesus never promised to return to earth, not once in the entire New Testament.
Not only that, but Jesus said He was NOT coming back to earth and His work was finished on earth.

John 14:19 Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also.

John 17:4 I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.

John 17:11 And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.

no more
phrase of more

1. 
   nothing further.
   "there was no more to be said about it"
2. 
   no further.
   "you must have some soup, but no more wine"
3. 
   exist no longer.
   "the patch of ground was overgrown and the hut was no more"
4. 
   never again.
   "mention his name no more to me"
5. 
   neither.
   "I had no complaints and no more did Tom"

Translate no more to
Definitions from Oxford Languages

 

[Subduction Zone]

@Pilgrim Soldier , my time is valuable. I refuse to watch videos by known idiots and liars. You would need to pay me to watch that video. And that ain't no minimum wage job. Or you could learn what is and what is not evidence and then we can go over that video together point by point.

It would take honesty and some fearlessness on your part to learn. Do you think that you can do it?

 

[Trailblazer]

and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.

Jesus did appear a second time, but not in the same body, and that is what Christians simply cannot accept....
but it is all in the New Testament.

John 14:19 Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also.

John 17:11 And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.

Jesus was a Comforter.

John 14:18 I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.

Jesus promised to send the the another Comforter who would bring the Holy Spirit, which was Baha'u'llah.

John 14:16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;

John 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.

 

[night912]

Sorry, I must have overlooked the possibility that the painting just appeared in a puff of smoke with nothing causing the puff of smoke. I need to get with this new "Scientifically Correct" thing

You must have overlooked my questions because you didn't answer them. So I'll ask again.

How/why does the Mona Lisa serve as evidence of a painter? Why is an apple tree not evidence for the same painter who painted the Mona Lisa?

 

[ratiocinator]

The absurd part is when they say that highly complex life just happened spontaneously without any intelligent being causing it to assemble in a highly complex and intelligent way. If you saw the odds of this you'd be shocked have a look at this if you have the courage to face it

Okay, so I wasted a bit of time skimming through some of this and it's just the same old creationist drivel - not in the least bit shocking or even mildly surprising. A mixture of nonsense, scientific illiteracy, and some genuine questions that positing a god wouldn't answer (except in a childish just-so story kind of way).

If you want to pick a particular a particular point and put it forward, I'll address it.

One thing you might want to contemplate: not matter how improbable you think this universe is (and however you think you can go about calculating that), that this universe just happens to exist for no known reason must be more probable than this universe existing and it being created by a being, who just happens to exist for no known reason, who wants to create a universe like this. This is simple probability.