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Truth: either God exists or He don't.

Audie

Veteran Member
How do you know it's a fact? If we can't trust our own minds then claiming that you know anything is nonsensical. Your argument is self-defeating.

Its not much of a fact considering this
" god" plus all of its behaviour, attitude,
is simply a fantasy.

Like the Aztec "gods" that required human blood. Where did they get that idea?

Probably from the same sort of "prophets"
that keep us supplied with garbage about
their " recelations" about all other religions.
 

ratiocinator

Lightly seared on the reality grill.
I have zero faint in secular science as they haven't produced any proof that any of their theories are actually true.

That one sentence indicates your comprehensive ignorance of the subject. There is no such thing as secular science, science is a secular discipline (it has no connection to religious or spiritual matters). Also science never proves anything - it builds models that match the available evidence and seeks to test them.

They keep changing their minds every single day of the week and they don't know if they're coming or going or which ways is up.

False. Science changes when new evidence is available that cannot be accounted for by the current models. This is far superior to blind, unthinking, unchangeable faith.

They can't answer my 5 year old nephews questions, let alone any intelligent adults...

False.
 

Audie

Veteran Member
What do you see when you look in the mirror and see that nose hanging off your face. I thought not, so let me help you with this one since all you have to offer is circular reasoning and nothing else.

That nose hanging off your face will testify against you on judgement day, it will say I hung off your face throughout your whole life but you denied me. you insulted me when you claimed that I was formed in some pond scum over billions of years.

What could be more reliable than something that's in your face and on your face at the same time. yet you reject it as if it doesn't exist as you don't have enough proof.

I have zero faint in secular science as they haven't produced any proof that any of their theories are actually true. They keep changing their minds every single day of the week and they don't know if they're coming or going or which ways is up. They can't answer my 5 year old nephews questions, let alone any intelligent adults, so with all due respect if any I choose to flush them down the toilet collectively.

No theory can ever be proven.
Science doesn't do "truth". Science
does probability. There isxno such
thing as secular science.
You're very no examples at all of theories changing as you say.
The theory of evolution, say, has stood very well
for likec 150 years.

Savaging a strawman.

What you don't belive is a chimera of your own creation, so you do well not to trust it.
Nobody would.
Or no, you trust that your ideas about science are correct?
I just listed several ways its obviously demonstrably wrong.
 

Polymath257

Think & Care
Staff member
Premium Member
It's perfectly normal for you to feel that way about God. Some of His ways may appear to be unfair from our point of view.
But we need to consider the fact that our understanding of God has been perverted by our sin nature, so what we have is totally depraved wicked sinners judging a perfectly good and righteous Go and there in lies the problem.

Or maybe we should just consider the possibility that no God exists at all.
 

Pilgrim Soldier

Active Member
I said: What is your evidence? How can you prove that Christ lives or that His Holy Spirit abides in all His children? How can you prove that others are blinded? You can certainly 'believe' that but how can you prove it?

All I did was ask what actual evidence you have. How do you know that I can't see spiritual things because God hasn't opened my spiritual eyes? How do you know that I am spiritually blind? You do not even know what I believe.

Do you believe that you are in God's elect? If so, how do you know that?
All I know and believe is what God said, I know God doesn't lie so that's how I know it's true. God said there are only two kinds of people, His children and the Devils children. He never mentioned any third group
 

Polymath257

Think & Care
Staff member
Premium Member
I'd rather not open a can of worms and get into a heated prolonged debate about this topic. all my past experiences with those who trust secular science have showed me that they are not interested in the truth of the matter but they prefer to push their agenda.

Maybe it's just that they disagree with you because they know the facts and reason their way to a different conclusion?

From what I have seen, scientists are *solely* interested in figuring out the truth of whatever they study. They devote long days trying to get the information and understanding how it fits into the puzzle. They are also poorly paid compared to others with an equivalent education and experience.

On the other hand, my experience is that those with religious faith are not inclined to actually look at the evidence and educate themselves about it. Instead, they prefer to adhere to their 'faith' and ignore the truth when it contradicts it. It is they that have the 'agenda', not the scientists.
 

Polymath257

Think & Care
Staff member
Premium Member
All I know and believe is what God said, I know God doesn't lie so that's how I know it's true. God said there are only two kinds of people, His children and the Devils children. He never mentioned any third group

It seems all you know is what someone *said* that God said. Whether that person was correct, lying, biased, or delusional doesn't seem to be investigated. Whether there even *is* a God to be speaking is unproved and doubtful in the extreme. yet you believe.

Why?
 

Pilgrim Soldier

Active Member
An omnipotent, omniscient creator would be the author of everything.
He created Angels and humans with a limited amount of autonomy. we chose to use this small amount of autonomy to rebel against Him and sin against Him. So the only thing you can accuse Him of is not making us as robots.
 

Audie

Veteran Member
It seems all you know is what someone *said* that God said. Whether that person was correct, lying, biased, or delusional doesn't seem to be investigated. Whether there even *is* a God to be speaking is unproved and doubtful in the extreme. yet you believe.

Why?

All the prophets for every other belief lied,
but somehow everyone picks the one true one.
 

Polymath257

Think & Care
Staff member
Premium Member
He created Angels and humans with a limited amount of autonomy. we chose to use this small amount of autonomy to rebel against Him and sin against Him. So the only thing you can accuse Him of is not making us as robots.

If he knew we would rebel when we created us and didn't want us to, then he was not omnipotent. If he didn't know, then he was not omniscient. If he knew and wanted us to rebel, then he authored evil.
 

Audie

Veteran Member
If he knew we would rebel when we created us and didn't want us to, then he was not omnipotent. If he didn't know, then he was not omniscient. If he knew and wanted us to rebel, then he authored evil.

He'd d be lucky if he could plead it down to
a charge of culpable negligence
 
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