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I think God will understand

stvdv

Veteran Member: I Share (not Debate) my POV
God question :)
I don't know really.. what if it is just a demon? or my own mind? How do I know if its really Jesus?.. Hm.. Difficult to answer
Aha, you don't have self confidence

I trust my eyes and my conscience. If Jesus comes to my house, and I can shake his hands, so I know He is no hallucination. And then I have a talk with Him, of course asking Him the tough questions about life, and the tricky ones that all cheats fail immediately, and I have quite a few of those, then within a few minutes I would know if He is the real deal or not.

1 simple question would be: Grant me a Divine experience here and now, so that I know for sure that you are not an imposter. An imposter can never grant you this. Only an Avatar, a real Master has the power to do this. That is an easy way to determine if someone is for real or not. The real Jesus is a Master who could easily grant you this.
 

amorphous_constellation

Well-Known Member
In the world many people worship more than one God. I think God do not care so much about that. Why? Because when people worship many gods they give thanks to the gods. So God may the thinking " They thought many gods have made this world, and gave thanks to the gods for it. That means they understood a source/sources was behind this world and worshiped it. So in reality they worshiped me but believed I was many gods. They was wrong about me, but they gave thanks to me for their life and worshiped me in their own way"

And im believe strongly that a humans heart and actions is so more important than religious belief. Its more likely a kind atheist go to heaven then a bad theist. Since all humans is God's child, God like that we are kind with each other. He/she do not like that her/his children being hurt.

But i don't know. I just write what I believe. Only God knows.

PS: I'm sorry i wrote wrong.

Now i have fixed it :)

I don't have a problem with this view at all, but I have to point out that in the macro cultural-social context, I would consider this as a sort of transitional view, indicative of a journey out of Christianity on a societal level. Jesus said that 'no one gets to the father, except through me,' and the early church didn't like it when early believers wore sunstones or mjolniers alongside crosses.
 

Deeje

Avid Bible Student
Premium Member
Matthew 15:26

Jesus never preached to the Gentiles. It was Paul who did the most to spread it among Gentiles, after having his "vision" (he never met Jesus).
Jesus wasn't sent to the gentiles...he was sent exclusively to the Jews because of God's promise to make them into "a royal priesthood and a holy nation". In honor of his promise to Abraham, he had to give the Jews first opportunity and so all of the first Christians were Jewish. After that God invited the gentiles into his family of worshippers. It was actually Peter who baptized the first gentile convert (Cornelius) along with his entire family. This was the first time that a gentile could come to God without first converting to Judaism.

Jesus apparently was a racist himself, as he referred to Gentiles as "dogs".

Jesus spent most of his earthly life with Jewish people. But when he was approached by a Phoenician woman, (a Gentile) who begged him to cure her daughter, Jesus said: “I was not sent forth to any but to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.” Yet, the woman pleaded: “Lord, help me!” At that, he added: “It is not good to take the children's bread, and to cast to the little dogs.”(YLT)

To the Jews, dogs were unclean animals so they were not kept as pets. So by alluding to Gentiles as “little dogs,” was Jesus showing prejudice? No, for he had just mentioned his special commission from God to care for ‘the lost sheep of Israel.’ Moreover, by likening non-Jews to “little dogs,” not wild dogs, Jesus softened the comparison. Of course, what he said tested the woman. Humbly, she was determined to overcome this objection, and tactfully replied: "`Yes, sir, for even the little dogs do eat of the crumbs that are falling from their lords' table” (YLT) Impressed with the woman’s faith, Jesus healed her daughter immediately.

In this instance Jesus was not addressing a Jewish person, but referring to the keeping of dogs in gentile society as pets for children. The "little dogs" (puppies) would often be fed at the table by their young masters.

342

A child with a puppy, Greek or Roman statuette (first century B.C.E. to the second century C.E.)
 

Deeje

Avid Bible Student
Premium Member
But if the soul can't be killed how can God kill the soul?

Matthew 10:28...
"And do not become fearful of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul; rather, fear him who can destroy both soul and body in Ge·henʹna."

"Gehenna" is translated "hell" in most Bibles, but that is not the meaning of the word.
Gehenna was a reference to Jerusalem's garbage dump outside the city's walls, where the carcasses of dead animals and the bodies of executed criminals were often thrown for disposal. The fires were kept burning day and night to consume the refuse. Those who did not have a decent burial place were considered unworthy of a resurrection. So because the dead are not in a conscious state, God will raised both the righteous and the unrighteous dead through the hand of his son and King of his kingdom, (John 5:28-29) but the wicked will not be given life again, so they will go to that same place where the devil and his angels are eternally eliminated. (gehenna)

Body and soul are "destroyed" in this place.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
But if the soul can't be killed how can God kill the soul? And if you mean God does not kill the soul.. what did you mean with "He might kill you"? Kill you in what way?
According to my beliefs, the soul is who we are, our mind and emotions, so if God killed our soul that would be the end of our existence. But that is not the case as the soul is immortal so it cannot die. Souls who are near to God gain eternal life. Nearness to God was through belief in Jesus and that is why Jesus said:

John 11:25-26 Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life. He who believes in Me, though he may die, he shall live. And whoever lives and believes in Me shall never die. Do you believe this?”

John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.

1 John 5:13 I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God that you may know that you have eternal life.

John 5:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.


All souls continue to exist in the spiritual world after the body dies but not all souls have eternal life (everlasting life). Eternal life refers to a “quality” of life, nearness to God which, according to Jesus, came from believing in Him.
 

Neuropteron

Active Member
In the world many people worship more than one God. I think God do not care so much about that.
Only God knows.


Hi,
Well Meandflower, we don't have to guess, because He told us exactly what His opinion is on following different God's and Religions.

Cheers.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Hi,
Well Meandflower, we don't have to guess, because He told us exactly what His opinion is on following different God's and Religions.

Cheers.
Problem is, the Bible is not the only Word of God, and God told us something else about following other religions in other scriptures.
 

TransmutingSoul

Veteran Member
Premium Member
But if the soul can't be killed how can God kill the soul? And if you mean God does not kill the soul.. what did you mean with "He might kill you"? Kill you in what way?

It is a state of being. Nearness to God is life, remoteness to God is death.

Trailblazer posted a reply that covers the topic well.

I see no soul dies, but we get to choose the state of awareness we will have as a spiritual being. We can be like a rock or like eagles.

It is a big topic and much has been given on this subject now.

Regards Tony
 
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Starlight

Spiritual but not religious, new age and omnist
I did not say that God does not care; maybe even more than any human ever could
I just said that God does not judge you; my faith is in Sanathana Dharma

But if you prefer a God that judges, then I am fine with that
I don't want you to give up or change your belief
As I fully support "Freedom of Religion"

But God created Karma. So karma is a form of punishment. Actions both good and bad have consequenses.

I agree. Freedom of religion is very important.
 

Clara Tea

Well-Known Member
The bible says that God is the one and only God, and there will be no other. This is one reason that I think that the trinity is not three versions of the same God. Rather, I think that Christ is a spirit that is the son of God. Jesus, of course, was the human vessel for the Christ spirit. However, God was Christ's father. It is ironic that God doesn't want humans coveting their neighbor's wives, he Joseph was cuckold (God had a baby with Mary, Joseph's wife).
 

SeekerOnThePath

On a mountain between Nietzsche and Islam
Yeah, I was totally offended by that part of the New Testament and what a jerk he was seemingly acting like, and how people try to present this false narrative of this really nice and loving guy, whereas the character described in the New Testament is totally acting like a huge jerk to almost everyone (I really dislike the character, even the Buddha is a big jerk in a lot of stories but people present a similar picture of Buddha as they do with Jesus, and totally ignore the actual described behaviors and statements), and if you're God or a God or whatever and can easily and effortlessly do some magical thing and help someone, why would you be such an annoying jerk about it and degrade people and put them down and make them beg or continue to beg when you can just easily heal them or help them in an instant or whatever, gosh!

I fully agree and it's great to see someone else who agrees on that, as I tire and get frustrated with people trying to present Jesus (in his NT depiction) as a very friendly, innocent, happy, cute, goody two-shoes.

In his NT depiction he's quite a condescending and racist jerk who doesn't even know how to quote the scriptures he supposedly recited in synagogues (or the authors of those four books were simply incompetent, who knows?).
Him being as such, causes Christians to often inhibit his traits while professing (their NT version of) Jesus to be the opposite.

Sure, there are some cool proverbs he said but that's few and far between.
 

stvdv

Veteran Member: I Share (not Debate) my POV
But God created Karma. So karma is a form of punishment. Actions both good and bad have consequenses.

I agree. Freedom of religion is very important.
There is a big difference IMHO:
a) Abrahamic Religions: Judging people and actions into good and bad ... not conform Jesus His Teaching "thou shall not judge"
b) Dharmic Religions: Action and reaction; no judgment needed, just consequences ... conform Jesus His Teachings "thou shall not judge"

IF there is a banana peel on the road and you step on it, you fall on the street and hurt yourself. This hurting is NOT God punishing you for making the wrong step. This is just you taking a step that resulted in falling down and hurting yourself.

IF you stand on top of the Tour Eiffel and you don't believe in Force of Gravity and jump you fall hard and probably die. This is NOT God punishing you for jumping. God did create Force of Gravity, so indirect God killed you. But if you think this way, you twist the things IMO.

I am fine if you want to judge into good and bad. My goal is to not do that. Genesis teaches "do not eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and Evil", I clearly got His message already here. This obviously tells me to not judge. Because people did not get it, Jesus repeats it later again. Eve did not pay heed to this and even seduced Adam. I do not let women seduce me to eat from the tree of knowledge of Good and Evil;)
@stvdvRF
 
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SeekerOnThePath

On a mountain between Nietzsche and Islam
Matthew 15:26

Jesus never preached to the Gentiles. It was Paul who did the most to spread it among Gentiles, after having his "vision" (he never met Jesus).

Yep, Paul sees Jesus in a vision then goes on a drunken joy-ride around Europe before going back to Jerusalem :tearsofjoy:



Although I do like entertaining a unique form of the mythicist position (even though I'm not one) which entails Jesus being a non-historical symbol, the concept of Christ being for him (Paul) being representative of divinity, Paul being the main "prophet" of an extant 1st century post-Jewish mystical-apocalyptic sect which have all these visions about this "Christ" deity, of which the outcome is that Paul himself is God.
It's an interesting idea.
 

Starlight

Spiritual but not religious, new age and omnist
I fully agree and it's great to see someone else who agrees on that, as I tire and get frustrated with people trying to present Jesus (in his NT depiction) as a very friendly, innocent, happy, cute, goody two-shoes.

In his NT depiction he's quite a condescending and racist jerk who doesn't even know how to quote the scriptures he supposedly recited in synagogues (or the authors of those four books were simply incompetent, who knows?).
Him being as such, causes Christians to often inhibit his traits while professing (their NT version of) Jesus to be the opposite.

Sure, there are some cool proverbs he said but that's few and far between.

You are wrong. Jesus is frendly and loving in the new testament. Jesus spoke often in riddles, much of what he said had deep meanings. Read what I have wrote about what Jesus said in the new testament on page 3 in this tread.

There is a big difference IMHO:
a) Abrahamic Religions: Judging people and actions into good and bad ... not conform Jesus His Teaching "thou shall not judge"
b) Dharmic Religions: Action and reaction; no judgment needed, just consequences ... conform Jesus His Teachings "thou shall not judge"

IF there is a banana peel on the road and you step on it, you fall on the street and hurt yourself. This hurting is NOT God punishing you for making the wrong step. This is just you taking a step that resulted in falling down and hurting yourself.

IF you stand on top of the Tour Eiffel and you don't believe in Force of Gravity and jump you fall hard and probably die. This is NOT God punishing you for jumping. God did create Force of Gravity, so indirect God killed you. But if you think this way, you twist the things IMO.

I am fine if you want to judge into good and bad. My goal is to not do that. Genesis teaches "do not eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and Evil", I clearly got His message already here. This obviously tells me to not judge. Because people did not get it, Jesus repeats it later again. Eve did not pay heed to this and even seduced Adam. I do not let women seduce me to eat from the tree of Good and Evil;)
@stvdvRF
Satan said "do eat of the tree of the knowlege of good and evil". Satan is not a being you should listen to. You maybe believe no being is evil, but Satan, regardless if he is evil or just arrogant/lost thouch with himself is a being who is blinded by his own selfish egosticism and bad desires
 
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The bible says that God is the one and only God, and there will be no other. This is one reason that I think that the trinity is not three versions of the same God. Rather, I think that Christ is a spirit that is the son of God. Jesus, of course, was the human vessel for the Christ spirit. However, God was Christ's father. It is ironic that God doesn't want humans coveting their neighbor's wives, he Joseph was cuckold (God had a baby with Mary, Joseph's wife).
Your beliefs may be similar to these:
Arianism - Wikipedia
 

Saint Frankenstein

Wanderer From Afar
Premium Member
Jesus wasn't sent to the gentiles...he was sent exclusively to the Jews because of God's promise to make them into "a royal priesthood and a holy nation". In honor of his promise to Abraham, he had to give the Jews first opportunity and so all of the first Christians were Jewish. After that God invited the gentiles into his family of worshippers. It was actually Peter who baptized the first gentile convert (Cornelius) along with his entire family. This was the first time that a gentile could come to God without first converting to Judaism.



Jesus spent most of his earthly life with Jewish people. But when he was approached by a Phoenician woman, (a Gentile) who begged him to cure her daughter, Jesus said: “I was not sent forth to any but to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.” Yet, the woman pleaded: “Lord, help me!” At that, he added: “It is not good to take the children's bread, and to cast to the little dogs.”(YLT)

To the Jews, dogs were unclean animals so they were not kept as pets. So by alluding to Gentiles as “little dogs,” was Jesus showing prejudice? No, for he had just mentioned his special commission from God to care for ‘the lost sheep of Israel.’ Moreover, by likening non-Jews to “little dogs,” not wild dogs, Jesus softened the comparison. Of course, what he said tested the woman. Humbly, she was determined to overcome this objection, and tactfully replied: "`Yes, sir, for even the little dogs do eat of the crumbs that are falling from their lords' table” (YLT) Impressed with the woman’s faith, Jesus healed her daughter immediately.

In this instance Jesus was not addressing a Jewish person, but referring to the keeping of dogs in gentile society as pets for children. The "little dogs" (puppies) would often be fed at the table by their young masters.

342

A child with a puppy, Greek or Roman statuette (first century B.C.E. to the second century C.E.)
I'm sorry but lmao. I'm certainly not buying that silliness. Gentiles are pet dogs to be fed scraps under the table? You tried to deny the racism of Jesus' words by coming up with a racist explanation!
 

Starlight

Spiritual but not religious, new age and omnist
Matthew 10:28...
"And do not become fearful of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul; rather, fear him who can destroy both soul and body in Ge·henʹna."

"Gehenna" is translated "hell" in most Bibles, but that is not the meaning of the word.
Gehenna was a reference to Jerusalem's garbage dump outside the city's walls, where the carcasses of dead animals and the bodies of executed criminals were often thrown for disposal. The fires were kept burning day and night to consume the refuse. Those who did not have a decent burial place were considered unworthy of a resurrection. So because the dead are not in a conscious state, God will raised both the righteous and the unrighteous dead through the hand of his son and King of his kingdom, (John 5:28-29) but the wicked will not be given life again, so they will go to that same place where the devil and his angels are eternally eliminated. (gehenna)

Body and soul are "destroyed" in this place.

Who do you believe get saved? Only JW's or other people also? What about good and kind people?
 

Starlight

Spiritual but not religious, new age and omnist
There is a big difference IMHO:
a) Abrahamic Religions: Judging people and actions into good and bad ... not conform Jesus His Teaching "thou shall not judge"

b) Dharmic Religions: Action and reaction; no judgment needed, just consequences ... conform Jesus His Teachings "thou shall not judge"

IF there is a banana peel on the road and you step on it, you fall on the street and hurt yourself. This hurting is NOT God punishing you for making the wrong step. This is just you taking a step that resulted in falling down and hurting yourself.

IF you stand on top of the Tour Eiffel and you don't believe in Force of Gravity and jump you fall hard and probably die. This is NOT God punishing you for jumping. God did create Force of Gravity, so indirect God killed you. But if you think this way, you twist the things IMO.

I am fine if you want to judge into good and bad. My goal is to not do that. Genesis teaches "do not eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and Evil", I clearly got His message already here. This obviously tells me to not judge. Because people did not get it, Jesus repeats it later again. Eve did not pay heed to this and even seduced Adam. I do not let women seduce me to eat from the tree of Good and Evil;)
@stvdvRF

That is not true. It is very many believers in dharmic religions who believe Karma is about reward and punishments. And remember God made the this world and the laws in it. That is not to twist things.
 
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