PureX
Veteran Member
No one ever HAD TO believe what they were taught. No one.
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Teacher Beheaded near Paris
- Thread starter Polymath257
- Start date
WikiIslam is an Islam bashing site with a lot of bs on it. That is not a reputable source.
Hellbound Serpiente
Active Member
Altfish
Veteran Member
Aren't The Ten Commandments in the Old Testament?
Hellbound Serpiente
Active Member
Heh. I remember back when I was a Muslim [about 6-7 years ago, I think], I refuted most of the WikiIslam AND Britain First's lies in just few sitting without even doing any homework.
Seriously, guys, intrawebz is full of lies and deception, and hypocrites with their own agendas.
Please make a critical assessment of your sources. I make assessment even about sites that discusses things I hate in negative ways. Let's not get swayed by such deceivers.
Like the Greek Olympian gods. They had no problems punishing those who pissed them off themselves. They were quite creative with their punishments. Lol.
Indeed. Any site that promotes the "Allah is a moon god" crap needs to go in the garbage with the rest of the trash.
I can't imagine for any reason being able to justify beheading someone.
You are taking this person away from people who care for them and/or depend on them.
The ego of the person who can justify this action to themselves has to be really dark.
Hellbound Serpiente
Active Member
Indeed, a blatant lie while Qur'an EXPLICITLY instructs this:
Quran 41:37: Do not prostrate to the sun or to the moon, but prostrate to Allah, who created them.
TagliatelliMonster
Veteran Member
Except that in day to day life in the real word in the present day, it's the "original instructions" that have absolutely no bearing to what actually happens today.
It doesn't actually matter what the "original intent" was. What matters is how it is lived, practiced and implemented TODAY.
We can argue all day long that blasphemers, apostates or gay people aren't to be killed according to the "original" instructions. Meanwhile, the actual killings continue as a direct result of the religious beliefs of the killers.
That would indeed be absurd.
The difference is, off course, that a theory of biology and a religion like islam are nothing alike.
The theory of biology merely explains biological facts and doesn't give any instructions on how to organize a society or how to treat people. Religion does.
Science is not to be accepted without questioning. Religion is.
In science, question is actively encouraged.
In religion, it is the opposite.
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Tell that to the believers...
Yeah they are... and? What’s your point?
Sawing someone's head off with a dull knife is not the traditional method of execution by beheading anywhere. It was done using an extremely sharp (well, it was supposed to be) sword or a heavy axe in a quick strike. It was viewed as an honorable way to die. These modern jihadists are just trying to torture and scare people. They do not follow the Islamic laws of warfare. There is a long tradition of Muslim warriors (think Saladin) and these loons have nothing to do with that. You're not supposed to kill civilians, or women or children. This is dishonorable, at least.
Shadow Wolf
Certified People sTabber
It doesn't happen without the original instructions from the text. They've been fighting against the West for so long that many of them it has been their entire life. I would say that is grounds for justifying combat as self-defense. The same for sectarian conflicts in the area. Just as they can turn to their passages to justify executing blasphemers and apostates and further that those who don't agree are the ones guilty of corrupting and twisting the faith. "Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you" has a great deal of wiggle room for interpretive differences and major discrepancies.
Christians do it to each other all the time. We know this as a "no true Scots" informal fallacy. But there is no way to settle the issue. We have Muslims who are peace and excellent people. The same goes for Christians. But we also have Muslims and Christians who are radicals, who are dangerous, and who pose varying degrees of threats and dangers to those who believe differently. They are all inspired by their holy text, all reading the same passages. We can't separate this.
It's not like when Elizabeth Forster-Nietzsche took an unfinished manuscript of illness-fueled ramblings from her brother Friedrich and heavily twisted them into something else to present to the Nazi Party. It's not even like the "Social Darwinism" that frequently gets tied to Darwin, and, as the tired argument goes, means Darwin influenced the Nazis. Social Darwinism did, and that itself a crappy idea wrapped in a layer of dung, where we find this idea of "survival of the fittest." That idea is basically the antithesis of what Darwin did speculate about social animals and the emergence of morality. Herbert Spencer was an economists who started this, who took what Darwin scientifically wrote about biodiversity and the emergence of it and how it was driven by natural selection and applied it to a non-scientific field, in a non-scientific way, and regardless did promote it as science. There is no Social Darwinism without his works.
There is still a Bible that commands its adherents to kill those who worship other gods. That's straight from the primary source. Not someone writing about how they interpret it, not an "add on" collection of dubious nature, it's not even a holy man with an agenda. It's straight from the horses mouth, as they say.
Wow!
Yes, I was just thinking this. It is not so much the religion as the religious leaders who teach this garbage. Maybe they use the Koran and Muhammad as props, but it's the people teaching this is God will who need to be found out and condemned.
We can condemn the act but someone filled their head with this. I don't think we can justify freedom of religion where this is being taught.
TagliatelliMonster
Veteran Member
You're missing the point.
Beliefs inform actions.
He did what he did, because of what he believes religious. Just like the millions of other jihadists.
Just like with the witch burnings back in the day by christians.
I agree these people are deranged and delusional. Doesn't change what I said.
His beliefs drove him to this action.
I repeat my question: do you think he would have done this if he weren't a radical muslim?
I'll go ahead and assume that your answer is "no".
If the answer is "yes", then please explain. And perhaps give an example of a non-muslim beheading someone while screaming "allahu akbar" as punishment / revenge for "insulting" Mohamed .
TagliatelliMonster
Veteran Member
TagliatelliMonster
Veteran Member
These acts aren't committed in a vacuum. They don't occur out of thin air.
There are underlying motivations and reasons for it.
You can make up any excuse you want. It doesn't change the facts.
The radical islam these people follow, informs actions such as the one mentioned in the OP.
Shadow Wolf
Certified People sTabber
Exactly. I spend my childhood hating myself and gays and trans people, not because of what some fire and brimstone baptist pastor was saying, but because it was in the Bible. It's very clear that it considers homosexuality is a capital crime, "yes I know, for the Bible tells me so." Then you add the fire and brimstone baptist pastor and the teachings fester and metastasize.
(We also tend to forget many of the more unsavory ones, such as how Christianity too actually does instruct women to cover up, and it's OT that rebellious kids are to be killed).
These extremist ideas don't materialize out of a vacuum. They have a source. And that source is so very frequently and typically the religion itself.
TagliatelliMonster
Veteran Member
Sure. They don't have to believe anything.
But they do. And this is the result. I don't see the point in being in denial about that.