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$908 billion coronavirus aid package gains momentum in Congress

Stevicus

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
$908 billion coronavirus aid bill draws conservative backing in U.S. Congress

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - A bipartisan, $908 billion coronavirus aid plan gained momentum in the U.S. Congress on Thursday as conservative lawmakers expressed their support and Senate and House of Representatives leaders huddled.

Looks like they might be able to reach a deal.

Still unclear, however, was how far beyond $500 billion in spending Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell would agree to after months of insisting that anything approaching $1 trillion was unnecessary.

McConnell was feeling pressure from even some fellow conservatives, who before the Nov. 3 elections were not eager to approve of Washington shoveling out money beyond the $3 trillion already enacted.

The deepening severity of the coronavirus pandemic, with diagnosed cases exploding and deaths in the United States topping 270,000, appeared to be giving Republicans second thoughts about their long opposition to a comprehensive aid bill.

More and more, said Senator Bill Cassidy, Republicans “recognize that things are getting worse. And that if the economy goes into a recession, it really gets worse.”

Even some of Trump's supporters are in favor of the bill.

Without quick action by Congress, more than 13 million people are due to lose their government-funded unemployment benefits on Dec. 26.

The U.S. Chamber of Commerce, which represents businesses across the United States, on Wednesday had warm words for the $908 billion bill.

Some of President Donald Trump’s biggest boosters on Thursday embraced the proposal.

Earlier on Thursday, Trump said he thought negotiators were “getting very close” to a deal, but he did not elaborate. And in another possible sign of progress, Democratic House of Representatives Speaker Nancy Pelosi and Republican Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell consulted with each other, according to Pelosi’s deputy chief of staff.

“It’s been heartening to see a few hopeful signs in the past few days” toward a deal, McConnell said of Democrats’ stance on a new aid bill. He did not provide details.
 

sun rise

The world is on fire
Premium Member
That would be nice. But Mitch is throwing shade on it saying Trump won't sign which is totally not surprising. I don't believe him. I just think he's reveling in being Mr. NO NO NO NO.

I hope I'm wrong
 

Stevicus

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
That would be nice. But Mitch is throwing shade on it saying Trump won't sign which is totally not surprising. I don't believe him. I just think he's reveling in being Mr. NO NO NO NO.

I hope I'm wrong

Well maybe he'll be visited by three ghosts and then wake up Christmas morning totally transformed. The people of Whoville may even invite him to carve the roast beast.
 

Audie

Veteran Member
Maybe some day people will wonder if a crippling national
debt was the best way to fight it.
 

fantome profane

Anti-Woke = Anti-Justice
Premium Member
Maybe some day people will wonder if a crippling national
debt was the best way to fight it.

Well you know no one wants to do any drastic, like wear a face mask, keep some distance, and wash your hands. So instead they get hundreds of thousands of dead and crippling debt.
 

Left Coast

This Is Water
Staff member
Premium Member
Maybe some day people will wonder if a crippling national
debt was the best way to fight it.

Do we seem crippled by it? There is more than one school of thought on the usefulness or harmfulness of national debt. Government spending that puts more money in regular people's pockets is economically stimulative.
 

Left Coast

This Is Water
Staff member
Premium Member
@Audie, taxes help us pay for things. I don't think anyone believes debt should be infinite. Government needs revenue. However, that doesn't mean debt = bad, which is the right-wing economic frame that most people have absorbed.
 

Audie

Veteran Member
Do we seem crippled by it? There is more than one school of thought on the usefulness or harmfulness of national debt. Government spending that puts more money in regular people's pockets is economically stimulative.

As credit card debt goes up it may well seem as if its a good deal, free money. It catches up though, sooner or later.

If national debt is a good idea, why have any limit, why even have taxes?

Hoe much does the USA waste, send overseas
Just servicing the current debt?

Its yiu guys country, do as yiu like, but it looks. Ray to me.
 

Left Coast

This Is Water
Staff member
Premium Member
As credit card debt goes up it may well seem as if its a good deal, free money. It catches up though, sooner or later.

If national debt is a good idea, why have any limit, why even have taxes?

Hoe much does the USA waste, send overseas
Just servicing the current debt?

Its yiu guys country, do as yiu like, but it looks. Ray to me.

Countries are not like people. National debt cannot be compared 1:1 with personal debt. That said, even personal debt is not all bad. Debt is extremely useful. It enabled me to go to graduate school. It enables us to make large purchases that we don't have all the up front cash to pay for all at once.

On a national level, we print our own money. When a government literally creates its own currency, the economic logic changes. I'm not an expert in this field by any stretch, but here's some additional reading:

A very detailed walkthrough of Modern Monetary Theory, the big new left economic idea
 

Audie

Veteran Member
@Audie, taxes help us pay for things. I don't think anyone believes debt should be infinite. Government needs revenue. However, that doesn't mean debt = bad, which is the right-wing economic frame that most people have absorbed.

Debt equals bad equals conservative/ most people is just silly

I did delete the "infinite " post, poor wording.

But when do you stop? It can't just keep going up.

Politicians though find it unsafe to call for more austerity and more taxes so it just goes up and up. Then what?
 

Left Coast

This Is Water
Staff member
Premium Member
Debt equals bad equals conservative/ most people is just silly

I agree, it is silly. Yet conservatives keep talking as though debt is an inherently bad thing. Not when tax cuts for the rich increase the debt though, of course. That's good for the economy, you see!

But when do you stop? It can't just keep going up.

I don't know. Economists probably have formulas to calculate that sort of thing. There is almost certainly no one magic number. There are many variables at play.
 

Audie

Veteran Member
Countries are not like people. National debt cannot be compared 1:1 with personal debt. That said, even personal debt is not all bad. Debt is extremely useful. It enabled me to go to graduate school. It enables us to make large purchases that we don't have all the up front cash to pay for all at once.

On a national level, we print our own money. When a government literally creates its own currency, the economic logic changes. I'm not an expert in this field by any stretch, but here's some additional reading:

A very detailed walkthrough of Modern Monetary Theory, the big new left economic idea
Come on, I deal with debt all the time.
I know its uses and I know individuals are not governments.

Its not useful to find a flaw in an analogy, all are flawed, it just serves to distract from the sense in it.

Ever increasing debt will bankrupt anyone, individual, corporation or country.

Printing more and more mone money is a good trick until it isn't.

Throwing trillions at the germ may not have been the brightest way to fight the germ.

That was my entire point.
If you feel it was, fine.
 

Audie

Veteran Member
I agree, it is silly. Yet conservatives keep talking as though debt is an inherently bad thing. Not when tax cuts for the rich increase the debt though, of course. That's good for the economy, you see!



I don't know. Economists probably have formulas to calculate that sort of thing. There is almost certainly no one magic number. There are many variables at play.

Now you are just being snarky.

"An inherently bad thing". Really. Quote?
A quote that is actually representative?
 

Left Coast

This Is Water
Staff member
Premium Member
Come on, I deal with debt all the time.
I know its uses and I know individuals are not governments.

Its not useful to find a flaw in an analogy, all are flawed, it just serves to distract from the sense in it.

Ever increasing debt will bankrupt anyone, individual, corporation or country.

Printing more and more mone money is a good trick until it isn't.

Throwing trillions at the germ may not have been the brightest way to fight the germ.

That was my entire point.
If you feel it was, fine.

How should we fight the germ? How should we help people who can't pay their rent or mortgage because they're out of work?
 

Left Coast

This Is Water
Staff member
Premium Member
Now you are just being snarky.

"An inherently bad thing". Really. Quote?
A quote that is actually representative?

Your own post. You called our national debt "crippling." As though the fact we are in debt is somehow...inherently bad.

It pervades conservative thought when the debt comes up. It's the whole logic behind things like zero balance budgeting.
 

Audie

Veteran Member
Your own post. You called our national debt "crippling." As though the fact we are in debt is somehow...inherently bad.

It pervades conservative thought when the debt comes up. It's the whole logic behind things like zero balance budgeting.

As long as you include " imho" for lo,
' tis all that is.
 
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